Angels Fielding

by NoDakHalo on May 5, 2008 2:34 PM PDT Comment 19 comments

We talk a lot about hitting and pitching, but fielding has rarely been discussed so far this year...

Right now the Halos are tied for the MLB lead in fielding percentage at .989 and are only behind the Roy Roys with a mere 14 errors committed. We also are a team (with guys like Hunter and Kotch) who can "make plays." Meaning, we don't just make ruitine plays with few errors, but we sport some stellar defense on a regular basis. Sure there are holes, but this is something I think we should be excited about so far this season.

Remember how important of a role our defense played in '02...

This Fan-Post is authored by an independent fan. Tell us what you think and how you feel.

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Team Record

On the right toolbar just under the fanposts the standings have us at 20-12, but according to mlb.com and my count, we’re 20-13.

C: Bengie Molina, 1B: Wally Joyner, 2B: Bob Grich, SS: Jim Fregosi, 3B: Troy Glaus, RF: Tim Salmon, CF: Darin Erstad, LF: Brian Downing, SP: Nolan Ryan, RP: Troy Percival

by NoDakHalo on May 5, 2008 2:44 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

The Mariners' record and Games Back are incorrect, also.

by wumbug on May 5, 2008 8:48 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

But does that really matter?

Sea-at-ha-ha-ha that's funny.

by hauldog on May 6, 2008 9:14 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Kotch makes the whole infield better

He is amazing

Get rid of Quinlan

by edhoo on May 5, 2008 3:13 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

You left out Aybar.

Amazingest

Scioscia, "Roll the hole!"

by 44FAN on May 5, 2008 3:22 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

i am so stoked on Aybar

Does anyone know Aybar’s zone rating compared with Cabrera and other SS in the league? Where can I find all those nifty stats?

by jtkelly86 on May 5, 2008 4:09 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Here you go...

Zone rating – squarely in the middle of the pack
Range factor – leading everyday shortstops
Fielding percentage - Back in the middle

Don’t ask me to interpret the relative merits of these stats, though I’m sure someone will dive right in…

I see red people

by The Limey on May 5, 2008 4:34 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

ZR is really only useful once you get a few months worth of data.

FP and RF are pretty much useless outside of generally saying “he’s good” or “he’s not that good.”

~Till the Halo burns out...

by Zu Long on May 5, 2008 4:56 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Don't forget Rate2

Much maligned, but Aybar and the Twins’ Adam Everett are tied for best score with a 121 Rate2.

The AL East has probably the worst average score, with three starters well below 100 (Jeter at 84, Julio Lugo at 85, and David Eckstein at 88). The M’s Rafael Betancourt, lauded for his D at short, has the worst score in the AL of any starter, 78.

Witty .sig goes here.

by scareduck on May 5, 2008 5:06 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Tied for best in the AL, that is

Witty .sig goes here.

by scareduck on May 5, 2008 5:15 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I think you mean Yuniesky Betancourt Rob

Rafael is the current Indians closer (although given his recent outings I’m not sure for how long)

by Matt UK on May 6, 2008 6:17 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Righty-O

Witty .sig goes here.

by scareduck on May 7, 2008 8:28 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

What was Ozzie's zone rating?

Who cares? Doesn’t take a computer to see that Q’s lateral quickness is glacial.

by melvintoast on May 5, 2008 5:06 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

oh boy

Please don’t talk about fielding pct.

For team level fielding you want to use DER or something similar.

http://www.hardballtimes.com/main/teams/

Angels are a smidgen below average at the moment. Our IF seems a bit above average, but our OF range is awful. We do lead the league in OF plays out of zone, so GMJ is doing crappy on the singles hit right near him but snagging some shots into the gap most likely.

by elricsi on May 5, 2008 8:08 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Puke stats ...

Has anybody here banging on about stats ever played a game at SS?

The most important stat for SSs is how many “plays” they make. Their pitchers, teammates and managers know how many “plays” the SS should make, has made, and will make in the future. It’s a feel stat, not a quantitative measure. There are no statistical figures that mean shit when when it comes to defensive stats really when it comes to key defensive positions like shortstop.

