Read My Lips, No New Free-Agents!!!
by Jay Cal on Nov 20, 2009 10:43 AM PST
75 comments
The void that will be created with the departures of John Lackey, Chone Figgins, Darren Oliver, and Vladimir Guerrero will be felt long after they sign new contracts with their new teams. Lackey is a true number one Ace, Figgins is a true lead off hitter and has great defensive skills, Oliver isn't only a lefty specialist, and Vladimir was the face of the franchise. But like Tony Reagins said on The Drive yesterday, you have to take the emotion out of the business decisions.
We Will Win, With What We Got or Lightning Strikes Twice.
Last year the Halosphere was bent because Mark Teixeira took his U-Haul to New York for a big payday. Some of the Fan Faithful believed in the unproven Kendry Morales. And that investment paid in dividends. Could Brandon Wood produce similarly to Morales? Wood has nothing left to prove in minors. Given an opportunity of having regular at bats and every day play, perhaps he could put together a good season. And if his defense isn't as great as we were once led to believe or his offense never gets started, he can always be platooned with super-utility player Maicer Izturis.
What about Sean O'Sullivan, given a chance to shine could he become the John Lackey of 2002? And with a rotation of Weaver, Santana, Saunders, Kazmir, couldn't the Angels survive with a pitcher like O'Sullivan or Matt Palmer, Trevor Bell, Dustin Moseley or maybe even Anthony Ortega? Those 5 guys gave us 22 wins last year.
With Vladimir Guerrero gone, our Designated Hitter position becomes a platoon position. It allows Bobby Abreu to take a day or two off, from the field. Giving playing time to Gary Matthews Jr. or Reggie Willits. And when days Abreu is in the outfield, Napoli could share time at DH keeping his bat in the line up, which when hot is a nice bat to have.
But why scrimp in save in 2010?
According to MLBTradeRumors, 2011 will see nearly 30 pitchers who will be available to file for Free Agency. Some of the names available in 2011 will be Josh Beckett, Roy Halladay, Cliff Lee, and Ted Lilly. Let alone All-Star catcher Joe Mauer and Albert Pujols.
What better way to celebrate the 50th Anniversary of the Los Angeles Angels of Anaheim's existence than to break the bank for a Lee or Halladay and a Mauer or a Pujols.
The Angels can Win With What We Got.
This Fan-Post is authored by an independent fan. Tell us what you think and how you feel.
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Vlad will return
he was the most productive hitter during the playoffs. They would be idiots not to keep him
Win For Adenhart - R.I.P #34
as will I
There is a reason that normally Reclusive Vladdy did a major autograph signing for the fans recently. It was a goodbye to the fans
Quit Bitching about Wood not playing, The guy does deserve his shot but quit pretending that we have Willie Mays riding the pine
by Sinatrasratpack on Nov 20, 2009 2:56 PM PST up reply actions
that is what I meant
VladdyG was saying that they would be idiots not to take him back and Mattwelch said he would take the bet (as in “you wanna bet”) and I agreed.
I agree with you Antisox that Vladdy wont be back unless he takes a HUGE paycut
Quit Bitching about Wood not playing, The guy does deserve his shot but quit pretending that we have Willie Mays riding the pine
by Sinatrasratpack on Nov 20, 2009 8:18 PM PST up reply actions
I think he will stay and here is why...
1) He’ll come cheap. He’s the type of player who will take a big discount to stay around.
2) The Angels need a DH and there aren’t many full time DH’s as productive as Vlad for the price right now.
3) He can still rake when healthy, his OPS after coming back from injury last year was North of .900.
I’ve heard rumblings of Nick Johnson or Hideki Matsui. Neither of those players are as good a value as Vlad. Matsui will be pricier, Johnson isn’t as good of a hitter. Another option is getting Jason Bay or another OF and then rotating the DH slot. That’s sensible but also more expensive so I wonder how likely that is, although it’s admittedly more likely than a full time DH not named Vlad considering Scioscia’s preference to not having a full time DH.
A-Rod
was the most productive player in the playoffs. That’s one big reason his team won it all.
As for the Angels, there IS another perspective, shared by at least 25% of Angels fans, and that is that Vlad should NOT be signed by the Angels for 2010.
He was the most productive, but he was shit during the WS.
They want power. We want respect...
by SenorChuckles on Nov 20, 2009 1:53 PM PST up reply actions
Seriously,
Your anti-Vlad propaganda is tiring. You’re hardly in any other conversation. It seems like whenever the idea of Vlad being re-signed is brought up in a thread, you pounce. it isn’t necessary. Everyone here knows your stance, you couldn’t jackhammer it into us anymore. so here’s an idea. How about you try getting into other conversations on this blog that don’t involve Vlad? Sounds like a good idea to me. This way people can actually get a feel for who you are and what you bring to the party other than the one-man-band persona you’ve shown so far.
Nick would be proud.
by halofan4life on Nov 20, 2009 2:37 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Excuse me, HF4L, but I was responding to
a rather over the top statement from the Pro-Vlad consortium, which stated: “Vlad will return – he was the most productive hitter during the playoffs. They would be idiots not to keep him” an opinion which I happen to disagree with.
That is the object of a forum such as this, to discuss pros and cons of various players and/or ideas. That’s all I did – I responded to someone’s pro remark, with a counter-remark. There’s no propaganda campaign going on here – I don’t usually bring stuff up, except as a rebuttal – an opposing viewpoint.
I jump in on numerous discussions, on numerous other players, having probably been a Halos fan for longer than you’ve lived, and I’m pretty passionate about it. You are too, and we probably agree on more issues than we disagree on.
True.
We might agree more than we disagree, but, it seems like I only see you beating away at the horse that is “Vlad needs to go.” Hence my comment. And let’s not pull the “I’ve been a Halo fan longer” card, I’m no bandwagoner, and my loyalty runs deep.
Nick would be proud.
by halofan4life on Nov 20, 2009 10:38 PM PST up reply actions
Am I crazy or did HH not just place Vlad at #2 on the All Time Angels list?
We probably wouldn’t have been able to make as many of those playoffs these last 5 years if it wasn’t for Vlad. I understand he single handily did not get us into the World Series this year or others, but are you really going to bash someone whose made you cheer, smile, and be overall amazed by how far someone can crush a ball. Show some heart for this guy. He’s worked his ass off for this team for a long time and It should crush any loyal Halos fan whose seen his talent up close to see him leave.
Win For Adenhart - R.I.P #34
I hope this comment was directed at R.Munkee and not me.
Nick would be proud.
by halofan4life on Nov 21, 2009 10:50 PM PST up reply actions
yeah, I responded to the wrong message.
I agree with your points clearly
Win For Adenhart - R.I.P #34
Ok, just clarifying.
Nick would be proud.
by halofan4life on Nov 22, 2009 7:59 AM PST up reply actions
What a schmuck
As for the Angels, there IS another perspective, shared by at least 25% of Angels fans, and that is that Vlad should NOT be signed by the Angels for 2010.
Aside from the fact that your data isn’t presented, your claim leaves unsaid that 75% of Angel fans DO want Vlad re-signed.
Men have been elected President of the United States on far smaller margin of victories.
Time for you to find a new act. This drum you’ve been beating is worn out to the point that you’re providing statements which undercut your chosen point of view.
"He's not a Rhodes Scholar to begin with''~Theo Epstein, talking about Papelbon
by George Kaplan on Nov 20, 2009 7:26 PM PST up reply actions
Hey George?
Ivory called. They want their box back.
<img src=“”http://s428.photobucket.com/albums/qq4/RMunkee/?action=view¤t=soap-box.jpg" target="_blank">
"/>
Go ahead,
blame ME. LOL. I certainly isn’t the system here, with confusing graphics insertion, and NO editing available.
No problem, though – you DO see the photo, don’t you? Thanks for being an ass, though. Your constructive criticism is appreciated. Next time, just pull the pin:
<img src=“”http://s428.photobucket.com/albums/qq4/RMunkee/?action=view¤t=Grenade-complaint.jpg" target="_blank">
"/>
Your post is superfluous
Like everything else you upchuck here—
We already knew you stink out loud when it comes to using graphics. There was no need to prove it again. And, no, the graphics insertion methodology isn’t “confusing”—you’re just not really bright.
"He's not a Rhodes Scholar to begin with''~Theo Epstein, talking about Papelbon
by George Kaplan on Nov 22, 2009 8:29 PM PST up reply actions
Thanks for proving me right
"He's not a Rhodes Scholar to begin with''~Theo Epstein, talking about Papelbon
by George Kaplan on Nov 21, 2009 7:56 AM PST up reply actions
Congratulations
You finally figured out that oh-so-complex graphics function.
The rest of your post is USDA Certified Content-Free, but that simply provides assurances of its authenticity.
"He's not a Rhodes Scholar to begin with''~Theo Epstein, talking about Papelbon
by George Kaplan on Nov 24, 2009 6:48 PM PST up reply actions
What if Vlad wants more money?
Ninja was talking about the opportunities to get a deal done a few years back and now. If Vlad wanted to stay to would have taken the deal. Hes gone, its hurts me to say it. :(
They want power. We want respect...
by SenorChuckles on Nov 20, 2009 1:55 PM PST up reply actions
Uhhhh....
Vlad didn’t get a deal done a few years ago and it’s to his detriment now. He’s not gonna get nearly the money he would have been offered a few years back.
Vlad wants to stay, he’s said as much and he wants mama to stay put where she is. He will come at a discount now, and I say it’s 50-50 if he comes back.
Peanuts...Get your Overpriced Peanuts!
by Angel Hawker on Nov 20, 2009 2:03 PM PST up reply actions
Thanks for igniting mindless "we will win with what we got" postings.
I guess 2011 will officially bury that one.
What do you need a fancy suit for, Charlie, you ain't got no job to wear it to.
by clover_black on Nov 20, 2009 11:17 AM PST reply actions 1 recs
We Will Win With What We Got We Will Win With What We Got We Will Win With What We Got We Will Win With What We Got
For some offseason fun, check out the Mac & Windows Space Shooter game I helped make: Insectoid
the horror!
we didn’t win with what we gotted.
:(
What do you need a fancy suit for, Charlie, you ain't got no job to wear it to.
by clover_black on Nov 20, 2009 11:21 AM PST up reply actions
tell that to Boston, Seattle, Oakland and Texas
We did.
by Rev Halofan on Nov 20, 2009 11:24 AM PST up reply actions
We also told it to the yankees.
in july.
What do you need a fancy suit for, Charlie, you ain't got no job to wear it to.
by clover_black on Nov 20, 2009 2:49 PM PST up reply actions
Goat in the Gutter Beer Garden
“Gotted” reminds me of the German Goat in the Gutter Beer Garden in Hikkaduwa, Sri Lanka! I wonder if Jim Gott ever had a beer there!
Is it sad to think that anyone around my age (22) or younger...
won’t get the reference in your subject line.
And if you really feel this way, would you be willing to sign a “No New Free Agents” pledge?
where do I sign?
Without any changes I’m positive the Angels can win the West. Even if Lackey signs with an in-division rival. Could they get over the hump in the ALDS, I certainly think so. The ALCS and World Series are two different animals, but I’m pretty confident that this team can take the Angels back to the big games.
RIP Nick Adenhart 4/9/09
I blog about the Angels at The Diamond Aces
Let's see what the other teams do in the offseason
If the Halos let the remaining FAs walk and replace them from within, and Texas or Seattle decide to spend some money or work trades, it might be just a tad premature to start hoisting the 2010 AL West Champion flag….
Wait until you get to 44 or older. . .
you’ll get that sad feeling pretty much every day.
What we've got can't be bought
no we won't
i do like the prospect of making a big splash in the 2011 free agent pool. and if i knew we would indeed lock up 2 of the premier players available i would wait til then. but there’s no guarantee, and i certainly don’t think we’ll be able to keep up with an improving rangers team if we let our free agents get away.
What we're talking about is...
Offensive production from Figgins and Vlad could be absorbed by Brandon Wood, if he has a break through year. The Halos will need to audition a new lead off hitter. Howie Kendrick, Eric Aybar, maybe – just maybe Gary Matthews Jr. But Wood’s defense is said to be just as good as Figgins. Obviously that doesn’t take into consideration stolen bases and base running.
Pitching wise, Lackey will be a loss, but who is a better alternative on the free agent market? No one. Why spend big bucks on sub-par talent. Reserve the cash for a big name next year. And make it happen.
RIP Nick Adenhart 4/9/09
I blog about the Angels at The Diamond Aces
Lead off hitter?
I heard there’s this guy on the Tigers that is Grrrrrrrreat! Runs fast like that Chad Curtis guy that came up with the Angels. I just can’t think of his name…
I'm going to name my next child
Granderson.
1 line siggy line because I was asked nicely. Go Angels! helpfindscottajob@gmail.com
We also have this RF who has an OBP of .400 and stole 30 bases last year..
if he wouldn’t make a good leadoff hitter then I don’t know who would.
We should just trade for Halladay and sign him to an extension ;)
They want power. We want respect...
Roy would make an Excellent Christmas Present!
Having an ACE Starter like Halladay would give us a better chance to win in the post season.
Wouldn't Bay be a New Free Agent?
I coulda sworn I heard Arty say ’Jason Bay is a player you have to look at…"
Link
But if we only have 12M/yr to spend on new players and Bay already turned down a 15M/yr offer from Bahston,
can we really afford to make a realistic offer?
its called Gamesmanship
if you are Arte you don’t come out and say we have $50 mill to spend so everyone is coming back and we are signing Bay.
You cant give Boras and these guys enough rope to hang you with
Quit Bitching about Wood not playing, The guy does deserve his shot but quit pretending that we have Willie Mays riding the pine
by Sinatrasratpack on Nov 20, 2009 3:00 PM PST up reply actions
yeah say we offer the same 4/60 contract.
12 mil 1st year
13 mil 2nd year
15 mil 3rd year
20 mil 4th year
They want power. We want respect...
by SenorChuckles on Nov 20, 2009 3:00 PM PST up reply actions
Why wouldn't Bay...
be worth pretty much close to what Torii makes? $18mm/year.
I think it will take at LEAST $17mm/yr to snag him. Four years, $64-66mm.
Maybe even 5 years – that’s what Torii got and he was older as I recall.
BTW? In 150 games last year Bay had no E’s.
because Torii
plays center. Much easier to find a LF who can hit than a CF. When you get a package like Torii, you pay up.
also Torii Hunter is Torii Hunter
his persona makes him one of the most valuable players on the team. He always wants the team to step up and play harder. He is by far one of the leaders in the clubhouse
Aybar is a nowhere man, Sitting in his Nowhere Land, Making all his nowhere plans for nobody.
by princeton11loveshalos on Nov 22, 2009 5:36 PM PST up reply actions
mauer, pujols, etc will have extensions signed before they hit the market
and youre nuts if you think the yankees, red sox, mets, etc. wouldnt do whatever it takes for one of those two guys.
its a better class, but thats only on paper RIGHT NOW.
RIP Nick Adenhart
i think ninja just like stoneman wants
to put together a team that is good enough to get into the play-offs and be competitive without being financially foolish. i trust ninja will like stoneman know when to cut bait with our in-house free agents and drop a new line for some new fish. if you think back over the last 10 years, our ex-halos who we let walk definitely had their best years of their career in Anaheim
by thejd on Nov 20, 2009 3:12 PM PST via mobile reply actions
im still not too happy
with bengie not getting re signed.
me and the wonder dog got high!
by YOUknowulovetheIE on Nov 20, 2009 6:13 PM PST up reply actions
YOU THINK
Do you think our missing ingredient last year was someone with a .285 OBP?
RIP Nick Adenhart 4/9/09
I blog about the Angels at The Diamond Aces
i dont miss the obp
but i do miss a catcher who can throw out runners on a consistent basis. the man was never a clubhouse issue and has put up decent numbers ever since leaving the angels.
me and the wonder dog got high!
by YOUknowulovetheIE on Nov 22, 2009 8:11 AM PST up reply actions
We Won't Win With What We're Left With
I think the Angels are pretty solid, but not if they lose all the FAs. I agree with those who say we definitely need an ace starter and a big hitter, and those will not magically appear in the Angels’ lineup, unless Juan Rivera or Mike Napoli decide to man up.
Good call
With mentioning the 2011 free agent class.
I complete agree, lets wait til next year to make a major acquisition.
What happens if the key 2011 free agents sign with their current club BEFORE 2011?
It’s a mistake to expect all the players who have contracts expiring in 2011 will actually be free agents.
True
But most free agents don’t. They like to test the market.
I think Pujols will be the only one not testing the market. Which sucks.
I think he'll end up testing the market and going to the Red Sux
I am fan various years ago.
by Fred Fredrix on Nov 21, 2009 3:04 PM PST up reply actions
i see the machine
staying a career cardinal.
me and the wonder dog got high!
by YOUknowulovetheIE on Nov 22, 2009 8:12 AM PST up reply actions
Call me a pessimist
but I don’t really understand all the faith some of you have in SOS slotting into the rotation. Yeah, he looked good over a few starts, then the league learned him and he got roped. He was pushed way too quickly last year out of necessity. He could still be useful, but I don’t think Reagins is going to settle for just handing him a spot. Ditto to Ortega, Bell, etc. We will pick up SOMEONE to slot into the rotation, and those guys will be the depth.
And this was his first year in the majors
I’m sure O’Sullivan will have just as many ups and downs, but this team can could still win with a four man rotation.
RIP Nick Adenhart 4/9/09
I blog about the Angels at The Diamond Aces
A LOT of pitchers are that way
That is why there is a pitching coach, to analyze why and how the guy is getting lit up, and to work with him to develop another pitch to complement the ones he currently throws. Butcher has shown he has the insight and the patience to work with young pitchers and elevate their game (Saunders, Santana, Weaver, etc.).
You may recall that Saunders began 2007 like a house afire, going 6-0 in his first 9 starts (the team was 8-1 in those games), with a now-considered-respectable 3.48 ERA, and opponents hit .280 /.333 /.422. In the remainder of the season, his last 9 starts saw him go 2-5 (with the team 3-6 in those games), his ERA was 5.47 for that stretch, and opposing teams were hitting .315 /.360 /.468 for those games. He was shut down for “tired arm” but the indications were that he was being figured out by opposing hitting coaches and players. Through working with Butcher he was able to refine his game and become a better pitcher.
Personally, I don’t know if O’Sullivan will be a part of the Angel lineup in 2010, or if he is the new Ron Romanick. But I wouldn’t get too upset if the league adjusted to him in the later days of his first trip through the AL. How he responds to this change in large part will determine how long he will stay in the big leagues.
"He's not a Rhodes Scholar to begin with''~Theo Epstein, talking about Papelbon
by George Kaplan on Nov 28, 2009 5:39 AM PST up reply actions
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