Angels Minor Leagues on Empty
by Rev Halofan on Jun 19, 2008 1:44 PM PDT
53 comments
If you like what you see at the major league level in Los Angeles of Anaheim, enjoy it, because at the lower levels, hey... we stink!
We once had one of the best minor league systems out there, but after the promotions of Kotchman, Kendrick, Santana, Saunders and Aybar, well, paging old Mother Hubbard... the cupboard is bare! The dominance of Salt Lake was an early hot streak fomented by the fact that the average Salt Lake Bee is 2 years older than the average AAA player. It is called a head start, it is not called anything to bet the future on.
Our top 2 prospects (according to all of the “stud analyst” columns populating the internet like Ohio Players albums stacked two-dozen deep in the back of a thrift store) are Nick Adenhart and Brandon Wood. Both are young for AAA (Ad-Rock is 21, Wood is 23, AAA stats are best measured in 24/25-year-olds), but both are struggling...
Adenhart
At Salt Lake so far this season, Nick has allowed 74 hits in 67+ Innings Pitched. They have translated into 35 Earned Runs. 47 Ks Vs. 35 BB is not the thing a top shelf ace is made of. This kid is not going to be helping the big club this season or next.
Wood
Wood’s AAA batting average is almost double that of his Major League average this year. Problem is he batted below his weight in the bigs and stands at .250 in the offense-amped Pacific Coast League so far this season. If the Angels stay healthy, they sure won’t need nor miss this Bee. Did I mention an .816 OPS? Nice, but the 47 K in 36 game is pretty bad...
So after that the prospect gurus, none of whom have a degree in the field, they just wake up one morning and –HEY– they are prospect gurus... well after that the top rankings maintain consistency for the 3 and 4 positions: Catcher Hank Conger and pitcher Jordan Walden. Oh dear, the armchair analysts appear to have gotten things right!
Conger
After surgery to remove the hamate bone in his hand, Conger has played 17 games at High-A Rancho and delivered an OPS of .848. That he is younger than level-average is the big indicator of Conger’s prowess. Only 3 other players in our entire minor league system have put up comparable OPS AND been level-average age or below:
Kendry Morales (turns 25 tomorrow) - .870 OPS in AAA
Sean Rodriguez (23) - .935 OPS in AAA
Mark Trumbo (22) - .899 OPS in High-A Rancho
Okay, so that is the good news. The bad news is that Hank has yet to catch a game behind the dish. These numbers have been at DH. The kid is 20 and while a big bat is great, if he comes to have no defensive utility whatsoever, A DHing Conger as our 3/4 prospect would be an indicator that our minor league system is stewed, screwed and tattooed when it comes to making complete big league players out of toolsy rubes.
Walden
At least we have ONE ass-kicker in the bunch! 60 K over 22 BB in 75+ IP. The 1.06 WHIP is pretty Bitchen’ too, dude. 23 ER looks a little high, but Homeboy Jordy is only 20. The other caveat: his Cedar Rapids Kernels are in the pitching-intense Midwest League.
At the moment, the only Angel minor leaguers of use to us in 2008:
AAA reliever Jason Bulger replacing Justin Speier would be a likely improvement, but consider that Jose Arredondo has already done exactly that!
Catcher Bobby Wilson filling in at Catcher if Mike or Jeff get stiff or go down would not be the end of the world.
Maybe Matt Brown or Brandon Wood would be an improvement over Robb Quinlan, but at the cost of developmental at-bats.
Kendry Morales would be an improvement over anyone excpet the one guy who blocks him at the Major League level – Casey Kotchman. Oh and Kendry is NOT NOT NOT and outfielder - he sucks there and would take away from our pitching staff anything he delivered offensively as an addition there.
That is it! AAA Outfielder Terry Evans is hurt, so scratch him from the depth chart of 8th OF. The only glaring bright star to mention in an add to this discussion is Cedar Rapids pitcher Tevor Reckling, pitching almost as lights out as Walden at age 19. See you in LA of Anaheim in 2013, Trev!
Bottom Line here folks: Enjoy the 2008 Angels. Considering Oakland’s magic bag of AAA tricks, this winning thing may not soon come around as being so easy...
