Angels 2008 Post Season Recap
Starting Howie Kendrick in the playoffs after he came back from injury so late in the season was, in hindsight, a mistake. THE mistake. He disappeared, was overmatched and the palpable failure magnified itself into grand defensive lapses that cost us almost dearly in game three and dearly in game four. To a lesser extent, Erick Aybar brought little to the team
We will never know what would have happened if we had started Sean Rodriguez and Brandon Wood in the playoffs. Maybe we would have pined for Aybar and Kendrick, but perhaps the warmed-up AAA-rookie duo would have done more than those two.
There are other what-ifs, but were the Angels to have had the simplest offensive production from EITHER of those two spots, the team would at least be looking at a deciding game five.
Barring that, the only other missing factor was the spark plug factor on which Scioscia offenses depend so heavily. So Figgins not getting on base in 3 out of 4 games was a kick to the balls of any chance the Angels had. Also note that the great game Figgins had with the glove was also the game where his bat showed up.
So it wasn’t Frankie, it wasn’t Reggie, it wasn’t Shields. It was Howie, the decision to play a rehabbing Howie over a number of options, an absent Figgy, a weak Aybar.
On August 13, Howie Kendrick pulled up lame on a hit with a bad hammy and a few innings later, Maicer Izturis dislocated his thumb. One player came back and was ineffective and one player’s platoon partner couldn’t handle the full-time role. Perhaps the fate of the season was decided then and there.
To whine a bit, a lot of calls went Boston’s way, their pitchers and batters were free to saunter about the mound and box and then blame west coast viewing audiences for 5 hour games, followed by quickened Rapuano strike zones making for the 6th inning starting 90 minutes after the first pitch. I thought for a minute about a headline that read: “Tim Welke = Tim Donaghy?” but no whining. I could bitch about the absurdly pro-Boston telecast, but Red Sox Nation is about to get served a plate of shit to eat when the whole nation roots for the underdog Tampa Rays and the Boston Beer Belly Fans wonder where all the lovable adoration of America went. Hint: We loved your dirty water when it quenched the underdog but it has acquired an entitlement stench beyond Steinbrenner proportions.
Everyone showed up except our middle infielders, the calls went Bitchston’s way, the media was all Franconastroka and we were STILL in every game against the aging World Champions. When Billy Beane says the playoffs are a crapshoot he is lauded as a statistical genius and Oakland fans bend over for biannual rebuilding projects. When Angel fans hear that the playoffs are a crapshoot they still recall the snake eyes roll in 2002 that paid off and everything pales. It is the price of success.
Paying that price is John Lackey, team leader, Angel icon and alone without run support in two games that were eminently winnable. As always, no matter how bright the future looks, you have to wonder how many more postseason chances even the best of them will get.
We'll have to wait until next year to find out.
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134 comments
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Comments
My internet went out
I had to race to a sports bar and then beg a guy to post a quick thanks for the season from his i-phone when the game was over just so everyone could have somewhere to commiserate. CRAZY frickin’ day.
by Rev Halofan on Oct 7, 2008 1:21 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
entire la area is going through shitty internet right now
im assuming you have time warner, was just on phone with them. apparently theyve been having probs all night. doesnt explain the other times were its just shitty…but i guess thats what you get when twc buys up all the companies in your area….shitty service with no other options
by linkbruin on Oct 7, 2008 1:43 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
maybe tbs tried to block it!
"Halos Heaven All Time Saves Record Holder Genius Prognasticator."
by vlad IS my man on Oct 7, 2008 7:49 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
agreed
howie kendrick looked overmatched out there.
Matt Kemp for president.
Adrian Wilson for vice.
by wongy on Oct 7, 2008 1:49 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I don't think Kendrick was a mistake
The problem was Izzy was out. So the choice was do you bring Howie in when he is not ready or a AAA guy.
If Izzy is not hurt, he bats second, Andy in RBI position, and we win the first round. No doubt in my mind.
Angel Pitching, Angel Defense - get past that.
by vladtheimpaler on Oct 7, 2008 1:49 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Curious?
If Howie wasn’t a mistake, then you are saying a AAA’er (Rodriguez or Wood) would have done worse??
Look at Howies numbers/stats and tell me how much worse any of our rookies could have realistically played??
Howie had a Horrific Series !!!
When I'm not at the stadium, I'd rather be watching my Halos back in Costa Rica!
by Dono Romantico on Oct 7, 2008 9:03 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
If I may jump in
I don’t think Kendrick was a mistake either when you factor in WHEN the decision was made. Sure, in hindsight I don’t think any of the other options would have performed worse, however the decision wasn’t made in hindsight.
by ViolaHalo on Oct 7, 2008 10:34 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
i really would have rather had the just played for a month AAA duo
More playing time equals better results, and howie was bad earlier in the year when he returned from injury. I know hindsight is always 20/20, but i would have really taken the AAA guys here and left the other ones for mayyyyybe pinch hitting.
by linkbruin on Oct 7, 2008 1:52 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
What About RF?
You said that the Middle IF failed to show up……Ummmm RF did NOT show up either.
RF – Rivera (1-8) and Matthew (0-5) Combined 1-13 That is a CRAP SHOOT!!!!!!!
Another What If……….
What If Scioscia listened to the Fans and what laangels.com pointed towards…..
Started Morales in RF (2-4, 2B)?
Put Kendry Morales at 1B, and move Sean Rodriguez to 3B......NOW LETS GO WIN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
by acuda27 on Oct 7, 2008 1:59 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Not to Mention the "D" in RF
Matthews over ran a Ball
Willits Diving attempt to Catch the Ball that could have cost us the game just on that play
Willits Rout to the Ball that Ended our Playoff Run
Those bad plays were right up there with HK47
Put Kendry Morales at 1B, and move Sean Rodriguez to 3B......NOW LETS GO WIN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
by acuda27 on Oct 7, 2008 2:10 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
The catch
I will never fault someone for making that type of effort, especially when he plays in the same outfield as Garrett Anderson. It is just ironic that playing in the “no doubles” defensive positioning wound up causing Bay to get a double. I also think that Willits made a really good throw on the play to the plate but it was obviously just a little late because Bay got such a good jump with two outs. Napoli almost even blocked the plate off!
by turs12 on Oct 7, 2008 2:21 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I agree....
You gotta put some blame on Frankie and Shields too… though I guess not as much… The truth is that there were a lot of problems…not just one…
Show 'em your a panther... Show 'em what you can do....
by stuck in Romania on Oct 7, 2008 3:00 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Damn, Bobby Grich set this whole sh*t off.
Tumble weeds and twisted tales
These the bad lands where the ANGLS fail
"i got 5ive on it"
by Funke5ive on Oct 7, 2008 2:26 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I still expect more from our 3-4-5
Even though they were certainly putting the bat on the ball more than the anemic bottom half of the order, we needed a little more. A timely HR from any of them would have won (or at least tied) any of the three games we lost.
I can’t believe that after lurking for two years this is my first actual post here. Oh well.
by Ivan X on Oct 7, 2008 4:40 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
wow, high expectations...considering Tex, Vlad and Hunter were amazing in this series!
welcome to the site Ivan, but the 3-4-5 guys can’t do much more…
Napoli-an Dynamite
Beat the Red Sux, stop blaming GMJ
by hk47 on Oct 7, 2008 7:40 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
B-Ref is out, but
the 3-4-5 batters had between them exactly one extra-base hit. One! Do much more? Oh, hells yeah.
Witty .sig goes here.
by scareduck on Oct 7, 2008 8:21 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
3-4-5 hit .438 for the series
Those hitters walked 9 times and thats because the Red Sox decided that they would let HK and GMJ and JR beat them before ever allowing those 3.
