Offseason Topic: Best Baseball Player of All Time
by PhiSlamma on Jan 18, 2009 8:16 AM PST
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PrintMy case: George Herman Ruth, Jr.
The Great Bambino is without a doubt the greatest baseball player of all-time....well in my mind anyway. This argument can be really hard to make, for certain. So many players, stats, era to compare. But I will start at Babe's best year (well most mind blowing to me) in my mind and work from there.
The year was 1919.
Mr Ruth started 15 games for the Red Sox, and pitched the last pitch in 12 of those games. He had 9 wins, a 2.97 ERA and even a save.
I know what you are thinking, 12 complete games and 9 wins and one measly save, wow, what an awesome year!
Ok, Mr Skeptic McDouchington, how about if you take this into your tiny mind-muffin you call a brain:
The Babe lead the league that year in:
Home Runs
On-Base Percentage
Runs Batted In
Runs
Slugging
and Total Bases
He ranked second in walks, seventh in batting average, fifth in walks, tied for 6th for triples, and even cracked the top 20 in hits.
So the line that year of a 9 win, sub 3 ERA pitcher was a mind-blowing:
G: 130
R:103
H:139
2B: 34
3B: 12
HR: 29
RBI: 114
BB: 104
.322 Avg .454 OBP .657 SLG.
Absolutely astonishing. This year was not even close to his best pitching year (1916) or his best hitting year (1927) but it illustrates my point exactly:
Babe Ruth was a freak of nature hybrid super-human hotdog eating homerun hitting pitching hitting womanizing machine.
And he is the best player to ever play the game of baseball....
Pitching:
Early in his career Babe was an absolute monster on the mound. In the three year strech of 1915-1917 he had a total of 65 wins, with a modest 2.06 ERA in that time. In that same stretch he also had seventy-four complete games.
74.
Put your Natrual Ice Light down for a second and really think about that. The leader in shutouts in 2008 was Roy Holliday recording 9. It would take about 9 years at that rate to match Babe's three year span of 1915-1917.
It would take Jon Garland 74 years. If Jon started this in 1917 and pitched every year until he matched 74 shutouts at his blistering pace of 1 a year, he would have finished his remarkable run in 1991, a mere 12 years after he was actually born.
Back to Ruth, lets look at his 1916 year of pitching.
With 28 wins (3rd in the AL) and a microscopic 1.75 ERA (led the league) you could say his year was nothing but spectacular. While hurling 23 complete games (4th) and 9 shutouts (led the league) he managed quite a low homerun rate.
He gave up zero home runs.
Hitting:
Ruth was not only a monster hitter, but for his time he was so disproportional to his peers it hurts my brain.
1927 is probably the most insane feats of any player in any sports based on the proformance of everyone else in the sport at the time.
Quick stat breakdown:
AB:540 R:158 H:192 2B:29 3B:9 HR:60 RBI:164 TB:417 AVG:.356 OBP:476 SLG:.772
Bambino led or was in the top 10 of every stastical offensive catagorey, you can check for yourself here http://www.baseball-almanac.com/yearly/yr1927a.shtml
The one thing I would really point out are his power numbers. Sixty homeruns was so absurb in 1927 that it needs to be explained against entire other teams that year.
Babes 60 home runs led the league, the runner-up was Lou Gherig with 47, then the drop off to 18, 17, 15, 14, 13, 12, 9, 9.
The distance between Lou and Babe of 13 home runs (or 22% of Ruth's total) isn't all too impressive, however the drop to 3rd at 18 (70% less) is.
Babe Ruth out homered the entire line-ups that year of the Phillies, A's, Browns, Pirates, Tigers, Robins, Braves, White Sox, Red Sox, and Indians.
So, more specifically, his bat alone hit more home runs than 75% of the teams in baseball.
Babe Ruth, in 1927, hit more homeruns than the Boston Red Sox and the Cleveland Indians COMBINED.
There is so many more stats to get into, but I wont as to not make this post any longer. I just always loved the absolute beat that was The Babe, and think he is unmatched in any era.
A final word:
All-time ranks
- 3rd on all-time home run list with 714
- 10th on all-time batting average list with .342
- 2nd on all-time RBI list with 2,217
- 1st on all-time slugging % with 0.690
- 2nd on all-time on-base % list with .474
- 1st on all-time OPS with 1.164
- 4th on all-time runs list with 2,174
- 6th on all-time total bases list with 5,793
- 3rd on all-time bases on balls list with 2,062
Who, in your mind, is the greatest player of all time and WHY?
This Fan-Post is authored by an independent fan. Tell us what you think and how you feel.
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Gary Matthews Jr.......FTW
12/19/08 - Thank you KLJ for coming into my life.
by norcaliangelsfan on Jan 18, 2009 10:51 AM PST up reply actions
no dude
Jeff Mathis FTW
Kotch would've had that.
by howiestheman on Jan 18, 2009 2:03 PM PST up reply actions
touchee
12/19/08 - Thank you KLJ for coming into my life.
by norcaliangelsfan on Jan 18, 2009 4:24 PM PST up reply actions
If Reggie Willits used a time machine to pop back up in 1920...
his modern diet, modern training, and modern experience would make him a perennial all-star. COnsidering the HOF voting from those earlier years, he might even be in our HOF today.
Conversely, if Babe Ruth rode that time machine back to today, he would be Manny Ramirez all over. And a Boras client.
Lou Gehrig
I will not back this up with facts.
EVERYONE said Ruth when I was growing up. I attempted to break from this tradition by saying Gehrig.
Over time, though, I’ve come to have an appreciation for him as one of the greatest players ever.
Light Up That Halo!
When you out homer the entire league in a season. Nuff said. Babe Ruth.
I guess I already used my Manny bomb for the month?
Babe. Period.
And I’d love to know where he would rank in the all-time stats if you took away the steroid users.
I don't know...I'm makin' this up as I go.
You'd have to take away the Babe's cocaine then.
"…he has a 2 seam ‘heavy’ fastball that has sink but he does not throw a ‘sinker’." Angel Aviator on Jake Peavy.
by GarretSaysSuckIt on Jan 19, 2009 3:25 PM PST up reply actions
Gorman Thomas
If Babe Ruth were playing today he would be no better than Gorman Thomas … watch the videos of Ruth bashing those lobbed tomatoes – he often takes two steps up in the batters box as the pitch is in flight… Over half the pitchers in those days threw 70 mph and with only 7 teams to play against Ruth had the advantage of knowing pitchers very well having seen them many, many times.
Barry Bonds was the greatest baseball player ever. It is too bad he added to his greatness with silicone boobs and nutshrinking clear-flavored malts late in his career, but he was the most superior player the game has ever seen.
that's assuming
that Babe would only have the skills now that he had back then, which is false.
he would’ve seen these harder throwing pitchers throughout his minor league/early career, thereby adjusting to them.
it’s all speculation when it comes to comparing players from different eras.
Bonds was a really good player before his SF days (he wasn’t the best, just very good)… when he hit SF is when he became something totally unreal (pun intended). it’s hard to pinpoint an exact time of alleged illegal activity, but it seems to coincide with his move to the Bay Area.
anyway, my point is that Babe was the best player the game has seen. Barry was the best aided player the game has ever seen
Kotch would've had that.
by howiestheman on Jan 18, 2009 3:46 PM PST up reply actions
Bonds was merely average among the great.
Perhaps the greatest of recent times, sure.
One of the greatest of all times, Ok.
But compare his accomplishments against the other 19 out of the all time top 20. Among the that elite group, he is average. And many of his peers competed in dead ball eras, and/or higher mound eras.
Here, by way of example, is where Bonds fits in home runs throughout his career. HR’s is where Bonds has his greatest reputation. The black arrow represents the latest point in time of his career (as researched, investigated and reported by Mark Fainaru-Wada and Lance Williams) when he begain juicing. Note that compared to his peers among the greatest, he was actually tracking below average for the front half of his career.
Interesting
He did nab 500 bases.
I think Bonds is the only player to ever hit 500 HR’s and have 500 SB’s.
A pipeline of talent, welcome to Anaheim.
For most of Ruth's career...
…ground rule doubles were ruled as home runs, so you’d have to think his numbers are also inflated.
Bonds would have been done years ago without the drugs. He was a hall of famer before the drugs, and a great player, but he wasn’t the most superior player then and he wasn’t the freak he became. He destroyed his reputation through narcicism, ego and envy.
I see red people
Shea Hillenbrand
during his Angel year – Hell Yeah- best on the field, and most inspirational in the clubhouse.
Go ask him
Kelly Leak (1976)
Could throw the ball from beyond the warning track to home plate on the fly.
Hit over .900.
Could cover all three outfield positions at once.
Led a terrible team to the championship game.
Smoked and rode a Harley.
Tanner Boyle (1976)
Grit, spunk, and an ass-kicker attitude. What more does a ballplayer need?
"Playoffs?? Don’t talk about — playoffs? You kidding me? Playoffs? I just hope we can win a game!"
by Fan Since 1981 on Jan 18, 2009 6:59 PM PST up reply actions
The Mick
In any analysis of stats, The Babe will come out on top. But he was playing against a limited population of white Americans. Also, Babe Ruth’s postseason record was not overwhelming.
In the 50’s, the entire hemisphere was playing for the same 16 teams (and a much higher USA population too). Yet, Mickey still dominated, and his postseason appearances with production were off the charts.
1939 Hall of Fame Ballot
Was the first ballot. Ruth finished second Ty Cobb who is considered the best baseball player of the dead ball era.
Ty Cobb
man revolutionized the running game
The Los Angeles Angels of Anaheim, Specializing in maniac-ball since 2000
Not only running game
man could hit. .300 hitter 20+ seasons in a row. A better player than Ichiro. Would go into the stands and fight. He was intense. The only season he didn’t hit .300 was his rookie year.
When the hall of fame opened in 1936, he was on the ballot with Ruth and others. He had 22 of 26 first place ballots and finished way ahead of Ruth. This was in 1936.
He also showed that he could hit for pop, but that wasn’t his game. He had five homers in two games when Ruth made a big deal about it and went 6 for 6. He’s just a different type of player.
Then there’s Willie Mays, arguably sandwiched between Cobb and Ruth. However. Who’s the best pitcher of all time? Start with the modern era. Why was Tom Seaver elected with unanimity to the hall? How about Koufax and Drysdale? What about Nolan Ryan and Bob Gibson? Steve Carlton? Whitey Ford? rtc. etc.
Then you get into the old names
That weekend for Cobb
Still gives him the record for most total bases in a game. We all knew about his hitting abilities (4192 hits, holy hell. If it weren’t for Pete Rose it would be unfathomable to think someone would ever touch that). But yeah, that fire that he brought to the ball park day in and day out was something that had never been seen on the diamond before. Sure brushing guys off the plate with regularity was more than common, and baseball players from other teams generally didn’t like each other, but Cobb was something else.
As far as pitchers are concernedl; I’m going Walter Johnson and Christy Matthewson. Koufax was mazing, but his arm exploded (granted he did play for what, 5 years, in constant pain before hanging em up. As good as Ryan was, he was also quite bad. Most walks given up in a career, most wild pitches in a career, third most losses (the most in the “modern” era though), and 9th most hit batters. Is he HOF, yes, 5714 k’s is ridiculous. Yet, I believe he is one of the “good” HOF’s, not one of the “great” ones.
The Big Train, was a monster in his day (both literally and figueratively). in 1913 he won 40% of his teams games (36 out of 90) one of two pitchers with more than 400 wins, a career ERA of 2.17 (are you f’in kidding me). That and nobody threw a baseball 95+ in his time. Christy Matthewson was equally as phenomenal. 3rd all time in wins, a career ERA of 2.13 (let me put my eyes back) and in the 1905 WS pitched 27 scoreless innings over a 6 day period (a feat that has never been matched).
You know what would be fun, creating an all time lineup. Just to see what people come up with. Yup think I’m gonna do that.
The Los Angeles Angels of Anaheim, Specializing in maniac-ball since 2000
by halofan4life on Jan 19, 2009 8:12 AM PST up reply actions
Rusty Kuntz
Just because he has a kick ass name!
Lamest poster of all-time.
by ineptituderunsamok on Jan 18, 2009 11:19 PM PST reply actions
Insert Dick Pole quip here __________.
Call the cops, Martha ... Something's amiss over at Room 52 at the Ivanhoe Motel on Katella.
Okay...
Insert Dick Pole.
"…he has a 2 seam ‘heavy’ fastball that has sink but he does not throw a ‘sinker’." Angel Aviator on Jake Peavy.
by GarretSaysSuckIt on Jan 19, 2009 3:27 PM PST up reply actions
that's what she said!
Kotch would've had that.
by howiestheman on Jan 19, 2009 5:33 PM PST up reply actions
Ah...
The inspiration for my fantasy baseball team name for the past few years: Rusty’s Kuntz. Do you suppose a day has EVER gone by when he is not ridiculed in some way? I think there was a bowling team at the local old-age home with the same team name. Well at least there should be.
White trashin' the 909
Jim Fregosi
That’s the 10 year old in me speaking.
Angel Pitching, Angel Defense - get past that.
by vladtheimpaler on Jan 19, 2009 12:12 AM PST reply actions
willy mays
definitely one of the greatest players ever to play the game
Watching the Halos from Princeton University. The random Halo fan in a sea of Bosux and Skankee fans.
by princeton11loveshalos on Jan 19, 2009 11:35 AM PST up reply actions
Leroy "Satchel" Paige
Pitched over a hundred no-hitters
Pitched 3 games in ONE day, and won them all
Won a hundred games, lost six, in 3 years with the top Negro pro club
Struck out 23 of the top hitters in the American League in an All-Star game
Would have been fun to see him pitch to the Babe
by SocalAngelFaninOC on Jan 19, 2009 12:57 PM PST reply actions
We're getting even closer...
(It’s about time somebody went into the Negro Leagues for a nomination…)
Close enough!!!
I never saw any of them play, so I defer to other writers/players/observers who would claim that Buck Leonard was the greatest. Some say Josh Gibson, some say Cool Papa Bell, some say Oscar Charleston. I go with the Buck Leonard contingent.
My opinion is that had Josh Gibson or Buck Leonard spent their careers in MLB as equals of all other ballplayers, this thread would be open/shut in their favor.
Sid Finch
He of the 168 MPH fastballs. About as authentic as snipe hunting.
Call the cops, Martha ... Something's amiss over at Room 52 at the Ivanhoe Motel on Katella.
Hank Aaron
"…he has a 2 seam ‘heavy’ fastball that has sink but he does not throw a ‘sinker’." Angel Aviator on Jake Peavy.
by GarretSaysSuckIt on Jan 19, 2009 3:27 PM PST reply actions
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