Frankie and Dominance
This is cross posted at my site, but I figured there's more discussion here, so I'm cross posting.
My last two posts (regarding the impact of the Teixeira trade) have prompted comments regarding the potential (probable?) departure of Frankie Rodriguez following this season. MSS thinks his leaving will be good for the Angels, as he is apparently no longer the "great reliever he once was". Meanwhile Anonymous thinks we won't miss his antics after all of those saves "he almost blows".
So for MSS, is a 26 year old closer with almost 200 career saves who, by the way, just learned a new pitch no longer dominant, even while still saving well over 90% of his chances? He just dropped his ERA to 2.42, saving a 1-0 game, while retiring the games best player, and one of the AL's best hitters in the process. He made A-Rod look stupid on a 3-2 change up, a pitch he didn't even know how to throw before this season. Does anyone doubt that in a year or two, he'll probably also add a splitter to he repertoire? He is not only still dominating, he's learning while doing it. Oh, and for good measure, one of the guys you'd probably list as dominant, Mariano Rivera, he couldn't get it done tonight. Big L next to his name in the box score.
And Anonymous, does this count as one of the saves he "almost" blew? I mean, he did throw three balls to A-Rod before making him look stupid in the process. And those two fly balls he gave up were only about 70 feet from going out. Yes occasionally Frankie makes things more interesting than we'd like. What closer doesn't? Troy Percival, God love him (heck, I sponsor his B-R page) wasn't always without drama. Bryan Harvey seemed like he always walked the bases loaded before striking out the side. But I think there's a tendency to remember the drama, and unfortunately the failures, more than the successes.
You can count on one hand the guys who have been dominant over Frankie's tenure in his role. Rivera, maybe Wagner, Nathan, and who else? Frankie has been part of that group for four years now, and he's much younger than all of them. Though his save totals have been high, his work rate hasn't been outrageous. You have to ask yourself, why are there so few guys on that list? It's because it's not easy to perform at that level year in year out. That's why guys like Derek Turnbow and Joe Borowski can look great one year, and get cut the next. There are very few closers with long track records of sustained success. And of those three mentioned above, Wagner's got an ERA over 8.00 in the post-season.
So you can cheer the departure of Frankie all you want, but it will, without a doubt, weaken the Angels. They will be worse without him.
I've said this so many times I may as well get it tattooed on my forehead, but here it is again, in boldface. The comparison is not between what Frankie is and what Frankie could be, or was for one great season, or what you wish he would be. The comparison is between what Frankie is and what currently exists in the game. Regardless of the fact that he no longer mows through three innings in 25 pitches with six strikeouts, like he did in 2002, he's still at the top of an elite group of players who, night in and night out, answer the bell in the last inning and deliver their team to victory. If you can't see that, then I guess I can't help you. But facts are facts, and the fact is Frankie is one of a select few that turns the vast majority of games he enters into eight inning affairs. And yes, that's a very, very valuable commodity. The Angels will regret the day he signs with someone else.
This Fan-Post is authored by an independent fan. Tell us what you think and how you feel.
5 recs |
68 comments
Comments
Can This Man Get Him Some PANTHER ?
Panther.
by Rev Halofan on Aug 1, 2008 8:31 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I'll give him some Panther...
but as far as us missing him after the day he leaves, I think it was your old lady that you quoted as saying something almost the same, early in the season when people were bitching about Frankie making things nerve racking in the 9th.
So Panther to Missus Halofan too.
Whatever dude.
by Mayheminthehood on Aug 2, 2008 11:19 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I still hold out hope that we sign him.
He wants less money than Tex and there will be fewer powerhouse teams looking for a $15 million closer than another big bat.
~Till the Halo burns out...
by Zu Long on Aug 1, 2008 8:46 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Agreed
The Angels have zero chance at getting Frankie AND Teixeira. I could stand for them to re-sign Frankie.
Witty .sig goes here.
by scareduck on Aug 2, 2008 11:49 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Both
Let’s dream with Morenos big wallet.