Willie Mays Aikens is FREeeeeeeee
by Angel Aviator on Oct 7, 2008 9:41 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
We don't pay those guys to hit singles.
If GA wasn't so Lazy, I'd have something clever here.
by TheTypingFiend on Oct 7, 2008 12:06 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hard to drive a ball when they are pitching around you most of the time
When has Vlad ever walked that much in a series? Would you allow those guys to beat you or would you attack the likes of HK, Aybar, GMJ, JR? Someone has to score the runs and those listed were not the ones.1 run between the 4 of them in 54 PA. Solo jacks aren’t going to win the games. Extra base hits they still need those 4 to get a hit. 5-48 for a HK, Aybar, GMJ, JR = .104 AVG
Willie Mays Aikens is FREeeeeeeee
by Angel Aviator on Oct 7, 2008 1:54 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I, for one...
am glad Sean Rodriguez didn’t make an appearance. That would have been an automatic strikeout. Maybe Wood could have helped. But, thinking Rodriguez would have made a difference is a bit of a stretch.
Now let’s lock up Tex for the next few years. ;)
by 10 27 02 on Oct 7, 2008 5:47 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
You can imagine that Sean Rodriguez woulda at least fielded the ball.
HK crapped the bed. I still like HK and I expect him to be an all-star but not this year.
If GA wasn't so lazy the Halos woulda won the 2008 WS by now.
by melvintoast on Oct 7, 2008 6:18 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Post-series handshake.
I’d like to congratulate the Angels on a terrific season. 100 wins is quite an accomplishment.
The Angels didn’t play up to their ability during the series, but the games still had many exciting moments. In the end, I think the Halos simply made too many gaffes.
I thought the series was going back to Anaheim after Willits made it to 3B with only 1 out last night. Although it was exciting, there was absolutely no reason for Scioscia to call a suicide squeeze. A medium range fly brings home that run and the Red Sox would be behind the 8-ball. If Scioscia didn’t think Aybar could put the ball into the outfield, pinch hit.
The strike zone was erratic last night, but I thought it was equally so. Jon Lester got a gift with that called K to Teixeira to end a half inning, but I didn’t think that the umpiring was a game-changer.
My hat’s off to Mark Teixeira. The man was a stone-faced killer the entire series. Big Tex walked if he didn’t see his pitch, and he made several run-robbing plays defensively at 1B. He should be your #1 priority this off-season. I think that Arredondo can close for you. Don’t spend big bucks on K-Rod.
Torii Hunter and Chone Figgins also played a fine series, though Chone didn’t show up until game 2.
It’s amazing how Jekyll-and-Hyde your line-up is with a lead-off man on base. It’s seems like a mental thing as much as actually having a base-runner.
You need a new team leader if John Lackey is that guy now. His defense let him down, but he shouldn’t show that frustration on the mound. I particularly thought that with Kendrick’s bobble last game. There was no way Ellsbury would be doubled-off at 1B. One team, one goal. Act like a leader and pick your defense back up.
My series MVP votes are split three ways: Jon Lester, Jason Bay, and Howie Kendrick. I’m not sure who helped the Sox the most.
"You know you're having a bad day when the fifth inning rolls around and they drag the warning track." - Mike Flanagan, Baltimore Orioles pitcher, 1992.
by SoxDevil on Oct 7, 2008 7:08 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I believe that strike zone cost us more than you allow...
Varitek was struck out 2 or 3 pitches prior to the hit/run single. Ball was clearly a strike on TBS’s Hot Corner (far more than the phantom K3 call on Tex). The subsequent grounder to Howie would have been the 3rd out and the score would have remained 0-0. The ump only had balls enough to call Tex out on strikes on a pitch half a foot outside.
Baseball must adapt to the times and adopt instant replay in broader terms. The tag play on Willits was a blown call as the player must be able to remove the ball from his glove. Did Reggie deserve to be out…certainly. Was he…?
If they are finally going to show us the computer generated strike zone on every pitch as TBS did on their Hot Corner, then we are finally that much closer to having a computer call balls/strikes. This would be a welcome change and one that will soon be necessitated. Game 3 ump was extraordinarily good on balls and strikes. Game 4, not so much!
Whodathunk we would be rooting for a former Ranger come August, er September, er October...? Miss ya Kotch, but Tex is THE man!
by K3YEROUT on Oct 7, 2008 8:32 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
What a year...
I do not know about the rest of you, but this year was fun and exciting. Granted, we lost in the playoff and looked terrible again but there were a lot of bright spots. I for one am disappointed and sad we are eliminated but not all hope is lost. There is always next year and that is the beauty. We all get to kick back for a year and ponder what went wrong and what could have been, but it doesn’t change anything. So I will be sitting every day signing onto HH in anticipation of the next season to watch our favorite team kick some more ass and get a little closer to that prestigious peak, the world series. Thank you all for a great year and hey, we’ll be back!
"Throw some CHED!"
by angelskid2210 on Oct 7, 2008 7:34 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Hard on Figgy, Reverend
Guy went 7-21 and played great defense. To say he was “absent” is a bit of an overstatement.
Now Kendrick was terrible.
And how about Tex and Vlad and Hunter, Those guys were all great. So much for the Vlad doesn’t do anything in the postseason talk. Can we do away with that now?
Napoli-an Dynamite
Beat the Red Sux, stop blaming GMJ
by hk47 on Oct 7, 2008 7:43 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
With all do respect I love Vlad, but he still did nothing that really helped in the end. He had no RBI’s, no HR’s, a double and the rest were singles. Same with Tex, that in the end killed us just as much as Howie did. But hey we got closer than the past two Red Sox series, so next year watch out
"Throw some CHED!"
by angelskid2210 on Oct 7, 2008 7:48 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Vlad and Tex killed us as much as Howie? really?
umm…no, try again.
Re-sign Tex!
by hk47 on Oct 7, 2008 10:23 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don't agree on HK
He’s the starting 2nd baseman, he plays. Period. How many at-bat’s did JD Drew have before the ALDS since mid-August? Four. I think HK was completely overmatched by the post-season and put too much pressure on himself, getting him out of his game. He couldn’t relax out there and it showed. He clearly was not having any fun.
And Aybar? You’ve got to get the squeeze down.
We’ve become the AL version of the Atlanta Braves and Casey Kotchman’s stiking his finger in Tony Reagins’ eye.
by SactoFan on Oct 7, 2008 8:01 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
That was the most painful loss...
I can ever remember in all my years as a fan.
At least in 2007 when we got swept, at least I could walk away saying “man Boston really kicked the crap out of us” Beat by a much better team. End of story.
This year however, we were very very close. I could taste it. All I ever really wanted to do was get passed Boston. Everything else was gravy.
And to lose all that on a game-winning hit at Fenway was just too much.
We are cursed.
Let no joyful voice be heard! Let no man look up at the sky with hope! And let this day be cursed by we who ready to wake... the K-Rod!
by Scuff on Oct 7, 2008 8:14 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I tend to forgive player performance quickly
(unless you make 50 mil) . Players play like crap and make mistakes and that’s just baseball. Vlad, Howie, Shields, Frankie, Aybar, Torii,… all made mistakes, but honestly, they play hard and to win and come through all the time. So I get over it fast.
But I’m really having trouble justifying the season ending on Scoicia’s ego gambit.
by The Clyde on Oct 7, 2008 8:23 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I think this series loss was a culmination of things:
1. Howie was clearly overmatched.
2. Our defense was pitiful, more or less across the board.
3. Sure Teixeira had a lot of hits, but how many were for extra bases? (Not playing the blame game, just saying that he didn’t get the extra base hits that he usually does.)