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A little more
I’m not yet ready to give up on Sean O’Sullivan or Tommy Mendoza (pitchers) or Peter Bourjos (OF) yet, either, but they do need an infusion of new talent. Abstaining from signing Type-A free agents for a couple of years would help.
by jjackflash on Jun 19, 2008 1:53 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Exactly
It seems that every year we pick up one guy that takes away our first round pick and we get stuck with our first pick in the 40’s
Howie for MVP!
by angels.vlad27 on Jun 19, 2008 2:15 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Exactly
What really annoys me about Gary Matthews, Jr. is that the Angels also lost a high (first-round?) draft pick because of his signing. Torii Hunter was (at least last year) worth it, but the Angels are going to have to stop losing first round picks.
On the other hand… Brandon Wood? How many times is he gonna have to go through AAA before he doesn’t suck?
Witty .sig goes here.
by scareduck on Jun 19, 2008 2:44 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
"How many times is he gonna have to go through AAA before he doesn’t suck?"
I dunno, maybe more than, say, 3 years, 260 games and 1000 ABs from ages 23-25?
by mattwelch on Jun 20, 2008 6:58 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
How is Chase Utley a good comp for Brandon Wood?
Utley struck out in only 19% of his age 23 season (2002) AB’s while hitting .263/.352/.461 in a much pitcher-friendlier league. Wood is striking out in 31% of his AB’s while hitting .270/.321/.557 in the PCL. Wood doesn’t have anywhere near Utley’s discipline. I understand your point about repeating levels, but it’s also Wood’s second tour of AAA. Granted, Utley took two and a half years at AAA before he got established in the majors, but Wood’s track record makes me think he’s going to take longer, and maybe not even make it.
Witty .sig goes here.
by scareduck on Jun 20, 2008 8:44 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Because he's a power-hitting middle infielder who took twice as long in AAA
Beginning at age 23, which is how old Wood is now. Doesn’t mean he’s the perfect “comp” (for one thing, Wood has shown much more isolated power, while playing a more demanding defensive position) but that’s not the question you originally asked, is it?
by mattwelch on Jun 20, 2008 11:18 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
you can not tell me that
if Morales played RF/LF every day and they worked with him on just that, that he couldn’t become a decent outfielder.
Chaka Khan... Rally Monkey 2.0
by howiestheman on Jun 19, 2008 2:28 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Dude, You watched him play ONE freakin game in the OF with AAA this year and you are saying he sucks?!?
What if that foo had the runs or something and he couldnt play to his fullest? Me being a baseball player have had games when my stomach gets the best of me and I play like shit in the OF. You and other people on Halos Heaven said that KENDRY SUCKED at 1B and had no hands to play any position but DH. Then he shut everyone up after alot of hard work.
I, along with HOWIESTHEMAN belive Kendry can bring similar defense if not better than Guerrero if he is worked with in the OF.
Put Kendry Morales at 1B, and move Sean Rodriguez to 3B......NOW LETS GO WIN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
by acuda27 on Jun 19, 2008 4:30 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
He plays MLB OF 6 times last year...
according to his baseball reference page.
Also, his MiLB page says he’s on the “7-day Disabled List” That’s news to me.
"At some point, a veteran player will more often than not find his stroke. You just have to show them a little bit of patience."
by Downing Rules on Jun 19, 2008 4:36 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
He's been on the DL since June 8th
Put Kendry Morales at 1B, and move Sean Rodriguez to 3B......NOW LETS GO WIN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
by acuda27 on Jun 19, 2008 4:46 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Put it this way
If he stopped everything he was working on and concentrated on just being a major league average Outfield glove, he MIGHT cross the threshold to that … at the sacrifice of maintaining the consistency of his “o”
by Rev Halofan on Jun 19, 2008 4:40 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
And we need his "O" so i guess that would not work.
Dude I SUCKED ASS at even playing catch (Baseball) 3 years ago. I could not catch fly balls unless they were pop ups almost right at me. Now I am better than Vlad and have + range with my speed.
I accomplished this by playing every sunday and learning from my mistakes and listening to what others told me I was doing wrong. Kendry can play 7 days a week and learn from his experiance. Every ERROR or MISTAKE is a better lession than haveing someone coach you. I know he can become a good OF player if he focuses. If I could do it he can too.