Angel Pitching, Angel Defense - get past that.
by vladtheimpaler on Aug 8, 2008 5:02 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Great Post
I’ve been on the fence about resigning K-Rod, trying to convince myself that although he is young, he has a lot of mileage and that sooner or later that will catch up with him. Do I think it is wise to give a closer (or any pticher for that matter) a 5 year deal? No I don’t. Do I think 15 million a year for a closer ties up A LOT of payroll? I do. Do I agree 100% with everything you just said? Absolutely. Frankie’s makeup cannot be discounted and the idea that Shields, Arredondo, or anyone else can just step into the closer’s role and handle it, just because Frankie did it, is folly. I don’t know how this plays out, but it will be a sad day if he is closing for someone else next year. Until then, I’m going to enjoy every moment of this season.
by Rycat512 on Aug 1, 2008 8:51 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
excellent post
we lose Frankie, 9th innings are going to be very unpredictable
by Los Angeles de Anaheim on Aug 1, 2008 8:51 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Well, I'll admit that I can't predict the future
And maybe one of those guys can step in and be nails. But history says it’s not that easy. And I think it’s important to point out that we’ve been very spoiled. Percy took over the role in 1996, and we’ve had 13 years of dominating relief in the ninth inning. Lee Smith was fairly solid before that, so you can make it 14. I think most of us have maybe lost site of just how hard to come by dominant closers can be. Anyone remember Joe Grahe?
by LA Seitz on Aug 1, 2008 9:02 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Or...
DeWayne Buice and Luis Sanchez…
I get everything you are saying Seitz. I just think that if the question is either Frankie or Teixeira I choose the guy who will get 650 PA’s over the guy that throws 65-70 innings – of which maybe 30 are really high leverage. I take my chances with Shields in those tough spots and watch Teixeira rake for 155 games.
But – I agree with every word of your post. I know what the choice is – it is tough, but I choose the bat if it is an either, or proposition. I would LOVE to have them both in 2009 and beyond if they both agree to slightly discounted deals. If Frankie will sign for $12.5 million a year for 4 years and Teixeira inks for $18 million a year for 6 years. I’d do that in an instant. Add in Rivera for 3 years and $24 million and you have a terrific team.
We’ll see how it plays out – it will be interesting this offseason to say the least. Instead of coveting everyone else’s guys – we have to keep some of our own or it could get really interesting next year.
Jim Scully
by jimmuscomp on Aug 1, 2008 9:32 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
good call there
and i’m taking your side in this.
i’d rather have a guy like Tex who will probably aid in more wins than a reliever.
Mike Scioscia: He provides to unlike method of your team member.
by howiestheman on Aug 1, 2008 9:39 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
You mentioned the change up Frankie threw to A-Rod for the strike out.
It proves what I have read about Frankie in interviews. Frankie said his job is not easy to strike three guys out in a row, that after awhile batters figure you out and it gets harder and harder to fool them. The change up pitch he threw today shows Frankie is evolving and adjusting his pitching to the batters and the game to stay effective. I think he will continue to develop his pitches because he realizes what it takes to be as good as he is, and not rely just on a few comfortable pitches like others do in the game.
by 44FAN on Aug 1, 2008 9:04 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
K-Rod
The bottom line with Frankie is if you give him all that money you suck money out of every other contract and make it hard to keep together the team. He also hasn’t had a major injury yet, so he is basically overdue for some maintainence. If they let Teixera go rather than give him the ridiculous money he will want, it may be doable, but it will still be a gamble.
by godzilla29 on Aug 1, 2008 9:30 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
No, people like Gary Matthews Jr suck money out of every other contract.
Signing Franky would be a choice of keeping a highly valuable elite closer on the team as part of the core of great players around which the team is built. Understand this, people. Franky would in no way be a waste of money. He might be more easily replaceable, we might have more obvious options to go to if he should leave, but that doesn’t mean he wouldn’t continue to do exactly what he’d been doing. If the front office desides the money would be better spent elsewhere, that’s one thing, but spending it on Franky would not make the team worse.