4. Vlad’s baserunning mistake.
5. The botched squeeze. (Again, not playing the blame game. On 2-0 Scioscia expected something over the plate, but instead it was an almost impossible pitch to bunt.)
6. Figgins not getting on base for three games.
7. Vlad’s continued lack of extra base hits in the playoffs.
8. Umpiring.
9. Izzy being injured.
10. The complete inability to get a real clutch hit (other than Torii’s last night).
11. GA’s inability to get a hit after his first two at-bats of the series (okay, maybe he had one).
12. Don’t even get me started on K-Rod.
Positives to take away:
1. Torii had a great postseason showing.
2. Naps was solid and had a stellar performance in game 3.
3. Teixeira, while he couln’t get “the big hit” was on base almost the entire series.
4. Vlad, for the most part, came out of his postseason slump.
5. Lackey looked great. Poor guy.
6. Saunders looked great.
7. Shields looked good, except for a bloop and a seeing-eye single last night.
8. Weaver looked great.
Red Sox, we're comin!
by NoDakHalo on Oct 7, 2008 8:26 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Response to selected points
1. Howie was clearly overmatched.
Beyond obvious. I want to see him have a whole season where he stays healthy and hits well. He looked awful.
2. Our defense was pitiful, more or less across the board.
E-bar was the non-Howie culprit, but so was Gary Matthews, Jr., whose failure to catch a routine line drive to right in Game 1 also cost the team. Let us also not forget Torii Hunter.
3. Sure Teixeira had a lot of hits, but how many were for extra bases?
As mentioned upthread, the sum total of the Angels’ extra base hits from their 3-4-5 hitters was Vlad’s Game 3 double. In fact, the entirety of the Angels’ offense extra-base hits are
- Figgins: Game 2 triple, Game 3 double
- Vlad: Game 3 double
- Napoli: Two homers in Game 3
- Kendry Morales: Game 4 double
And that was it. That is, the Angels were hitting as a team at something like a .390-ish slugging average (if that) in the postseason. That will NOT get it done.
The pitching staff in general has nothing to be ashamed of. Unlike postseasons past, the Angels didn’t get hammered out of the playoffs; they got out-hit. Once again, I blame not just figurehead Mickey Hatcher but the entire Angels offensive strategy, which is too reliant on stringing together lots of singles. This is a major-market team, and the “poor us” excuse that the team doesn’t have much power and/or on-base percentage is a crock that needs to be dispensed with immediately.
Witty .sig goes here.
by scareduck on Oct 7, 2008 8:41 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Duckie...
HGH’s blunder actually did not cost us a run…it just reinforced the tone that we were setting of lousy D!
Whodathunk we would be rooting for a former Ranger come August, er September, er October...? Miss ya Kotch, but Tex is THE man!
by K3YEROUT on Oct 7, 2008 9:43 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
It DID cost us Lackey having to come out of the game though.
And remember, although i felt Shields looked very, very strong at times, he did pour gasoline on the fire in the 9th inning of game 1, turning a 2-1 game into a 4-1 game.
by goodvibe61 on Oct 7, 2008 10:17 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
You are correct, sir
I misremembered it.
Witty .sig goes here.
by scareduck on Oct 7, 2008 11:12 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
what about Frankie's record? That's gotta be worth at least a mention!?!?!
by ladybug on Oct 7, 2008 10:13 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
How about Frankie's other record?
What other reliever can you name that threw 2 gopher balls in back to back game 2’s of the ALDS, failing to win a big game for your team when it’s needed most?
Congratulations KRod!!
by goodvibe61 on Oct 7, 2008 10:18 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yesterday, quite frankly, was shitty
Not only did the angels get eliminated by Boston, again, but I watched two friends from work get laid off…one of which is a lifelong Angel fan. His family has worked for the Angels since the 70s (off and on) and the last thing he said when he left my office was “Go Angels”.
So today, I have no one to vent to about that loss and no one to discuss the ’09 season. I am seriously bumming right now and reading several posts from the game thread and randomly throughout this site bums me out even more. I see a lot of blame being placed, and quite frankly rightfully so, but the season is over and our team lost. Boston didnt win anything, we handed it to them time and time again. Regardless of who made what error or who hung which slider, its over….dammit. There are several things I wish could have gone differently, but we lost.
I have said it before and I’ll say it again…..I would rather miss the playoffs entirely than suffer another gut-wrenching series loss to Bahston. But putting things in perspective, I still have a job and a roof over my family’s head….for now.
It’s been a pleasure being a part of this community all season and the well-educated opinions. Lookin forward to the offseason chatter.
I'm your huckleberry
by autry's cowboys on Oct 7, 2008 8:48 AM PDT reply actions 1 recs
Wow, you read my mind
I was thinking the same things. Why go to the playoffs at all, just to lose to Boston? And the Angels gift wrapped this series for them.
But yes, I still have a job. I still have a loving wife and friends and family. SO, though it seems like my life is over, it’s not. As that gut-wrenching cliche goes, there’s always next year.
Kudos on your post.
I, chairmanofthebar, still believe.
See you next season!
The time is out of joint; oh cursed spite, that ever I was born to set it right.
by chairmanofthebar on Oct 7, 2008 8:54 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Tex and Umps
Bottom line was yes Texeira did get base hits and walks that not why we traded our future gold glove 1st baseman we traded for big hits in the post season that big bat we’ve been missing in post season but still he did a great job I’d like to see him back next year. The umps were clearly against us the entire series and the last call against willits the the head umpire jagoff said in a statement that he had possession of the ball when he tagged him all i have to say about that is next time there is a play at the plate and someone is tagged out but knocks ball loose they had better be out because the catcher had possession of the ball when the tag was made. I almost believe what a co-worker told me before the series started he said your angels will be eliminated whether they like it or not because major league baseball is going to try for a repeat of the NBA championship Boston vs. LA and then when they get they’ll go against LA just to prove Boston’s (the east coast) superiority over the west coast and doing it against the 100 win angels in the process is just icing on the cake my co-worker by the way is a dodgers fan who wanted a freeway world series as well and he could even see it before it started. THIS SUCKS!!!
"Boy, did he drop a huge deuce in the stands!" (About a two-run homer)
Rex Hudler
by devildogamp on Oct 7, 2008 9:10 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
To blame it on the Umps is weak
There were a lot of gaffes that the Angels made in addition to un-clutch hitting. The Angels certainly made the series easier for Boston, whose meat-of-the-order hitters didn’t contribute much.
"You know you're having a bad day when the fifth inning rolls around and they drag the warning track." - Mike Flanagan, Baltimore Orioles pitcher, 1992.
by SoxDevil on Oct 7, 2008 10:00 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Agreed, it is weak
I thought generally the series was well-umpired. The blame goes to the players like Howie who didn’t get it done. In my mind, he accrued three BOTGs in this series. He had 0 all year.
Above all else, the two biggest factors for us losing were:
1. You want to blame something, blame our damn defense, which was pathetic all series (with the exception of Tex). That was the difference between the two teams. Boston didn’t make any errors- Youk, Kotsay and their OF’ers all played very well.
2. The Angels left a ton of men on base in scoring position. We had our chances and didn’t come through.
Give credit to Lowrie for getting a big hit, to Lester for pitching two gems and to Ellsbury and Bay, who both had a great series.
Don’t blame the umpiring when the Angels played lousy defense and couldn’t get a clutch hit. It makes us as Angels fans look whiny and classless.