Does the guy get to balls he should get? Does he position himself properly based on pitch calls? Does he backup and lead the rest of the infield? Does he have a gun? Will he make the routine play as well as the spectacular? From a pitcher’s perspective: If I need an out, do I want the ball hit to this guy?

Those are the questions that go into baseball players’ heads about defensive ability. Never stats. But in case you want to know, Aybar is one helluva fine defensive SS.

Don't call me Desmond

by highlandhalo on May 5, 2008 9:24 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

ummm yeah

I know this will start trouble, but there is such a stat that measures if the player is getting to the balls he is supposed to and that is called zone rating. Has Mike Sciocia ever played a game at SS? Yet I would trust him to know enough to tell a good one from a bad one. There is not enough data on Aybar yet, but the early returns are he has good range out there.

The problem is the OF. GMJ’s stats have never been good, and after seeing him last year all year, I’ll bet that was a big reason they signed Torii. Torii was excellent when young ,but he has lost a step. He is still the best of our major league OF as far as range of course. Vlad’s range is getting to be a real problem. GA is OK when 100% healthy.

Lot of teams are using some of these new fangled defensive stats and finding value with them. I know the Red Sox, Indians and Fremont Athletics pay careful attention to defensive stats. I would bet even our beloved Angels use stats similar to zone rating for their benefit. The stat revolution has not taken hold as much in the National League, which is one reason that league sucks.

by elricsi on May 6, 2008 3:22 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Dude, fair enough ...

You make some valid points. Mike Scioscia has never played a game at SS (unless you count little league possibly) but yes, he knows a good one from a bad one.

The problem I have with range factor as a stat is this (and I played 2B and SS at both hs and juco levels) ... range factor takes into consideration the amount of balls a fielder “should get to” within certain squared-off areas.

The problem with this is that it takes nothing into account other factors: the pitcher, field conditions, (most importantly!) the count, runners on base, etc.

For example, the sweet DP the Angels turned the other day against Baltimore. Figgins made a nice play on his backhand at 2B but only had to go a step or two because he was properly positioned, knowing that Garland was throwing something down and that Mathis was set up outside the plate. Also, the infield was playing hard and fast. So, Figgins was perfectly positioned, fields the ball, starts the DP with a lovely flip to Aybar and gets a point towards his range factor. He had done everything right mentally as an infielder, but I’m damn sure he wasn’t thinking about range factor. And really range factor had nothing to do with it at all; it was good sound fundamental baseball.

Picture this scenario however. Let’s say the same scenario, only this time the infield is a bit wet, maybe the dirt a bit soft as well. Figgins positions himself the same way based on the pitch selection and the way Mathis is set up. Only in Scenario 2, Garland doesn’t get the ball down, Mora swings late and hits the ball to the right past a diving Figgy and now you’ve got Orioles on 1st and 3rd instead of inning over.

The point is, Range Factor is only a useful stat if you factor in every single other factor of defensive positioning. Otherwise, it’s pretty much useless.

Keen observers of defenders can tell what balls guys should and shouldn’t be able to get to … and Derek Jeter probably takes a bad rap from range factor aficionados.

I’ll close this lil rant by saying again, that Erick Aybar has got mad range, and I don’t care what Range Factor has to say about it. And an awesome gun to boot! ... Go Halos!

Don't call me Desmond

by highlandhalo on May 6, 2008 4:59 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

SS

I live in NY and see Yankees games all the time on TV. Jeter does actually have shit range, he can’t get a ball one step to his left (not much of an exaggeration). Also, your points are valid in that every stat has problems, but many more things than you expect even out to some degree. The state of the art now is to look at many different fielding systems and use the consensus. Again, it’s a bit early on Aybar, but what I have seen is good. Izturis, on the other hand, has shit range.

by elricsi on May 6, 2008 7:26 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

thats a point i was making in the original post...

in not so many words.

so, yes, i agree.

C: Bengie Molina, 1B: Wally Joyner, 2B: Bob Grich, SS: Jim Fregosi, 3B: Troy Glaus, RF: Tim Salmon, CF: Darin Erstad, LF: Brian Downing, SP: Nolan Ryan, RP: Troy Percival

by NoDakHalo on May 6, 2008 12:46 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs