Abreu Signing Signals Chone Figgins Adios
by Rev Halofan on Nov 6, 2009 3:25 AM PST
in Angels News
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PrintThe Angels wasted no time in re-signing Bobby Abreu. The terms appear to be $19 Million Guaranteed money ($9 M each year and a $1 Million buyout for 2012 if they do not pick up the option for then - and it kicks in if Abreu posts 550 PA in 2011 or a combined 1200 PA in 10-11). With team leader Torii Hunter in CF signed thru 2012 and a bargain priced Juan Rivera signed thru 2011, the Angels have a foundation in the outfield to wait for Mike Trout to develop into the Tim Salmon of the future. Some fourth outfielders await in the minor leagues along with Reggie Willits in case there is an injury, but minus Vlad Guerrero in 2010, the Angels look like they can have a healthy rotation of this AARP brigade thru the DH slot.
The near term future seems like the end of the Halo road for Angels 3B Chone Figgins. He could play outfield... but with over $30 million committed there on three guys already in their 30s, and with a league-minimum Brandon Wood bat ready to power the lineup from the hot corner for LA of Anaheim in 2010... this looks like the door is slammed shut on the return of Chone Figgins to play for the Angels. Figgy will be getting $9 million a season easily and his D at 3B makes him irresistible to many teams.
Seriously. It seems the Abreu signing was a goodbye...
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You mean Wood would be a "downgrade" from Figgy
and I agree with that. Figgy already holds the spot so Wood would theoretically be replacing him, not the other way around. That is why I corrected your wording. But I totally agree with your general thesis. The Angels would be significantly weakened at 3b with Wood there instead of Figgy.
Figgy is a Gold Glove 3b
If he doesn’t get it it’s a travesty.
Anyone would basically be a downgrade base upon how Figgy is playing defense.
I agree with you Figgins is great, but
who’s to say Wood wouldn’t be just as good? I don’t know, just askin’. I haven’t seen any metrics on Wood’s defense.
That is one SERIOUS mancrush
"He's not a Rhodes Scholar to begin with''~Theo Epstein, talking about Papelbon
by George Kaplan on Nov 6, 2009 10:29 AM PST up reply actions
Rghan, your site peer, just wrote about this 48hrs ago.
Wood in 2009: .293/.353/.557 with 22 HRs and 1 SB. +18 bat, -8 glove.
Using Sean Smith’s Total Zone defensive estimates, Wood is net negative with the glove, much of that owing to his performance at short, where he is below-average. Meanwhile, he’s neutral at third.
Most of the legend of Wood’s good D has come from anecdotal game reports magnified by fan forum projection and scuttlebutt. Scouting reports have been of the “could be good one day” variety, so hopeful folks just shift the eggs and cups around, and claim he’s good now. The metrics don’t support it yet. He’s average at best, and below average at short.
Sounds like the scouting reports of Figgy at 3B
back in the day … when everyone said he was only good up the middle or in the outfield…
Ponies and butterflies live on wishes.
I’ll stick with outcomes. “Could be good one day” is not an infrequent scouting report. Means nothing more or less than that.
Figgins led the American League in walks and was the best defensive thirdbaseman in the majors per Total Zone, and the other metrics are awfully close. That’s a lot of value, even if the sonofabitch is a zombie with the bat in the postseason.
Sorry, Rev, I just don’t have the crush on Wood some of the boys do. When you spend a lot of time thinking what a big strapping lad with a soul patch “might do for/to us”, that’s a crush. What I see is a mixed bag with some holes in his swing that might turn out to be some of what Troy Glaus was, but without Glaus’ best asset: plate discipline.
Glaus and Downing were the only other players in the last two decades that I can remember who netted 100+ walks for the Angels. I dug those dudes too, so I’ll stick with what I know: the outcomes.
While he is not now ... Wood will become a solid 3B defensively.
I love this team.
by Downing Rules on Nov 6, 2009 2:17 PM PST up reply actions
Yes, but he's still learning third base
He spent more time at short in AAA this year, so didn’t have much room to improve at third. With that in mind, I’d actually consider a neutral showing at the hot corner a pretty encouraging performance. I’d also consider it the baseline, with a lot of room to grow with more experience.