Re-sign Tex!
by hk47 on Oct 7, 2008 10:32 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
I don't think it was well-umped
The strike zones were all over the place. But it’s hard to say one team or the other got the advantage. And the calls on the basepaths (other than Crisp at second base) were generally correct. So maybe mediocrely-umped.
But your other points are right on. You can only get so many singles in a row (in our case: 2). Their defense was much better than ours. Lester was a stud.
We got outplayed, but not by much. I can’t objectively say the Angels were a better team, but I’m not sure I can say we were worse, either. We just made the egregious errors while Boston didn’t.
I feel the need, the need...for speed!
by Gorbachav5 on Oct 7, 2008 11:24 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
We got outplayed by a mile. They still barely beat us.
That is why this hurts so much.
The Angels may have beat them 8 times in a row, but winning three before they do is all that matters.
by hauldog on Oct 7, 2008 11:28 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
other points
1. You have four different umpires, games 1-4…you’re going to have four different strike zones.
2. You can’t work all season to earn home field advantage and then go right out and lose the first two games at home. Blame who you or what you want, but we shouldn’t have lost both of games one and two at home.
Re-sign Tex!
by hk47 on Oct 7, 2008 1:25 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Let's not bring up Kotchman vs. Texeira ever again please.
Once Mark had been here a week there was no longer any need to compare the two.
I like Kotch alot; he won me over after that lousy mononucleosis year that had me questioning him. And he’s a nice player.
But if you can’t see what a game changer Mark Texeira is after watching him the past 9 weeks I simply don’t know what to say. Once he joined the Angels he was clearly the very best everyday player we’ve had in our franchise in a long, long time. And if it came down to being able to sign only one guy, Tex or Vlad, it’d be an easy choice. He’s younger, he’s superior defensively, he’s an absolute masher, plus he’s one of the few guys on our team that showed up in the postseason.
He should be our number one priority in the offseason. However, I am a realist. I was thinking the one chance we’d have to re sign him would be that we go far in the playoffs. Why would he want to stay here now? Especially when the Yankees are going to throw a quarter of a billion dollars at him. Minimum.
by goodvibe61 on Oct 7, 2008 10:24 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
agreed, let's lay that damn argument to rest, rec'd
Re-sign Tex!
by hk47 on Oct 7, 2008 10:33 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
You are wrong
about the willits play. Willits did not knock the ball out of the glove, so your analogy is inapt. In your hypothetical situation, the tag isn’t made because the runner knocks the ball loose. As for what happened with Willits, he did have possession when he tagged him, and the impact did not jar the ball loose. Get over it.
by jjackflash on Oct 7, 2008 2:39 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
seems like some of us are just grabbing at straws.
TBS, ESPN, the umpires, and MLB all had it out for the angels. it had nothing to do with our porous D, lack of timely hitting, lack of power, and NL style micromanaging. it definitely couldn’t have been that the sox out played us.
before the series some of us ran around boards telling people how the halos would win this series based on superior pitching (starters and bullpen), superior D, and superior speed. we lost in everyone of those aspects (ERA = 4.19 vs 2.54 / Errors = 4 vs 1 / SB’s = 2 vs 4, and we ran into 2 outs on the basepaths). the umps have little to do with us getting outplayed on what we thought were our strong points going into the series.
for those of you who are going to continue to beat the dead horse of “varitek dropped the ball, we should protest”, familarize yourselves with Rule 2.00. once the tag is made the base runner is imedieatly out. there’s no continuation. it’s not the same as control calls (ie; collision at the plate / diving catch). plays at the plate hinge on ball control during the act of tagging. there was no question that varitek had control of the ball during the tag. have we all forgotten the a-rod slap play? so stop hitting that horse, it’s not getting up.
sorry to rant on what should should be of a celebratory thread. i just don’t want to feel like this season ended in sour grapes. the halos had a great/record-setting season. one i’m not soon to forget. from lackey’s almost no-no to k-rods run on history, this was truly a great season. thanks to rev and crew for keeping this board fun and informational 365 days a year. now sign tex and get escobar on a throwing regimen asap.
How is Gary Disarcina not in the Halo of Fame?
by Clutch_&_Scoop on Oct 7, 2008 3:42 PM PDT up reply actions 2 recs
Rev, could it be possible for a BOTG to include Scioscia next year?
When I'm not at the stadium, I'd rather be watching my Halos back in Costa Rica!
by Dono Romantico on Oct 7, 2008 9:10 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
the way I read into your post,
this series (in hind sight) would have been completely different w/o Howie. And I will add, could have been different w/o a squeeze play being called.
When I'm not at the stadium, I'd rather be watching my Halos back in Costa Rica!
by Dono Romantico on Oct 7, 2008 9:12 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Squeeze
all year long people say thats angels baseball when something goes right like that but if it doesn’t then we second guess it? no we had a favorable count for the squeeze aybar just wimped out and didnt at least find a way of putting the bat on the which you have to do at any cost in a squeeze to protect the runner coming. We live and die by these plays this one just happened to be poorly executed or protected and we die but no reason second guess it because if it works sosh is a genius a gambler a daredevil so no second guessing it just swallow it and we’ll be back next year thats all we can do dont lose faith in greatness for the poor outcome of one called play
"Boy, did he drop a huge deuce in the stands!" (About a two-run homer)
Rex Hudler
by devildogamp on Oct 7, 2008 9:17 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Bay
on the last play of the game napoli spiked bay’s hand with his cleat and bay spent the whole night during interviews wiping blood on his jersey so at least a lil kudos to naps for that
"Boy, did he drop a huge deuce in the stands!" (About a two-run homer)
Rex Hudler
by devildogamp on Oct 7, 2008 9:32 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
personally, when I heard the announcers talking about the squeeze...
and the count went 2-0 with a fast ball the most likely pitch coming as well, I was screaming at the t.v. “this is crazy, I can’t believe Sosh is gonna do this”. Live or Die, like you said. However, when you get this far and are on the brink of elimination with only 1 out and a pinch hitter already doubled off the pitcher I didn’t get the call. Oh well. And E-Bar absolutely blew it.
When I'm not at the stadium, I'd rather be watching my Halos back in Costa Rica!
by Dono Romantico on Oct 7, 2008 10:14 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
From today's Boston Globe...
Over and out: Angels, as usual, eliminated in Boston
There are a few certainties about Boston in October. The leaves will begin to turn. You’ll never be more than 100 steps from either a Dunkin’ Donuts or a historic landmark – or maybe both.
And the Angels won’t get past the Red Sox.
I think this should be printed out and posted to the locker of every player the first day of 2009 spring training.
Let no joyful voice be heard! Let no man look up at the sky with hope! And let this day be cursed by we who ready to wake... the K-Rod!
by Scuff on Oct 7, 2008 9:51 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
TRUE
When I'm not at the stadium, I'd rather be watching my Halos back in Costa Rica!
by Dono Romantico on Oct 7, 2008 10:14 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
It's just the facts.
God it hurts.
by goodvibe61 on Oct 7, 2008 10:26 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sometimes you DON'T state the facts
so that you can avoid sounding like a d-bag. But if you’re in Red Sox nation, you don’t worry about such trivial things. You own your douchebaggery.
by ViolaHalo on Oct 7, 2008 10:39 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
yeah, at work
accidentlly hit “post” i guess and then had to leave real quick. when i got back i forgot what i was going to post.
i guess what i wanted to say was they act like they hadn’t been owned for 86 years by the baseball gods and the yankees. we’re gonna break through one day…and i hope it’s a 7-game series.
by SCHalo on Oct 7, 2008 2:26 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Damn work, eh?