*Visiting Angels fan* Never give up, never surrender!
by TheOptimist on Aug 1, 2008 10:01 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
K-Rod's departure will be more devastating than the loss of Glaus was.
There is Frankie …... and then there’s everyone else. This guy won’t shy away from the big stage, and is as competitive as they come. His career record speaks volumes, and needs no further reiteration. We lose him, there’s an Achilles Heel the size of Kevin Youkilis’ head on this team. Give him what he wants.
You ever feel as if your mind had started to erode?
by PieceOfAase on Aug 1, 2008 9:56 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
You hit the nail on the head
doesn’t get rattled. can perform on the big stage. has proved it over time in a closer role. hard to beat that. We currently have no one else we can say that about.
Angel Pitching, Angel Defense - get past that.
by vladtheimpaler on Aug 1, 2008 11:46 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
IF the halos win the World series in 2008..........I dont care what the do with Frankie or Tex
there I said it. lol
http://bills.sportsbloggingnetwork.com/
by norcaliangelsfan on Aug 1, 2008 10:48 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
and no matter how determined we are to fill the internets with our fresh garbage,
none of us will ever sway FO decisions with our opinions or even have a clue as to what or when these decisions will or will not be made. The best thing to do is sit back, ride this season out, and enjoy every minute of it. This off season is going to see changes none of us can even imagine, and it is futile to try to predict it.
by 44FAN on Aug 1, 2008 11:05 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Enoy the ride
Sitting back and riding the season out – I think this is probably the best plan.
K-Rod seems like a polarizing figure, even in what could be a record-breaking saves year.
There are people who think his post-game celebrations are a little too ‘Frankie being Frankie.’
There are people who think $15 million a year for a closer is nuts, when it is closer to market value these days.
There are still people who don’t like K-Rod and think he can be replaced by the next Derrick Turnbow or Kevin Gregg.
There are still people who think he’s going to go and be a glorified mercenary.
There are people who actually have faith in K-Rod.
There are still people who look at the three 40 plus saves years and appreciate his 45 this season, even if he has to adjust to batters more as opposed to dominate hitters.
There are people who think he’s done.
There are people who think he’s one arm injury away from oblivion.
by BBFan1 on Aug 1, 2008 11:45 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Damn
That is one big ass forehead you have LA Seitz.
Not big on tossing that kind of scratch on a relief pitcher. Still think it was a bad contract with M. Rivera, but it isn’t my $$$$.
I know one thing though if they don’t take care of people like Vlad, Figg, JR, Big John, sign HK to some sort of contract taking him out of FA play instead of fighting him in arbitration and the fact they will need another starter when Garland leaves, and a LHP out of the pen with ET being in his walk year it won’t matter because there will not be a lot of games to save.
Willie Mays Aikens is FREeeeeeeee
by Angel Aviator on Aug 1, 2008 11:06 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Question
Would the tattoo also be in Bold Face
Willie Mays Aikens is FREeeeeeeee
by Angel Aviator on Aug 1, 2008 11:07 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Love Frankie
But if he is determined to go to the highest bidder, it might be tempting to let him go with Dondo comming on. Tough one. I think if he stays, it will be because he wants to, because we will be short of the highest bid. That being said, I personally would not have a problem with a 3 or 4 year 15-16 mil a year contract. But that’s just me.
Angel Pitching, Angel Defense - get past that.
by vladtheimpaler on Aug 1, 2008 11:35 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Seriously, I think
Our signing Frankie will have a lot to do with how Dondo does for the rest of the season and through the playoffs.