Put Kendry Morales at 1B, and move Sean Rodriguez to 3B......NOW LETS GO WIN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
by acuda27 on Jun 19, 2008 4:53 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
You are the wind beneath his wings
Or Tony Robbins
Seattle I would like to thank you for sucking. It allows me to get back to my roots: Hating Fremont.
by hauldog on Jun 19, 2008 4:55 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
we're in this thing together, brother
hahaha
i honestly believe that there’s no reason why Kendry can’t play defense as well as Vlad or GA or Juan freaking Rivera.
work him there during Spring Training next year, and he’d be ready for the rest of the season.
Gold Glover? no way. but like Garland, he would be solid, not spectacular.
Chaka Khan... Rally Monkey 2.0
by howiestheman on Jun 19, 2008 7:14 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I wouldn't worry about the farm system
Obviously you are going to need a stream of impact players to come through the system, but as long as there are eyes and ears [like Tom Kotchman and others like scouts we don’t hear typically about], the Angels’ farm system will continue to produce talent for the MLB team.
I’m sure he might not have fans around here, but that guy running the Angels’ prospect may give you some perspective on the system, though it maybe skewed in favor of not realizing how little we have in the minors as the OP said.
by BBFan1 on Jun 19, 2008 2:29 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I have faith in our scouting, but like JJACK stated above, signing Jeff Weaver and Gary Matthews cost us HIGH DRAFT PICKS – I am certain our scouts would have had great input on a few late first-rounders. KOtchman and the Sutherlands are great, but the short-term future is looking like a vast wasteland.
The problem with most team-specific minor league analysts: Their favorite prospect is themselves, their favorite player is the one they met, their favorite narrative is the party line – tow, tow tow.
by Rev Halofan on Jun 19, 2008 2:37 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
We don't have many holes
Except for the outfield, we are a relatively young team. We won’t have many holes to fill from the farm system in the next couple years.
by HungryHunter on Jun 19, 2008 3:12 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Actually, I would argue that our "short term" future is pretty good.
There is no telling what happens with the long term future, of course. But your point would probably be that our “medium term” future is now in doubt.
Our short term future should be fine, specifically because we got hammered with injuries the first half of the season and we have built up some increased depth to the club by giving guys like Wood, Rodriguez, Brown, Bulger, and Arredondo some cumulative playing time at the major level.
Snark alert: pretty soon we can sign GA to a minor league contract and, suddenly, our AAA roster has a MLB-ready left fielder! Problem solved!
by Stirrups on Jun 19, 2008 3:29 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
By "Short-Term"
I meant 2009/2010 … after that all bets are off…
by Rev Halofan on Jun 19, 2008 3:33 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
negative negative negative
holy shit rev….who took a shit in your cherrios…...its the minor leagues the guys are learning….i mean is the season going so good you had to look at or minor leagues to bitch….enjoy yourself its summer we are in first place….we have a great manager…we will be fine in the future…..... will we win it all every year of course not…but dont bum us out by already predicting oakland wins the west in 2009…..you want me to buy you beer?
by surfpunk on Jun 19, 2008 3:57 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
"Somebody Gimme a Beeyah"
- – - Darby Crash
(he died three days later, no thanks!)
by Rev Halofan on Jun 19, 2008 4:10 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I’ve heard nothing but great things about Freddie Sandoval….
(no relation to Curt & Jeannie)
by Undercover Angel on Jun 19, 2008 2:40 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Reagins
I guess this is where we get to see the real audition of Tony Reagins, to see if he can match the level of talent that Bill Stoneman stockpiled in the minor leagues before this year. Obviously it will be a few years before we can judge him on this but certainly the talent that Stoneman brought into our system will soon dry up.
by Neo8234 on Jun 19, 2008 2:45 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
what about the other "Nick"
Brown???? whats he doing with the bees these days?
i root for teams that lack offense! go halos and bills!
by norcaliangelsfan on Jun 19, 2008 3:34 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Not very well, I would surmise, from these stats
LINK – to – Nick Green (MiLB.com)
"At some point, a veteran player will more often than not find his stroke. You just have to show them a little bit of patience."