I agree. It’s like they’ve forgotten what it was like.
Oh, wait. Perhaps it’s because 75% of red sox nation weren’t red sox fans before 2004.
by ViolaHalo on Oct 7, 2008 5:11 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wasn't that posted in the Boston Herald?
Wasn’t the story from a sportswriter from The Orange County Register?
by stolenbases on Oct 7, 2008 8:51 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
We need to seriously petition to have our 7th inning stretch song changed. They built us, buttercups..
Seriously though. That shit’s got to go.
Whatever dude.
by Mayheminthehood on Oct 7, 2008 9:51 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Been saying that since they started it.
It’s a song about a freakin’ LOSER!!!!
Angels fan since '67
by red floyd on Oct 7, 2008 10:37 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Get rid of the song
I rather have another round of “Take Me Out to the Ball Game”
by stolenbases on Oct 7, 2008 8:54 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Drew and Furcal sure didn't seem to suffer from time off
Just saying.
HK had a choke of epic proportions.
The Angels may have beat them 8 times in a row, but winning three before they do is all that matters.
by hauldog on Oct 7, 2008 10:07 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Yup !
When I'm not at the stadium, I'd rather be watching my Halos back in Costa Rica!
by Dono Romantico on Oct 7, 2008 10:15 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Howie stunk it up, no doubt
But, Howie had 1 less hit than Garret Anderson, who bats 2nd.
To blame a series loss on your #8 and #9 hitters is weak, especially when the 2-6 spots had less xbh than the leadoff hitter combined. A leadoff hitter who had zero walks, 6 strikeouts, and reached base at a flacid .294 obp. The fact of the series was our big hitters only hit the ball hard 5 times all series, and the guy who hit 2 homeruns got benched for game 2. Reggie Willits’ defense is mediocre, his arm is atrocious, and he was in right field to end the game, exactly where you knew it was going to end. Tinker tinker tinker, and that’s what happens, you lose with possibly the worst player on the roster trying to do something ridiculous, like dive for a ball on the line, instead of playing that ball for a single. The squeeze is just more tinkering. Did we acquire “big bats” to have to mickey mouse our way to victory? Also, Sean Rodriguez was left of the roster so Rob Quinlan could be on the roster? More vintage Scioscia, and it stinks. Stinks to the tune of 1-10 in the last 3 playoff series.
by Quinlan's Goofy Swing on Oct 7, 2008 10:16 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Bringing a knife to a gunfight.
Let no joyful voice be heard! Let no man look up at the sky with hope! And let this day be cursed by we who ready to wake... the K-Rod!
by Scuff on Oct 7, 2008 10:30 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
He brought a stick of poop to a gun fight
The Angels may have beat them 8 times in a row, but winning three before they do is all that matters.
by hauldog on Oct 7, 2008 10:35 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
he is a useless as a poopy flavored lolly pop
The Angels may have beat them 8 times in a row, but winning three before they do is all that matters.
by hauldog on Oct 7, 2008 10:35 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I disagree with Willits in right
He’s better in right than Rivera and Morales, and has way more range than Vlad. If he doesn’t dive for that ball, there’s no way he comes close enough to “play it into a single.” It would have bounced into the seats anyway. I also don’t think even Vlad would have thrown out Bay on that hit, but who knows.
I do think Figgins was subpar from the leadoff spot and Garret didn’t do anything after game 1. We needed extra base hits like they were oxygen. Teams cannot live by singles alone and the middle of the order was punchless, despite their high average.
I feel the need, the need...for speed!
by Gorbachav5 on Oct 7, 2008 11:29 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Willits
was the worst baseball player in this year’s postseason.
by Rev Halofan on Oct 7, 2008 11:47 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
That was a good catch he made. Top notch
If I ever see him again it will be too soon.
The Angels may have beat them 8 times in a row, but winning three before they do is all that matters.
by hauldog on Oct 7, 2008 12:20 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Another Question is..
Why is Scioscia so good at getting the best out of his players during the regular season, but can’t get it done in the post season?
2002 was by far one of the worst playoff (wild card) teams of all of Scioscia’s playoff teams, in terms of talent, and wasn’t expected to do much. They got hot and was the most exciting team in Halos history ! When Scioscia has had a healthy playoff roster that was expected to win, they have not.
It is extremely difficult to knock Sosh, he’s steady, he’s knowledgeable, but in the playoffs with a healthy talented team HE CAN’T GET IT DONE !
When I'm not at the stadium, I'd rather be watching my Halos back in Costa Rica!
by Dono Romantico on Oct 7, 2008 11:35 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
disagree on 2002 being one of the worst playoff teams of
The Angels may have beat them 8 times in a row, but winning three before they do is all that matters.
by hauldog on Oct 7, 2008 12:21 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Other than the Game 1 baserunning gaffe, Vlad impressed me this series.
I felt that Vladimir showed a level of patience at the plate I thought he was incapable of. He went to all fields, taking what he was given; he walked 4 times and showed an ability to check off on pitches out of the strike zone. Boston kept nibbling, and he didn’t take the bait. It just makes me wish he’d show that same kind of discipline game in, game out.
Also, while he didn’t display any power, he only came up to bat 4 times in the series with a RISP. Here are his AB’s, tell me what you think of his performance:
Game 1
AB1RISP: 1st and 2nd, flied out to RF
AB2: runner on 1st, safe on error by Lowrie
AB3: Tex on 1st, singled to RF
AB4: Bases empty, singled to left. Later, out at 3rd on running gaffe.
Game 2
AB1: Tex on 1st, singled to right center
AB2: Tex on 1st, singled to center
AB3: Tex on 1st, walked.
AB4: Tex on 1st, singled to left
AB5: Bases empty, popped out to 2B
Game 3
AB1RISP: Figgy on 2nd, walked.
AB2: Led off 3rd inning, doubled and later scored
AB3RISP: runners on 1st and 2nd, walked
AB4: Bases empty, ground out to 2b
AB5: Tex on 1st, K
AB6: Tex on 1st, single to Center
Game 4
AB1: Led off 2nd inning, flied out to RF
AB2RISP: Runners on 1st and 2nd, grounded out to 2B
AB3: Fouled out to 1b
AB4: Tex on 1st, Walked, later scored on Hunter single
19 plate appearances. Only 4 times he came up with a runner on 2nd, and twice they didn’t pitch to him, and he took the walk.
Offensively Vladimir impressed me with his patience and drove the ball very well. Still, he displayed very little power and that game 1 mistake was HUGE.
What are we gonna offer Vladdie to stay? What does everyone think.
by goodvibe61 on Oct 7, 2008 10:59 AM PDT reply actions 1 recs
Nicely done
The Angels may have beat them 8 times in a row, but winning three before they do is all that matters.
by hauldog on Oct 7, 2008 11:23 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sign Vlad for as little as possible and DH Only for him or let him walk if we can find a replacement.
When I'm not at the stadium, I'd rather be watching my Halos back in Costa Rica!
by Dono Romantico on Oct 7, 2008 11:26 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Nice detail of his AB's.
To summarize;
- BA = .467.
- Slugging percentage = .533.
- OBP = .667.
- OPS = 1.200.
- No home runs.
- No RBI’s.
- 1 extra base hit.
- 1 base-running gaffe.
My reaction is that there are fantastic numbers for a lead-off or #2 hitter, not as great for a clean-up hitter (one way or the other, they are far better than 2005 or 2007).
by sothball on Oct 7, 2008 12:13 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Offer Vladdy?
Uh, he is under club option for 2009, vibe. Something like $14M for next year. I would not want him past next year IMHO.
by Downing Rules on Oct 8, 2008 12:47 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
A few random thoughts...