Angel Pitching, Angel Defense - get past that.
by vladtheimpaler on Aug 1, 2008 11:39 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
SIGN HIM
It’s ridiculous to think that the Angels wouldn’t be in the running to sign him. He’s proven his value—PAY HIM FOR IT.
by yeswecan on Aug 2, 2008 1:59 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Frankie has to be headed to NY ( or back to LAA)
There’s only a few logical destinations, NY Yankees, Mets or Angels. These are all big market teams that share even bigger stages, both of which Frankie loves. Also, these are logically probably the only 3 teams willing to fork over a $15 mil per year for 4-5 years. Obviously Rivera will not be there forever, so it would seem logical that they bring in Frankie to eventually take his place. Of course, for the time being, i’m sure neither of them really want to be a setup man to the other. Mets on the other hand, look like a good destination with adequate money, and there will be no debate who’s closer there.
The Angels, Frankie’s long time team, of course has a good chance. Big contracts, a lot of W’s, etc. Perhaps if the Angels go to the WS or even win it, Frankie may give a few mil hometown discount because Angels win so much. Of course, winning isn’t guarenteed around her.
I love LAC.
by oasisman on Aug 2, 2008 2:07 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
There will be a debate on the mets if Wagner is still there and still getting paid a bunch of money.
His contract ends next year, not this year. The Met’s would probably need to move him if they signed Frankie.
~Till the Halo burns out...
by Zu Long on Aug 2, 2008 10:54 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
My view
Mets - already have a good closer. Yankees - one more year of Mo. Phils - have Lidge. Chicago Sox - Jenks. Cubbies—Kerry Wood, who has a strong emotional tie for the team.
The only major market team I can see Frankie going to for whom there is both an opening and the dollars is the Dodgers. And they’ve got both a GM and a manager dumb enough to pull the trigger on a deal like that.
Witty .sig goes here.
by scareduck on Aug 2, 2008 11:52 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
The Yanks have two more years of Mo.
He’s signed through 2010.
The Cards may play into Frankie as well, much as I hate to say it. Isringhausen is falling apart, and they don’t have anyone young they trust with the ball besides Kyle McClellan. Especially if their bullpen ends up losing them the WC to the Brewers, the Cards might fork over the money for K-Rod due to the instant stability and credibility at the back end that he provides.
They can get $34 million (not including arbitration or salary increases) off the books this year if they don’t pick up the options on dead-weights like Clement and Mulder. Their needs would include a shortstop, a closer, and at least one starter (Rotation after options are declined currently projects as Carpenter, Wainwright, Wellemeyer, Pineiro, ???, since Looper and Lohse are both FA’s after 2008 at the moment).
Interestingly enough though, if they do give him $15 million per yer year, he immediately becomes the highest paid player on the team. In other words, while they are a big enough market to afford it, the Cards modus operandi suggests they wouldn’t go for it.
Otherwise, yeah, it’s the Dodgers and us among the big market teams, I think. Everyone else has either already invested in someone, has much cheaper options and is smart enough to use them, or can’t afford to pay what K-Rod will cost.
~Till the Halo burns out...
by Zu Long on Aug 2, 2008 12:36 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
The Cardinals
Because of the work of Tony LaRussa and Dave Duncan, the Cardinals are probably the only team in baseball that can get away with a non-Frankie, non Rivera type closer.
They can plunk a guy out of the ‘scrap heap’ without paying him $15 million a year and turn the guy into a relief ace.
by BBFan1 on Aug 2, 2008 3:35 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
??? They've had Isringhausen for the past 6 years.
And he’s only been okay, as closers go (nagging injuries + not particularly dominant). Wainwright stepped in during 2006, but he’s just a good pitcher in general.
In any case, they’ve certainly had problems this year, as Ryan Franklin hasn’t really been up to the task.
~Till the Halo burns out...
by Zu Long on Aug 2, 2008 5:17 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Cardinals
Isn’t exactly a great closer and he had problems over the last few years.
The point is they can find guys who can close and while they’d love a K-Rod at the end of games, they know they are one team that doesn’t have to spend $15 million a year for a guy who will do the job.
With other teams, it is more iffy and to have piece of mind, you need a K-Rod/Rivera and a real good closer in the mix.
by BBFan1 on Aug 2, 2008 5:44 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
That's my point.