by Downing Rules on Jun 19, 2008 4:15 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
errr
i mean green…....i think Nick Brown was a guy i went to HS with….......le sigh
i root for teams that lack offense! go halos and bills!
by norcaliangelsfan on Jun 19, 2008 3:36 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Walden has a 2.08 GB/FB ratio
That is insane
Get rid of Quinlan
by edhoo on Jun 19, 2008 3:57 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Thats why we need to sign DAYAN VICIEDO
He is 19 years old and would serve as a 1st round draft pick
Put Kendry Morales at 1B, and move Sean Rodriguez to 3B......NOW LETS GO WIN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
by acuda27 on Jun 19, 2008 4:43 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
international FA signings
there’s a few very big name 16-18 yr old latin guys who’ll become available to sign in the next few days. we need to throw some money at them…since we are not doing so for our 1st-2nd round picks (because he don’t have any!).
Go Angels!
by Four Ts on Jun 19, 2008 6:21 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Is it just me or do we ignore Asia?
Or do the Angels just totally seem to ignore the gold-mine of talent that is brimming in Asia? ... supposedly we made a token post for Dice-K but while guys like Chien-Ming Wang, Takashi Saito, Kosuke Fukudome, et al continue to kick ass in the MLB.
Can anyone honestly tell me that Maicer Izturis is a better player than Kazuo Matsui?
Why don’t we ever sign any guys from Korea, Japan or Taiwan? They don’t cost any draft picks, they only cost money, and Arte’s got a lot of that. We seem to have completely ignored the market for Asian baseball players.
Arte? Maybe. Nobody could blame him for focusing the team’s scouting efforts on Latin America but I’m not about to turn this into a racial issue. I’m just going to say that there are a hell of a lot of good baseball players born in Asia that end up on other clubs, beating us, and I’m getting sick of hearing about how we keep losing draft picks for high-priced free-agents when we ignore the reasonably priced talent out of Asia.
I bet if someone was willing to the do the research, they would find out that the Angels are probably the MLB team that has gone the longest without having an Asian-born player appear on the MLB roster. And my guess would be the last one we had was Shiggy Hasegawa, back in the old ugly Mo Vaughn/TC periwinkle-and-blue days.
Hell even the Royals gave Nomo a last twirl out this year out of spring training.
And I still think the trade that makes the most sense for us this year is spare parts for Ichiro (inside the division or not).
Ha-so!
Don't call me Desmond
by highlandhalo on Jun 19, 2008 8:24 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Shigetoshi Hasegawa would like to speak with you...
Arritgatou-gozaimasu.
"At some point, a veteran player will more often than not find his stroke. You just have to show them a little bit of patience."
by Downing Rules on Jun 19, 2008 9:04 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
We just a mil on Korean teeneage pitcher last year.
Seattle I would like to thank you for sucking. It allows me to get back to my roots: Hating Fremont.
by hauldog on Jun 19, 2008 9:52 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Young-Il Jung
Expected to play this year for Orem after starting the season on the 7-day DL.
Witty .sig goes here.
by scareduck on Jun 20, 2008 8:45 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah I know we've got Young
But he’s the only Asian to my knowledge, other than Conger, who is half-Asian and born in America, in the minor leagues. Young is supposed to be really good, but we need to do much better in this area than other teams are doing.
One of these days, baseball is going to be a world-wide game. Possibly even in our lifetimes. Are we going to neglect signing some hotshot German shortstop in 20 years because of WWII or because our owner is Latin-American and focuses all his attention on one part of the world? Ja?
I just think we need to get with the times, baby, and cast our nets a bit wider.
I return Shiggy’s compliments. He was a damn good player for us and was one of the nicest interviews I can rememeber from my time on the Angels’ staff back in those grim old days.
Don't call me Desmond
by highlandhalo on Jun 20, 2008 1:58 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hate replying to myself but ...
There’s going to be a bidding war for this young Japanese-Iranian ace, Yu Darvish.
It would be nice if we win for once and not ignore the guy because his first language is Japanese instead of Spanish and go to the freaking Red Sox instead and mow us down.
Don't call me Desmond
by highlandhalo on Jun 20, 2008 2:04 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Why do you imply
That because Arte is of Latin-American descent, that he chooses to focus his attention on that part of the world as far as players? I hate to break it to you, but he’s more white bread USA than he is Latino and I don’t think he has an agenda to field the best Hispanic organization/ team in the Major Leagues.
If there is someone in the far corners of world has all skills and projectable MLB ability, the Angels are not going hesitate to make a play for him.
by BBFan1 on Jun 20, 2008 4:53 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I do not think you couls be more wrong
Our Latin American owner has overseen the assembly of the team with the highest percentage of African Americans on its roster. Last I checked Omar Minaya was the GM in NY, and our GM is African American. Using YOUR logic I would think Arte was an African American.
Arte does not give a shit about any of that he just wants to win. Jesus, WTF?
Seattle I would like to thank you for sucking. It allows me to get back to my roots: Hating Fremont.
by hauldog on Jun 21, 2008 1:48 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Another reason why we need to let free agents walk
Garland should fetch a decent draft pick. Figgins definitely would. Even Darren Oliver will net some workable human. We don’t get a draft pick when we buy out G.A.’s option, do we?
by mattwelch on Jun 19, 2008 6:54 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
They would need to offer GA arbitration
Which is risky, since GA would probably accept
Get rid of Quinlan
by edhoo on Jun 20, 2008 2:47 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Also could take a hit if we get CC Sabathia According to
by WillGoAngels27 on Jun 19, 2008 7:47 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I Can See That Lit Up Halo All The Way In AZ.
by WillGoAngels27 on Jun 19, 2008 7:48 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
More Texeria Rumors for the angels
I Can See That Lit Up Halo All The Way In AZ.
by WillGoAngels27 on Jun 19, 2008 7:57 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Prospects
I see the Angels contending for the forseeable future.
C Naps/Mathis are at least a league average platoon even with their horrible averages.
1B Kotch is young and plenty of years ahead of him
2B Uhhh we aren’t going to have to worry about 2B for a long time
SS Aybar has shown flashes of great play but certainly needs to improve, Izturis is not a horrible option at all
3B Figgins isn’t old by any means if they plan on keeping him.
4 OF Spots and DH: Hunter has a few more years in him for sure although the last few I might worry about, Vlad will probably be resigned and still be a decent middle of the order guy. He’s had horrible stretches this year but seemed to have turned in on a bit lately. Willits is a great OBP and young. Bourjos is doing well enough to be considered a decent prospect. Morales should serve as our DH next year once either GMJ/GA is gone.
Pitching: Lackey isn’t old, Weaver is young, Saunders and Santana are young, Walden and Reckling are very young. The bullpen has some young prospects like Arredondo, Aldridge, Marek.
So yea the Angels aren’t loaded in the minors at all right now, but they have a young foundation already at the Major League level.
by MH252525 on Jun 19, 2008 9:29 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Agree.....We are WAY TOO YOUNG for Rev to be saying that we are toast in 2009/10.....
Kotch, Howizle, Santana, Saunders, Naps, Mathis, Morales, Aybar should be getting into their prime when those years come around.
Put Kendry Morales at 1B, and move Sean Rodriguez to 3B......NOW LETS GO WIN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
by acuda27 on Jun 19, 2008 10:26 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
It's more a matter of not having depth
for injuries. Remember how Joe Saunders bailed the Angels out when Colon or whoever wasn’t around to get it done?
Witty .sig goes here.
by scareduck on Jun 20, 2008 8:47 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Figgins has a nice skill-set
that should age reasonably well, but the career graveyards are full of speedy guys who lose their wheels and fall off the face of the earth.
Witty .sig goes here.
by scareduck on Jun 20, 2008 8:47 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
This comment comes out of love for the player but ...
Ain’t gonna happen to our Desmond. No matter how much you try to scare us duckie
Don't call me Desmond
by highlandhalo on Jun 20, 2008 2:11 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Year after Year it is the same predictions
One year you will finally get it right!
Seattle I would like to thank you for sucking. It allows me to get back to my roots: Hating Fremont.
by hauldog on Jun 21, 2008 1:49 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
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