It’s still really raw and I’m still really pissed. For the 47th time in 48 years, the Angels failed to win the World Series. As someone who has been a fan since ‘61 I’m certainly used to failure. Anyway, a few random thoughts.
First, I think Scioscia did his worst managing job ever during this Series. Everybody’s entitled to a bad run, but Scioscia really bit it this year.
I know a lot of people think this is bullshit, but I think team chemistry is important and this team has no chemistry. If you want to be reminded of the difference, pull out your ‘02 DVD and take a look at it. Instead of gamers like Erstad, Percival, Molina, even Eckstein, Spiezio and Kennedy (remember those THREE HR’s in one game against Minnesota), we’ve got pussies like Aybar and Kendrick. spread throughout our line-up.
Say what you will about Erstad, but he and Percival were MEN, they were warriors. They refused to lose that year. They policed the clubhouse. They were clutch on the field (you guys Erstad throwing his body everywhere to MAKE the catches).
We’ve got no one like them in the clubhouse now. Instead, we’ve got guys who sit in a corner like Vlad, GA, etc. It’s a problem. Boston isn’t better than us, but they wanted it more. There’s a reason why we looked like pussies – because we were. Torii was brought in to change that culture, and Teixeira is a warrior, but none of the rest of the guys are.
Free agents — we’ve got to be smart about this. K Rod should go. There’s no way he’s worth what he wants. I love Teixeira, but I’m afraid the 250k he wants is outside our budget. Also, I believe in the Bill James theory that up the middle players are more valuable than corner infielders and outfielders. For those of you who don’t know, the idea is that Figgins, for example, is worth more to the team as a 2B than a corner infielder or outfielder because the middle infield positions are harder to fill with quality players (think Kendrick and Aybar as a prime example of crappy middle infielders).
Vlad was a great deal when he got him, and we should take his last year, but as a top producer, he’s done. Figgins needs to go back to second or become a supersub. We need a real third baseman and some real corner outfielders with power. I’m not sold on Kendrick, but other than Figgins, we have no real viable options there.
The other FA’s are garbage. We can offer them minimal salaries for smaller roles on the team, but we need to think of the rest of them like Rivera and GA as bench players. Aybar and Izturis are utility players. Frankly, so is Figgins, but he’s a little valuable as a supersub.
Finally, I’m not that concerned about the pitching. We’ve got a solid top four with hopefully some contribution from Kelvim. The rookie and Shields are fine for the eight and the ninth.
Anyway, I’m blabbing too long. It’s going to be a very annoying post season. I’m tuning out, but I really hope Boston and Doggers get their asses kicked.
Thanks to everyone who supports my favorite team. Peace!!
by waters96 on Oct 7, 2008 12:05 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
too quick to crucify Howie Kendrick...
ok, so he is fragile, but his 2008 playoff performance as bad as it was, he is still young and has room for improvement; give him the benefit of short time to recover before the playoffs and first-time jitters. I expect him to do better in the 2010 playoffs. If he doesn’t, THEN we can think about getting rid of him.
Just last pre-season everyone was crowning him the next batting champ. Now we want to dump him. C’mon guys, let’s give him some more reps…another chance.
by Downing Rules on Oct 8, 2008 12:51 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Billy Beane is right...
The baseball playoffs are a crapshoot. They are in comparison to other sports, I don’t think you can argue that.
The best team in football and basketball wins more regularly in the playoffs compared to baseball. Bye Angels. Bye Cubs.
In 2002, you could argue that we weren’t the best team. We were just the hottest team in the month of October.
Your defending OPD champion. Respect it, bitches.
by bc56274 on Oct 7, 2008 12:17 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
totally agree... It is a crapshoot...
the team that get hot at the right time wins… How many wild card teams have eliminated the #1 team??? Also don’t forget Colorado last year…. They went on a 24 game tear….and then they hit the wall… where were they this year?
I really do believe the Angels are the better team…. just had a REALLY bad series…
Show 'em your a panther... Show 'em what you can do....
by stuck in Romania on Oct 7, 2008 12:24 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
You're much smarter than hauldog.
Your defending OPD champion. Respect it, bitches.
by bc56274 on Oct 7, 2008 12:38 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Or you are both surrender monkeys
Dude the Angels played themselves out of the series not a crapshoot.
The Angels may have beat them 8 times in a row, but winning three before they do is all that matters.
by hauldog on Oct 7, 2008 12:51 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Speaking of monkeys.
After last night, I snapped the head off of my rally monkey.
I’m sick of that gimmick. Can we please get rid of it?
Yes, the Angels lost because they didn’t execute. I’m just saying the better teams in other sports win at a higher percentage than baseball.
Your defending OPD champion. Respect it, bitches.
by bc56274 on Oct 7, 2008 12:58 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I can get on board with all of that.
The Angels may have beat them 8 times in a row, but winning three before they do is all that matters.
by hauldog on Oct 7, 2008 1:29 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Better Team ?
The illusion is the Angels had a 100 win regular season. The reality is they compete in a shitty division. While the Red Sox meet the Yankees, the Rays & the Blue Jays over and over, we get the A’s, the Mariners & the Rangers !! Yes we beat the Sox up this year but when the games really counted… the Angels failed. The Red Sox have learned the lesson that the Post Season means everything and the Angels are still in school.
by nothingbettertodo on Oct 7, 2008 3:06 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
15 wins, 4 losses against the Red sox and Yankees....
Looks like the Angels played better all year to me…. Just got cold at the wrong time… Just my opinion though…
Show 'em your a panther... Show 'em what you can do....
by stuck in Romania on Oct 8, 2008 1:16 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
also here are there record against the whole mighty east... 30-16
also… Angels against the west….36-21… They had a better record against the east than against the west… So iguess if they played more against the East, they woulda had even more wins… right???
Show 'em your a panther... Show 'em what you can do....
by stuck in Romania on Oct 8, 2008 1:22 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hard to explain...
Halos with a winning record against all three divisions, yet they can’t win the biggest games of the year. Maybe it’s the pressure of playoff baseball that is our achilles heal ??
by nothingbettertodo on Oct 8, 2008 9:43 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
must be....
What can you do… Still think they are a better club…
Show 'em your a panther... Show 'em what you can do....
by stuck in Romania on Oct 8, 2008 12:01 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Here's the thing about the whole "the playoffs are a crapshoot" thing:
I only ever hear that coming from the losers, not the winners.
by goodvibe61 on Oct 7, 2008 2:56 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I put it in the 2002 context, too...
Your defending OPD champion. Respect it, bitches.
by bc56274 on Oct 7, 2008 3:46 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
why would a winner complain???
are the dodges really better than the cubs???
Show 'em your a panther... Show 'em what you can do....
by stuck in Romania on Oct 8, 2008 1:10 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
In October the team with the most heart and desire is left standing
which is why it seems to be a wildcard they have to fight harder and waters96 is right i watched the 02 dvd over and over this season and you cant seem to see the same want and refusal to lose the 02 angels were a comeback team all year the rally monkey was only the rally monkey because they came back in late innings over and over again they had no quit but watching that even GA doesn’t have the same look and intimidation he used to which was a big part of him he can still get it done at the plate but with no intimidation these guys look like they show up to work do they’re job and go home. there’s no FUN its a game, no competitive drive (EVEN THOUGH THERE IS BELIEVE ME I KNOW THERE IS DON’T JUMP UP MY ASS ABOUT THAT) it just doesn’t look like there is anyway. they’re humdrum and non-chalant they need fire and i hate to say it but we need to drop players that are downers to be around and bring new life
"Boy, did he drop a huge deuce in the stands!" (About a two-run homer)
Rex Hudler
by devildogamp on Oct 7, 2008 12:33 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
typically this has been true since the inception of the ALDS.
When I'm not at the stadium, I'd rather be watching my Halos back in Costa Rica!
by Dono Romantico on Oct 7, 2008 4:48 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Letdown
The disappointment has worn off enough to post here at least.
As I said after Game 1, we were let down. The crowd gave 110% in game 1 and the guys really did not respond. Game 2 was more of the same. You just can’t lose two home games in a series, in any sport, and expect to win.
Does anyone find it ironic that the Sox, with their neverending string of 2 out “hits” (“hits” including the infamous pop fly in center) were really the lucky ones? We were ostracized (by Sox fans included) for being a “lucky” team, and look what happens. This frustrates me to no end.
By the way, did anyone else want to jump through the TV and punch that annoying fan in the Red Sox hockey jersey that kept putting his ugly mug in the picture during camera angles on the batter? Argh.
Also, there’s nice thread on AN about how our aggressiveness (the squeeze) cost us the game. Pot → meet kettle. Their style of play has really gotten them far. What a bunch of jealous losers.
/end venting session
by swiss mcgee on Oct 7, 2008 12:57 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
AN
I just read the Atheltics Nation losers crap just full out jealousy but oakland has a special place on the top plays of 2008 highlight reel. #1 reggie willits ripped em off bad that didnt seem too aggressive to them then.
"Boy, did he drop a huge deuce in the stands!" (About a two-run homer)
Rex Hudler
by devildogamp on Oct 7, 2008 1:10 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Reading all this thoughtful shit on here is really making me depressed.
Recipient of the 2008 "The Iron Man" award from scottnak of Halos Heaven!
by 44FAN on Oct 7, 2008 1:07 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Simply said...
Lackey was good… Lester was better. The Angels didn’t support Lackey with many runs because Lester wouldn’t allow it. The only run the Angels managed, over two games vs Lester was unearned. Lester was a monster on the mound.
Besides the superior pitching of Lester, I gotta say that Scioscia got out-managed by Francona… hard to admit but certainly true.
We play in a cupcake division and get a hundred wins but, we can’t beat the Boston Red Sox when it really counts ! That sucks !
by nothingbettertodo on Oct 7, 2008 1:37 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Scioscia still beats Francona...
in at least one catgegory:
In time, each man became a major league manager, and once again Scioscia beat Francona to the punch, as the Angels beat Barry Bonds and the San Francisco Giants to win the 2002 World Series. This made him a member of a fairly exclusive club: Men who have won World Series as a player and a manager.
Let no joyful voice be heard! Let no man look up at the sky with hope! And let this day be cursed by we who ready to wake... the K-Rod!
by Scuff on Oct 7, 2008 2:36 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
There you go... but
Should Francona take the Red Sox to their third World Series in five years, it almost assuredly gets him into the Baseball Hall of Fame. Francona gets no respect because of his personality… his humility, but the man can manage.
by nothingbettertodo on Oct 7, 2008 2:42 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Frankie = Blame of the Series
We found ourselves in an excellent position to win Game 2 after clawing back from the early deficit.
Frankie doesn’t blow it in the 9th, we easily find that elusive walk-off Panther. Plain and Simple.
Game 3 goes the way it did, maybe a little shorter since we’ve got more confidence.
Game 4’s a wash, as expected with Lester on the mound.
Game 5’s back in Anaheim with a charged up crowd and our team ready to put the final nail in Boston’s coffin.
Frankie blew it, and that was the end of that.
Walk him out that door.
Light Up That Halo!
by Clutch on Oct 7, 2008 4:57 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Worthless
Yeah. “…easily find that elusive walk-off Panther. Plain and Simple.” Right. Folks can play this game forever.
If Howie gets a base hit in the 7th inning, when the bases were loaded with only 1 out, the Halos tie the game at 5 with the go-ahead run at 3rd. The next batter is Naps, who does not have to milk the walk to get the tying run in. So Naps hits his 3-run jack then instead of the next game. Willits does not have to PH for Rivera. Aybar strikes out, but Figgins comes up. The top of the order starts another 2-out rally. The Halos blow it wide open and score another 5 runs! All the momentum is ours! Frankie never pitches in the ALDS. The Halos go on to win the World Series!
Francisco Rodriguez: 2006 to Present: 149 saves. 5 Panthers. As fabulous as Pride, Romero, Gregg, Budde and Dino Ebel combined.
by Stirrups on Oct 7, 2008 5:55 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
But we had the momentum
And Frankie sucked it out. I’m not saying we ABSOLUTELY would have won that game—just that Frankie’s bomb took any statistically significant chance of our winning out, for good.
It was a given that we wouldn’t do sh-t against Lester, even without his benefit-of-ump. So Game 2 really was the must-win. If we’d won that game, we wouldn’t be sitting here talking about this right now—we’d be amping up for Game 5 tomorrow.
Light Up That Halo!
by Clutch on Oct 7, 2008 6:25 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
assuming we still won game 3 or 4
a tied series one to one changes the entire dynamic. maybe we dont play as hard in game 3? maybe boston comes out more on fire rather than just being gifted 4 runs in game 3? theres so many variables here. you cant look at an entire series and blame one guy or say it was that inning. theres no way of knowing that. yeah frankie didnt pitch well in the 9th inning of game 2, but so what really? there were plenty other instances of shoulda, coulda, woulda and they just didnt pan out.
by linkbruin on Oct 7, 2008 6:38 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
All I know is i saw what I saw
FYOUROD served it up again in the playoffs. Thats a solid fact and so are his playoffs numbers. Throw out the 2002 flash and what you have is 0-3 4.85 ERA 2 walk offs HR’s (3 total) 17 hits and 9BB 13K and a WHIP of 2.00 in 13 innings…………….See YA
Willie Mays Aikens is FREeeeeeeee
by Angel Aviator on Oct 7, 2008 8:00 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I ain't gonna try to defend his playoff numbers. Nor his singular failure.
But the idea that one guy, in one inning, in the middle of a 4 game series, doing nothing but pitching and guilty of the single crime of surrendering two of the runs yielded across 38 innings of baseball, is THE cause of the entire failure, is simply stupid.
Francisco Rodriguez: 2006 to Present: 149 saves. 5 Panthers. As fabulous as Pride, Romero, Gregg, Budde and Dino Ebel combined.
by Stirrups on Oct 7, 2008 8:46 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Thats 2 runs across 1 inning
not 38 innings. Spinning a tangled web there aren’t we? If you don’t think it plays on the mind your wrong. I won’t chalk this early exit on just one individual either.
I agree that it isn’t all his fault. I am just trying to make a point to those that think this team was built for success in the playoffs. You know I have voiced my concerns about Aybar across this board and my feeling about losing Izzy for the playoffs. Many of times I shouted out loud play Napoli, and many questioned that as well. World Series teams through the years have been built upon Pitching and solid defense up the middle while getting the power from the corners. This team lacked the corner power and the Defense up the middle.
As for FRod you know were I stand on that and how I dislike not only him, and for the most part those that are under the belief that he is this wonder boy sent from Mount Olympus are stupid as well.
Willie Mays Aikens is FREeeeeeeee
by Angel Aviator on Oct 7, 2008 10:54 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
The WHOLE TEAM played 38 innings of baseball.
That’s just a fact, not a tangled web.
ONE of those players, in ONE of those innings, suffered an epic failure. That’s also a fact.
But to think that this ONE failure in this ONE inning determined an outcome insurmountable by 24 other players across 37 other innings of offense and defense, is flat out wrong.
And projecting mind games as the consequence of that failure, even beyond the fact that the very next game was a victory, is what would constitute spinning tangled webs…
Francisco Rodriguez: 2006 to Present: 149 saves. 5 Panthers. As fabulous as Pride, Romero, Gregg, Budde and Dino Ebel combined.
by Stirrups on Oct 8, 2008 9:25 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think I agree with that......
"People ask me what I do in winter when there's no baseball. I'll tell you what I do. I stare out the window and wait for spring".
Rogers Hornsby
by ladybug on Oct 9, 2008 8:10 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
its really hard to blame a guy who pitched 2 innings for a whole series
i dont think we need to throw a lot of money at frankie, and maybe its easier for some to have a scapegoat but this is just wrong. its a team game, and it takes a team effort to lose/not win. the entire game does not hinge on one play or even one inning. and this is still assuming that we would have gotten a run before boston in that game; you cant say either way. we lost, thats really it. we got outplayed and the difference showed on the scoreboard.
by linkbruin on Oct 7, 2008 5:56 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
It's 7:00pm
What the hell am I supposed to do with myself?
"i got 5ive on it"
by Funke5ive on Oct 7, 2008 7:07 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
we finally get high in 2002
here’s to another hellish winter chasing that first high
"i got 5ive on it"
by Funke5ive on Oct 7, 2008 7:58 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Brother, I know EXACTLY what you mean. April is a seeming eternity away.
God…for the love of baseball…for the Angels.
by sothball on Oct 7, 2008 8:24 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Come on over, grab a beer, and lets watch the 2002 DVD!!!
Francisco Rodriguez: 2006 to Present: 149 saves. 5 Panthers. As fabulous as Pride, Romero, Gregg, Budde and Dino Ebel combined.
by Stirrups on Oct 7, 2008 8:46 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Gotta be something of a masochist
to engage emotionally with this team in the postseason, post-2002 (HEAVY sigh). We got put through a meat grinder of a Game 3 only to come right back and ask for more in a Game 4 and unfortunately we got all we asked for and a whole LOT more! Bad defense? Check. Anemic offense? Check. Waste excellent starting pitching? Check. All culminating in the most suicidal of suicide squeezes. It was almost an appropriate conclusion to a series that defined EX cruciating. THREE winnable games, all lost in break-your-heart fashion. No offense/Shielded in Game 1, Frankie’d in Game 2, Aybared in Game 4 and of course getting royally Kendricked throughout the series by our clear LVP. No question, he did a great job getting the bunt down helping win Game 3 but otherwise he was apparently afflicted with an acute case of head-up-as$-Itis…sorry, a bit PISSY today…um, if he can manage to play more than half a season for us at some point, he’ll be great. Scioscia put him in there because he thought he gave us the best chance to win. If you’re in there you gotta get the job done but he choked over and over and over with jittery defense and horrific ABs, swinging at pitches even Vlad would take. In comparison, another youngster Morales got miniscule PT yet was ready for the challenge and came through in some big spots. Maybe a pretty good sign if Tex…
Lackey was NAILS. The AbomiNation and EastCoastBias can SHUT THE EFF UP about his emotion. Give me the Lackey fire and intensity over the Kendrick/Aybar MEEK lackadaisicality. WTF is Lackey supposed to do when he’s pitched his heart out in two games while getting no offense AND the defense is falling apart at the seams all around him? In an EFFing ELIMINATION game!? Lackey felt as all of us felt watching. He GIVES A SH!T.
There is NO question the umpiring and certainly the broadcasting were PRO-Boston but whining about the umps is the M.O. of the loser. If you don’t like the way the playing field is tilted in Fenway then when you get home field advantage, take care of it, don’t give it away. If you do give it away, get it back (my God, we HAD it back didn’t we? I could TASTE it…) As far as the national media, the Angels did get some grudging respect, esp. after Game 3 but for the most part the Angels were to be token resistance, a la the Washington Generals vs. the Globetrotters. Especially loved Beckett and Lowell practically being elevated to war heroes for playing hurt. There is no font big enough for me to type: EFF these MFers.
I DO believe in Sciosc, I do I do I do, I DO believe in Sciosc. But, the bar has been raised and serious questions do come with that esp. with this latest (unfortunately quite epic) failure. I think he got out-maneuvered on that fateful squeeze, BOS was refusing to give a buntable pitch, was prepared to fire four balls into the batters box and if he didn’t offer a walk setup a double play and they try it all again with Figgins. Anyway, Braves-type comparisons are getting nauseatingly accurate now with the Angels being regular season wonders, then playoff flops. Scioscia understands these implications having helped raise the bar himself and I think Arte was also aware before the season that standing pat would not do. So, hello Reagins and hello Torii, despite signing GMJ. Hello Tex, despite an aversion to rentals. Hello runaway division title and best record in our history. We seemingly did everything right this year, we really did. That, plus BOS being minus Manny, a banged up Beckett/Lowell, plus home-field, etc., seemed to add up to an “if not now, when?” situation. I’m not sure how we could have been better positioned to win it all than heading into this postseason, yet we fell short, way way short, which is why this one really, REALLY hurts. Now the only scoreboard that matters, the HowYourSeasonEnded scoreboard, since 2002, reads:
Angels: WS champion, no postseason, ALDS loss, ALCS loss, no postseason, ALDS loss, ALDS loss
BOS: no postseason, ALCS loss, WS champion, ALDS loss, no postseason, WS champion, in ALCS vs. TB (Go Rays Go!)
with all three Angels ALDS losses to youknowwho, damn them all to hell…but even by this measure there is NOT some kind of unfathomable gulf between us and them…it just seems that way since they’re merely the absolute bane of our existence. Maybe their ownership/front office has been JUST that much better, maybe their management has been JUST that much better; definitely their execution between the lines, when it really counts has been much much better. I would take this exact opportunity, an ALDS vs. BOS, in 2009 along with the millions of tons of angst that would come with it (like a good masochist, bring it on). Exact opportunity would mean with Tex but dunno about that, the Yankees missing the playoffs plus our early exit doesn’t seem to bode well for that, but I’m hoping. Seven or eight years @ ~22M/yr seems reasonable…or, “reasonable”…but if the Yanks go an A-Rod-ish 10 @ 25M…arrrgh…well, the Angels are one of the best run teams in sports and we have to believe that they will do all they can to get in position to win it all next year; I do believe that they did that this year. To understate it to the extreme: it just didn’t work out.
by LUVtheLAA on Oct 7, 2008 8:34 PM PDT reply actions 1 recs
I wanted the Angels to play Boston in 2008...
just to exorcise the demons of the past.
However, next year I better hope we play the Nationals or the Royals in the division series, instead. (I know the Nats are in the national … I’m just picking a crappy team).
by Downing Rules on Oct 8, 2008 1:02 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
IMHO this is why we lost series
I’m late to the game on my comment but ….
Extra base hits: You can’t win PLAYOFF games on a diet of singles alone. 36-out-of-42 hits in series were singles. In the three losses, we had 26 hits and of that just 2 for extra bases (0 in Game 1, 3B in Game 2, 2B in Game 4).
LOB: You can’t win PLAYOFF games by leaving 42 men on base. That’s just pathetic.
IF YOU IMPROVE on these two stats alone, we have the offense then to carry us and would have swept the series.
Bottom line, we didn’t take advantage of our possibilities in each game and left it on the table for Boston to take from us.
I’m looking forward to next October and another chance.
Si se puede, mi amigos.
by MurphDogg on Oct 14, 2008 6:02 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

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