They DO have the money, if they wanted to spend it. They are a major market team, right up there with the Mets, Cubs and Dodgers in the NL. They have $35 million off the books and only a $100 million budget anyway. They have room. But they haven’t struck me as a team willing to spend that kind of money on one guy.
~Till the Halo burns out...
by Zu Long on Aug 2, 2008 7:30 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
About the Cards
They have far more pressing needs than a lights-out closer.
Witty .sig goes here.
by scareduck on Aug 3, 2008 10:06 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Eighth largest market in the country
And it doesn’t share a team with anyone. If you split all the markets that share teams in half, it’s actually fifth, behind New York, LA, Philly, and Boston. I have a lot of friends back here who are Tigers fans, and the one thing they’re pretty sure of is that the Tigers are going after Frankie. They may not get him, but they’re definitely in the hunt.
by LA Seitz on Aug 3, 2008 5:19 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ignore that post
Put it in the wrong place
by LA Seitz on Aug 3, 2008 5:20 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Less so now that Carpenter is back
and once Wainwright is healthy. I already addressed where their holes would be- SS, a starter, and a closer.
~Till the Halo burns out...
by Zu Long on Aug 4, 2008 11:02 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
You're forgetting about the Tigers
They spend money, and they need serious bullpen help. Mark my words, if Frankie’s not playing for the Angels next season, he’ll be in Detroit. They haven’t had a problem convincing Latin players to go north.
by LA Seitz on Aug 2, 2008 12:54 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
The Tigers problem is that they've already spent their money.
Renteria leaves, and they’ll need a SS, Rogers also goes. The contract increases of their other players completely eradicates that money loss. Every one else on that team is locked up through at least 2009 and most are through 2010.
They’re already second in the MLB in payroll as it is at $138 million. They are in serious need of better starting pitching unless they want to give Dontrell Willis another shot. They flushed the minors in the Cabrera trade.
With needs at SS and starting pitching, plus an already MASSIVE payroll, can they really afford to throw $15 million at a closer? I think the answer is a definitive “no.” They’ll look for a cheaper option, such as letting Zumaya take over or re-hiring Farnsworth if he does a good job.
~Till the Halo burns out...
by Zu Long on Aug 2, 2008 1:03 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Detroit Tigers
They threw $30 million away for three-years for Willis, so if K-Rod is painted as a legitimate option, the Detroit Tigers will go after him.
I don’t think they have the same financial concerns as you would think they have. They are owned by this guy: Mike Ilitch
by BBFan1 on Aug 2, 2008 3:40 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
We're owned by a billionaire, and we have a budget.
They have a budget too. They threw 30 million at Willis because they have problems evaluating starters, as shown by the fact that they also threw money at Nate Robertson. The fact that they have a bunch of money locked up in those two guys is one reason I think they don’t really have the resources to sling money at Frankie. I’m pretty sure locking up Cabrera was their “Vlad” move. They saw a franchise guy on the market and broke the bank to go get him and lock him up.
~Till the Halo burns out...
by Zu Long on Aug 2, 2008 5:23 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
As others have said
the Tigers are not a major market, and they have shot their wad.
Witty .sig goes here.
by scareduck on Aug 3, 2008 10:07 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Detroit is the eighth largest market
And if you split markets in half where there is more than one team, they’re really fifth, behind NY, LA, Philly, and Boston. They’re apparently a much larger market than you think. Illitch is loaded and likes to spend money.
So far there is no indication that he won’t spend more. I have a lot of friends who are Tigers fans back here and the one thing they’re all pretty sure of is that they’ll be in the hunt for Frankie.
by LA Seitz on Aug 3, 2008 5:22 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
What the fanbase thinks will happen and what the team is actually capable of doing are sometimes
two different things. A lot of the Yankee fans I talk to are convinced that that Franky will be coming to New York after this season to be Rivera’s set-up man.
Arte is just as loaded, also likes to spend money, and is in a larger media market, yet despite the fact that we have more money coming off the books and $20 million less on the payroll anyway, Angels fans recognize that he doesn’t have the pocket change to get Frankie and Tex.
Similarly, I don’t think Illitch has the money to go after a replacement for Kenny Rodgers, a new SS and Frankie.
~Till the Halo burns out...
by Zu Long on Aug 4, 2008 11:10 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Interesting, though given that our AAA team is still Edmonton in that study, it may be outdated.
We’ll have to see what study Seitz was using.
~Till the Halo burns out...
by Zu Long on Aug 5, 2008 2:42 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wikipedia lists them as 11th
The one I originially found also included Flint, and may have included Toledo, which is primarily Tiger country (at least it is around where my sister lives), and is only 45 minutes from Detroit, closer than San Bernardino is to Los Angeles. Toledo has roughly 700,000 people, and would push them, by Wikipedia’s numbers, to eighth.
by LA Seitz on Aug 5, 2008 9:53 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Per the 2000 Census
This study had them sixth.
http://wireless.fcc.gov/wlnp/documents/top100.pdf
And that didn’t include Toledo.
by LA Seitz on Aug 5, 2008 9:55 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ilitch
Has a clear history of being a big spender in the NHL and recently decided that he was going to do the same with the Tigers. I would not doubt he keeps them a top 5 payroll.
Seattle I would like to thank you for sucking. It allows me to get back to my roots: Hating Fremont.
Kobe tell me how my ass tastes
by hauldog on Aug 4, 2008 11:24 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
They'll stay a top 5 payroll if he does nothing.
~Till the Halo burns out...
by Zu Long on Aug 4, 2008 11:42 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
The draft
Is a wonderful example of their willingness to outspend other teams.
Seattle I would like to thank you for sucking. It allows me to get back to my roots: Hating Fremont.
Kobe tell me how my ass tastes
by hauldog on Aug 4, 2008 1:32 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
They outspend other teams already.
Having a bigger draft budget is just an extension of that. Still doesn’t explain how the team with the second largest payroll in the 5th largest media market is going to find money for an elite closer, a good SS and a 2nd or 3rd starter.
~Till the Halo burns out...
by Zu Long on Aug 4, 2008 3:45 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Never said they would get all of those.
I doubt they get Frankie
Seattle I would like to thank you for sucking. It allows me to get back to my roots: Hating Fremont.
Kobe tell me how my ass tastes
by hauldog on Aug 4, 2008 4:06 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
The Tigers
Don’t have to break the bank to get all of those. Hopefully Bonderman recovers, get a breakout performance, get a guy on the cheap.
As far as a good shortstop, they have Ramon Santiago who is basically their Maicer Izturis, if Edgar Renteria is canned.
They also dumped Pudge.
I don’t see how you cannot think they are simply cash-strapped and will not be able to afford to bring another guy in. Didn’t they sign that Cabrera guy to a long-term deal.
They probably have as good a shot to sign K-Rod and they might even traded K-Rod lite [Zumaya] to get some of the talent you mention they have to fill.
by BBFan1 on Aug 5, 2008 1:46 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ramon Santiago is not Maicer Izturis
The last time he played something close to a full season was 2003. They will need a real SS when Renteria’s contract runs out.
Bonderman has “hopefully” been on the verge of a breakout performance since the other side of forever. It hasn’t happened yet.
They were already going to lose Pudge at the end of the year. They have replaced Pudge with Inge whom signed to four years anyway.
And why would they trade Zumaya when the could keep him, put him at closer, and fill both their other needs for the same amount of money that K-Rod costs?
Signing that Cabrera guy (not to mention Willis) long term is the main reason I don’t think they have the money to add yet another star-level salary to their payroll.
~Till the Halo burns out...
by Zu Long on Aug 5, 2008 11:04 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Not very many people/SS
Can compare to Iz. Way to stick up for our boys.
Angel Pitching, Angel Defense - get past that.
by vladtheimpaler on Aug 8, 2008 5:05 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
And for those who continue to cite his violent delivery as certain doom...
...please remind me how many arm/shoulder injuries he has incurred thus far?
I hope Harden wins 10 more games for the Cubs. Ha!
by 101halo on Aug 2, 2008 2:29 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
We pay Frankie $10 million ALREADY
If we sign him, we’re increasing payroll by just $5-8 million or thereabouts. Sign Teix, and it’s a positional increase more violent even than Frankie’s delivery.
G.A.+Garland+Oliver+Quinlan = around $26 million, depending on how you measure it. I’d be perfectly happy spending that exact sum on Teix & Frankie, but I would settle for Frankie + raises/extensions, if I had some sense that we were going to stick a difference-making bat in left field to complement Kendry at 1B. If we sign Teix, though, Vladdie might be gone after ‘09. Which, depending on how real & sharp his decline is, might not be a horrible thing.
I sure do wish we’d package Izturis and a bunch of other parts (Rivera, if we still own his contract … and maybe others) for Matt Kemp. The Dodgers are retards, and we need a young thumper in left. At any rate, we know one thing for sure—we have WAAAAAYYY too many ML-ready shortstops and WAAAAAYYYY too few young outfielders. Something’s got to give.
Meanwhile, we’re favorites to win the World Series, which isn’t a bad place to be.
by mattwelch on Aug 2, 2008 7:41 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
maybe a Holliday trade, too?
i know we’ve had our eye on him, i just don’t know if it would be the best idea
Mike Scioscia: He provides to unlike method of your team member.
by howiestheman on Aug 2, 2008 9:53 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
We've actually got several good outfield prospects, they're just a few years away.
That’s why I feel re-signing Rivera to a three-year deal would be the best move. By the time the deal is up, Peter Bourjos, Chris Pettit, and Clay Fuller will all probably be major league ready, and Angel Castillo would only be a year or two away (Pettit will be ready a lot sooner than that, IMO, but Vlad’s going to switch to DH if he comes back ofter ‘09 anyway).
~Till the Halo burns out...
by Zu Long on Aug 2, 2008 11:00 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
A lot can happen in that time though, Zu...
Petit may be ready sooner. He is playing his age 23 season in AA. He has had more success than I thought – so I’ll give you that.
Fuller looks great, but he’s 21 in Low-A ball. Let’s see how he’s doing at AA before we project him to the bigs.
Bourjos has a decent walk rate and is 21 in High-A. I guess he has a chance too.
Hope they all pan out – I just think that if one becomes a starter that would be great, two would be stunning.
Jim Scully
by jimmuscomp on Aug 2, 2008 12:42 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm admittedly biased where Pettit is concerned, I just really like that guy.
Bourjos had a great ST, and Fuller as you say, is a ways away. But we’ve got at least one outfield spot locked up for the next five years in Hunter. If we sign Juan to a three year deal, that means we only have one outfield spot to worry about after ‘09 and I think one of either Pettit or Bourjos will be ready for that. There’s also the question of moving FIggy back to left to make room for Wood or S-Rod, or possibly even converting one of those guys to outfield.
One of the reasons I think we made the move for Tex this year is that what we decide this off-season season will determine the next 3-4 years. We’re coming to the end of the 2004 “cycle”, as I think of it, and we’ve got a ton of options for where we want to go from here.
~Till the Halo burns out...
by Zu Long on Aug 2, 2008 7:26 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Stu Long -
the man who knows all things baseball….......you’re a handy man to have around :)
http://bills.sportsbloggingnetwork.com/
by norcaliangelsfan on Aug 3, 2008 1:37 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
You write well, my man. And I agree with your sentiment wholeheartedly.
Whatever dude.
by Mayheminthehood on Aug 2, 2008 11:27 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Bandwagoner
Francisco Rodriguez: 191 career saves. 2 career Panthers, tied with Hector Carrasco.
by Stirrups on Aug 3, 2008 9:16 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Snark HOFer!
Don't call me Desmond
by highlandhalo on Aug 5, 2008 10:12 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

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