There will undoubtedly be a drop-off from Figgins, but those are the short-term consequences of a long term move. With the talent the AL West -especially Texas – has accrued over the past 2-4 years, we need to make these decisions.
Why?
Why in your estimation does the Abreu signing mean that Figgy is gone?
It is not as if the $19 million committed to Abreu is going to empy Arte’s coffers.
If he had committed $160 million to Sabathia or someone like that I might understand that reasoning….But as Big John said “The financial resources are here..” (paraphrasing).
Also, what has Brandon Wood shown that assures you he is “ready to power the lineup from the hot corner..” ??
Just asking.
Also, if the Angels don’t sign Figgy (and I sincerely hope they do, and think there is a good chance that they will) who do you propose to hit at the top of our lineup in 2010? And please don’t say Erik Aybar.
If not Aybar.
Why not Abreu? He has the skill set as a hitter to hit anywhere from 1-3 in the lineup. 30 steals last season a .400+ OBP. Sounds like a leadoff hitter to me (if necessary).
As far as Wood goes, Am I the only one who remembers what he did with consistent playing time in Aug/Sep of ‘08? Seriously. With consistent playing time the kid can keep up in the bigs. Unfortunately, 90% of his playing time has been sporadic so most everyone thinks “Oh no, here comes another highly touted prospect flop.” Someone HAS to go for Wood to get his shot and Figgy is the one blocking him. And don’t worry, if Wood does flop, we have Izzy to back him up AND leadoff.
Nick would be proud.
I see this BS argument all the time.........
Also, what has Brandon Wood shown that assures you he is "ready to power the lineup from the hot corner.." ??
And the easy and most simple response is………When has he been given the consistant chance?
HE HASNT.
Pass the chocolate cake!
by norcaliangelsfan on Nov 6, 2009 10:53 AM PST up reply actions
I think the answer to that is that he mashes the F out of the ball in AAA
and every fan who has heard of him, on SBN, is wondering why the angels are sitting B-Wood…complete envy that we have this guy.
Could he be a bust? SURE. But give the guy the CHANCE. I’ve seen people throw out the fact that he is hitting .187 in the bigs and looks lost at the plate.
HOLY SHIT! REALLY? Here brandon, take these 4 ABs i give you, and you better hit for the fucking cycle or you’re going back to salt lake.
Its as if he’s the only hot prospect call-up that can’t hit a home run every at bat.
What do you need a fancy suit for, Charlie, you ain't got no job to wear it to.
by clover_black on Nov 6, 2009 11:04 AM PST up reply actions
"He mashed the F out of the ball in AAA"
The same can be said on one Dallas McPherson.
Success in AAA does NOT necessarily equate to success in the Majors.
True.
But you give these players a chance to prove their worth.
At this juncture, chone figgins is old, and is fishing for a huge contract. Wood can either step it up or crash and burn. Kendry Morales wouldn’t have had a spectacular 2009 season if the Angels didn’t put their trust in him.
Mashing AAA = You get the chance to prove your worth in the bigs. Dallas failed. Will B-wood?
Tune-in in 4 months!
What do you need a fancy suit for, Charlie, you ain't got no job to wear it to.
by clover_black on Nov 7, 2009 11:39 AM PST up reply actions
By your logic "norcali.." then EVERY player
just needs a consistent chance and then he will produce.
I think you need to develop some basic critical thinking skills…
In the meantime, Wood has shown NOTHING at this level to inspire confidence.
This is not to say that he can’t or won’t, BUT there is nothing to indicate it at the MLB level.
I think I'm gonna continue to pimp Wood's ONLY consistant playing time stats.
Well......
my argument has always been that if you already have a fixture in place; i.e., someone who is integral to your teams’ success (and Figgy most definitely qualifies) , then assuming the finances are not unreasonable (don’t think they would be in Figgy’s case), and they player is not well past his prime (Figgy definitely is not), then you keep your fixture.
If it ain’t broke, don’t fit it!
And for “Downing” I hope you’re referring to the Ninja’s signing of Figgy — if that is the case then I’m right there with you brother.
Yep, keep Figgins
Then trade Wood, Mathis and a few more players for Roy Halladay.
NOW LET’S GO WIN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I love this team.
by Downing Rules on Nov 6, 2009 10:13 AM PST up reply actions
Hell Na......Im PRO Wood!
Keep Kendry at 1st Base, and put Wood at 3rd. NOW LETS GO WIN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Plus he was missing a few exclamation points : )
Put Kendry Morales at 1B, and move Sean Rodriguez to 3B......NOW LETS GO WIN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
by acuda27 on Nov 6, 2009 10:23 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Looks like you have to change you signature :(
They want power. We want respect...
by SenorChuckles on Nov 6, 2009 10:25 AM PST up reply actions
S-Rod....
will be on the 25 man roster for the Rays next year. While if he was still an Angel he would continue to be blocked. Good for him.
Do it for Nick '09
by BryanHarvey'sMoustache on Nov 6, 2009 10:32 AM PST up reply actions
We've missed you.
And Mr. chuckles is right, time to fix your sig
Nick would be proud.
by halofan4life on Nov 6, 2009 10:37 AM PST up reply actions
Figgins is not worth $10 million per year.
If you can get him for something less than that, then possibly but why let Wood rot any more he needs his shot just like Aybar and K-Mo got theres. Figgins will just block it unless he is let go, which I would not mind.
First we had a Salmon and now we have a Trout, let's see the same results.
There is still a long way (in baseball offseason terms anyway) to go
With the Winter Meetings a month out and players filing for FA yesterday, I think that there is a LOT that could happen in the interim. Personally, I hope we do not get Jason Bay (strikes out to much, possibly Shea Hillensuck, Part II).
If the ninja could pull off another Del Taco miracle, whereby we could get Halladay in the rotation for say, Kendrick (I like him, but we will have to give up good to get good), Saunders (I like the Col., but feel teh Jays will want a SP as well) and a prospect (or GMJ —-hope, hope), then there is a definate 2B need. While Macier could fill, in, I think he is better served as a back-up/Thursday/Sunday player at 2B, SS, and 3B.
My $0.02 anyway….
Downing joining the Angels HOF is a great start, but #5 shouold be retired by the Halos. Make it happen Arte!
by BrianDowningFan on Nov 6, 2009 10:04 AM PST reply actions
Hell we could always play Rivera at 2nd
Anyone remember that?
RIP Nick Adenhart 4/9/09
I blog about the Angels at The Diamond Aces
I completely agree
You said it best – If it ain’t broke don’t fix it! The only way I would maybe be on board with letting Figgy go would be if that money was used to keep Lackey. I think Lackey is even more vital to the Angels.
OK, I'm finally over losing Tex. Thanks Kendry.
Agreed on $10M/season
Would he go for a 4 year $32M with escalators/incentives?
Downing joining the Angels HOF is a great start, but #5 shouold be retired by the Halos. Make it happen Arte!
by BrianDowningFan on Nov 6, 2009 10:06 AM PST reply actions
The only thing that will piss me off
is if FIggy goes to another team and mashes in the post season.
Dude is a ghost, come october, and his speed is on the decline.
I want Troy Glaus 2.0 in the hot corner, that will bring me back to happy times.
What do you need a fancy suit for, Charlie, you ain't got no job to wear it to.
Glaus
If Glaus is healthy finally from the back and shoulder, I agree, bring him back.
by Baylorsgroove on Nov 6, 2009 10:15 AM PST up reply actions
pretty sure he was referring to Wood
being Troy Glaus 2.0.. i wouldn’t particularly enjoy having Glaus 1.0 back on the team, that time has come and gone..
Until spring training starts - let's go Cardinals and Suns!
Bring back Erstad over Power Q!
They want power. We want respect...
by SenorChuckles on Nov 6, 2009 10:22 AM PST up reply actions
Wood
I would be satisfied if Wood gets his ABs in the bigs, for an entire season, and is a complete and utter bust, than to have him at AAA or called up and sit.
What do you need a fancy suit for, Charlie, you ain't got no job to wear it to.
by clover_black on Nov 6, 2009 10:35 AM PST up reply actions
I'd just as soon trade Wood now
And sign Figgy. Wood’s got trade value at this point. If he’s a bust then the Angels got nothin’
OK, I'm finally over losing Tex. Thanks Kendry.
Cant they get a Draft pick if Figgy leaves though?
Pass the chocolate cake!
by norcaliangelsfan on Nov 6, 2009 1:29 PM PST up reply actions
I'd only trade Wood if it meant
Halladay or Adrian Gonzales.
RIP Nick Adenhart 4/9/09
I blog about the Angels at The Diamond Aces
It would obviously have to be a package
Wood is not held in high regard with the majority of teams; although, he would be a good fit for a trade to the Pads.
Light up the Freakin Halo!
If comes down to having to pick between one or the other (Figgins or Lackey)
I go with Big John.
Even with all of his antics, he is still one hack of a pitcher.
This post-season, he showed me that he wants the ball and won’t back down to anyone. The whole think with what he said to Soth in Game 5 was way overblown. If I were teh manager, I would want to hear that from my #1.
Downing joining the Angels HOF is a great start, but #5 shouold be retired by the Halos. Make it happen Arte!
by BrianDowningFan on Nov 6, 2009 10:10 AM PST reply actions
Couldn't agree more
Lackey is the stud we need at the forefront of our rotation. Without him, I’m not sure we win Game 1 against Boston this season and without that win, who knows how that series ends. We need a guy like that every 5 days and at the start of a playoff series.
+1
can’t imagine what game 1s would be like if we let Lackey walk. They might as well not play Game 1, and we could start 0-1 each series. Weaver vs. Sabathia/Becket/Lester? We need Big John.
Lackey's not
a world series #1. Period. If we pay him $100 million we have to do so knowing that.
Figgy is worth more than Abreu. He’s just starting to truly become a great leadoff hitter (the walks and OBP).
He hasn’t hit in the postseason but nobody on our team has. We keep facing True stud #1 starters (lefties) and bullpens in the postseason. And in the case of the Bankees and Red Yanks, they have been getting the ‘superwide’ strike zones to match.
Figgy has also pressed which makes the situation worse, but he’s improved so much in every other phase except a slight dropoff in SB%. We didn’t need Abreu, we do need Figgy desperately and if he would have signed for 4 yrs at $36-$40 million, we blew it.
by Los Angeles de Inglewood on Nov 7, 2009 10:48 AM PST up reply actions
sorry, I meant heck, not hack
Downing joining the Angels HOF is a great start, but #5 shouold be retired by the Halos. Make it happen Arte!
by BrianDowningFan on Nov 6, 2009 10:10 AM PST reply actions
and thing not think
Downing joining the Angels HOF is a great start, but #5 shouold be retired by the Halos. Make it happen Arte!
by BrianDowningFan on Nov 6, 2009 10:11 AM PST reply actions
I was a big Glaus fan as well....
and I begged the Angels not to replace him with crap McPherson. Oh well.
Something tells me though that B. Wood is NOT Troy Glaus 2.0 ….
D-Mac had all the makings of a good to very good major leaguer
His back was just made of flimsy cardboard.
Nick would be proud.
by halofan4life on Nov 6, 2009 10:13 AM PST up reply actions
I tend to agree that Wood will not mash.
He seems like he’s lost at the plate.
However, I felt DMac was ready. He was, but his back was not. Water under the bridge.
I love this team.
by Downing Rules on Nov 6, 2009 10:14 AM PST up reply actions
I agree on B.Wood not being Glaus 2.0
but I do not think he is DMac 2.0 either. He needs to play everyday. A few ABs here and there the past couple of years are not indicative of anything.
Downing joining the Angels HOF is a great start, but #5 shouold be retired by the Halos. Make it happen Arte!
by BrianDowningFan on Nov 6, 2009 10:15 AM PST reply actions
I think the gayest thing about not signing Figgy is...
that he has been shit in the postseason and if he had a great postseason this year than it might have been a different story :(
They want power. We want respect...
small sample size...
(just had to throw that out there)… :)
I love this team.
by Downing Rules on Nov 6, 2009 10:26 AM PST up reply actions
122 AB's isn't a small sample size
I am fan various years ago.
by Fred Fredrix on Nov 6, 2009 10:29 AM PST up reply actions
Not a small sample size at all
Please name another lead off hitter with a bigger sample size than Figgy. The only team that comes to mind with lead off hitters that have been in the playoffs more often than the Angels would be the Yanks and the Sox. Maybe I’m missing some but compare his post season stats to theirs this decade and he falls way short.
Look I love Figgy but it is Wood time. Release Wood, Sign Big John and a power bat and Let’s Go WIN!!!!!!!!!!!
by RedAces on Nov 6, 2009 10:44 AM PST via mobile up reply actions
the gayest thing?
i gotta admit Senor, I dont think I have been down with any of your post.
Do it for Nick '09
by BryanHarvey'sMoustache on Nov 6, 2009 10:30 AM PST up reply actions
He went out shitty as an Angel is what im saying :(
and not with any of my posts? Even the “Nobody puts baby in the corner.”
They want power. We want respect...
by SenorChuckles on Nov 6, 2009 10:54 AM PST up reply actions
its cool, i just get grumpy sometimes...
forget it.
Do it for Nick '09
by BryanHarvey'sMoustache on Nov 7, 2009 10:40 AM PST up reply actions
He is some old guy, with declining speed, and is looking for a 5 year MONEY contract.
It also doesn’t help that he takes mental vacations in october. Aside from 08 where he was decent, but THAT was a small sample size. hah.
We really want to build 3rd base around a guy who is getting slower, when his ONLY asset is his speed?
What do you need a fancy suit for, Charlie, you ain't got no job to wear it to.
by clover_black on Nov 6, 2009 10:42 AM PST up reply actions
ill be the first to admit that was a bit harsh.
figgy was great at BB this season.
Still. I really want some new blood in there.
What do you need a fancy suit for, Charlie, you ain't got no job to wear it to.
by clover_black on Nov 6, 2009 10:44 AM PST up reply actions
I'll miss saying, get figgy with it :(
They want power. We want respect...
by SenorChuckles on Nov 6, 2009 10:57 AM PST up reply actions
now that
is something ill miss.
Thanks for putting the human element into this debate. now i feel guilty.
F it. give him an 8/80 mil.
What do you need a fancy suit for, Charlie, you ain't got no job to wear it to.
by clover_black on Nov 6, 2009 11:08 AM PST up reply actions
8/80? ROFLCOPTER :)
They want power. We want respect...
by SenorChuckles on Nov 6, 2009 11:14 AM PST up reply actions
thats 8 years of GETTING FIGGY WITH IT
you cant say no to that…can you?
What do you need a fancy suit for, Charlie, you ain't got no job to wear it to.
by clover_black on Nov 6, 2009 11:16 AM PST up reply actions
8 glorious years of getting figgy with it.
most definitely I can say yes to that.
They want power. We want respect...
by SenorChuckles on Nov 6, 2009 11:34 AM PST up reply actions
Why not just re-sign Hasagawa
So we can say Shiggy with it.
RIP Nick Adenhart 4/9/09
I blog about the Angels at The Diamond Aces
good wood. bad wood. hard wood. soft wood.
why wood you do that? wood you please stop striking out? wood pecker. peckerwood.
This is so much better than figgy. I retract my 8/80.
What do you need a fancy suit for, Charlie, you ain't got no job to wear it to.
by clover_black on Nov 6, 2009 12:59 PM PST up reply actions
I disagree. I think it signals the goodbye of Vladdy...
Wood will be on the 25 man roster next year, no doubt. But where? We all assume he will be the starting third basemen but I find it equally as likely that, if he doesnt earn the position in pre-season, that he could take Quinlan’s spot on the bench rather than Figgins at 3B.
PLUS, lets say HE DOES take 3B from Figgins. That doesnt mean that Figgy and Abreu cant platoon DH/RF.
I think this is a completely wrong assertion. Signing Bobby A is a sign that Vlad will be returning unless its for peanuts and a secondary role.
Do it for Nick '09
by BryanHarvey'sMoustache on Nov 6, 2009 10:28 AM PST reply actions
CORRECTION: a sign that Vlad will NOT be returning...
Do it for Nick '09
by BryanHarvey'sMoustache on Nov 6, 2009 10:29 AM PST up reply actions
I think you are probably right
makes me sad.
RIP Nick Adenhart 4/9/09
I blog about the Angels at The Diamond Aces
I agree, if nothing else I think Wood will have Q's spot
I am fan various years ago.
by Fred Fredrix on Nov 6, 2009 10:30 AM PST up reply actions
Yes, this is actualy what I am hoping for.
He can spell Figgy, KMo, even Aybar, get some at bats, and we can see if he can really hit in the bigs or not.
Quinlan is moving on, imo.
Check out these games:
Multiplayer Baseball: http://www.mmobaseball.com/createaccount.aspx?ref=9687
Multiplayer Football: http://goallineblitz.com/game/signup.pl?ref=16986650
by matthiasstephan on Nov 7, 2009 3:50 AM PST up reply actions
Good call
I think you’re right about Vlad not coming back. I think I’ll miss him for sentimental reasons more than productive reasons. I can’t help but think how nice it would be to finally have someone in the HOF with an Angels hat. Vladdy is our best shot for awhile. But, if he signs elsewhere that may change things.
OK, I'm finally over losing Tex. Thanks Kendry.
Agreed. This is what the Rev would like to see, not necessarily what will be.
I think Reagins and company are just as likely to trade Wood as to sign Figgins.
Consider what a package of Rivera and Wood might get. It could get possibly net a Carl Crawford, for instance. I could see this being a realistic Halos lineup.
Figgins 3B
Crawford LF
Abreu RF
Morales 1B
Hunter CF
Napoli DH
Kendrick 2B
Mathis/Wilson C
Aybar SS
I wouldn’t even be surprised to see some unlikely players shopped. I could see Napoli being the center of a package for a Roy Halliday, for instance.
There are many ways this off-season could go. I think it’s Lackey that is not likely to return under almost any circumstance. And I would put the likelihood of retaining Vlad at 50% at best. Perhaps only if we trade Napoli does that happen.
I don't see Rivera and Wood
Could land us Crawford.
And I don’t think Napoli would be a center of Halladay trade. I’m not saying he won’t be involved, but I think the center of a Halladay trade must be centered around either Saunders or Santana.
RIP Nick Adenhart 4/9/09
I blog about the Angels at The Diamond Aces
wait wait wait
you telling me that a 2nd rate catcher wont be the center of a trade for a future hall of fame pitcher?
What do you need a fancy suit for, Charlie, you ain't got no job to wear it to.
You want Crawford?
Saunders, Santana or Weaver. Which will you send along with some prospects to get Carl Crawford?
Rev, I'm with you but...........
let’s remember that he has an option to be exercised, and then he’s a free agent.
The Rays have to make a decision on exercising the option, extending him, or trading him. He makes LOTS o’ money. The Rays may decide that he is a lifer, or they may decide to try to get what they can while they can ‘cause they ain’t gonna pay that much money forever.
In which case, the Angels are a possible trade partner ’cause money is not as much an issue, and Maddon knows our prospects and such.
However, Moreno & Company are gunshy about trading for a player who has only one season before free agency.
….Would be interesting, though. Younger than Figgins, potential HOFer, steals bases like Hell.
Oh, Well…………..
That would be an AWESOME lineup Teeth....
That squad would be unmatched in MLB history with good OBP and speed guys at the top of the order. Well maybe except for the Cards of Whitey circa 1984-85. Anyway, I would love that lineup, but just might put Hunter at cleanup and Morales 5th since the first 3 guys are all lefties (Figgy primarily lefty).
Interesting idea, I must say.
my daughter loves him too
I told her the other day he might not be back.
she looked like she was going to cry.
RIP Nick Adenhart 4/9/09
I blog about the Angels at The Diamond Aces
Brianharvey’sMoustache
Brandon Wood would be absolutely put to waste if he takes Q’s spot on that roster. He’s been one of the Angels prized prospects for years now, give him a real chance. Putting Figgins in the outfield is absolutely stupid considering how great of a defensive 3B he is, so why would you take one of his best attributes and throw it out the window? He will NOT be a good outfielder. Signing Abreu is a sign that both, Vlad and Chone, are gone.
Defensive stats indicate Figgins is likely to be just as good in LF as at 3B.
He has the range and the strong arm, and fits the profile of other speedy leftfielders like Crawford and Podsednik. Of course, his defense holds more value at 3B that LF, but that’s another question.
What happened to sticking with outcomes?
"Could be good one day" is not an infrequent scouting report. Means nothing more or less than that.
Now you’re speculating Figgins can play Gold Glove-level LF?
I agree that Figgy is gone.
Take a look at these numbers.
In every category, one of the other four players has a reasonable chance of equalling or surpassing Figgy’s numbers in that category, given equal AB’s. Factor in Figgy’s age, his probable demands for $’s and #/years, a waiting capable cheap slugging replacement in the wings, declining speed, two potential high draft picks.
Figgy’s gone!
Besides, how do we know we’re not also going to trade for Carl Crawford? ;-)
As Bill Stoneman said when he let Glaus walk:
“It might have been different if we didn’t have McPherson.”
i loved Glaus but
He was never healthy the previous 2 seasons to deserve a multi-year contract. I’m sure he would have been an Angel today if he was healthy those 2 years. We talk about Arte wanting to have a HOF. The numbers he was putting up before his injuries were HOF potential with a good glove.
Wood has that potential to make the lineup better. Just the power potential alone where I think our lineup really lacks can be a big boost. since we have a similar player like Aybar its worth the risk in giving Wood his chance and letting Figgins go. Its time to add some potential power to the 3B spot.
by HALO_86 on Nov 6, 2009 12:16 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
I see three players with 30-35 BBs and two with 90-110 BBs.
There’s nothing in those numbers to suggest that Aybar, Izturis or Kendrick will even have an OBP close to .400. Aybar and Kendrick get their OBP almost exclusively from high BABIP, and that’s not sustainable year over year for most players. Izturis is a decent player, but not likely to have nosebleed on-base skills like Abreu and Figgins. What I see is three players with decent batting average who are likely to regress to a .330-345 OBP.
Plus, I don’t get this argument that the Angels only need one player with decent on-base skills. The Angels had their most productive offensive season in franchise history because BOTH Figgins and Abreu were mad on-base machines, and Morales and Hunter did a good job of batting them in.
I’m blown away how many Angels fans are downright enthusiastic about returning to the days of “Hatcher’s happy hackers”. A third of the fanbase is already to install Aybar, with his .324 career OBP, at leadoff because he had good BABIP for a season. Our fanbase really doesn’t understand offense.
He could, yes, but as healthy as he's been, I wouldn't want a sprung hammy...
…to derail what is ultimately a fair contract for both sides. We have a player in his late 30s. We could Jeter-ize Abreu, but frankly I’d like to see him back in the 3-hole, where we was terrific for us in 2009.
I’ll stick with the point I’ve been making elsewhere: one decent on-base guy is not enough. I want to see 3-4 decent on-base guys in the Angels lineup. 3-4 guys who can take 60-80 walks and average an OBP of .360-.380. Y’know, like offensive players that were considered, um, “good” in the 80s and 90s.
Of course Aybar has only one full season under his belt.
If you compare Aybars age 25 season (2009) and Figgy’s first full season at age 26 (2004), they are very very very similar
Nick would be proud.
I think that our guy Aybar could grow into that spot.
RIP Nick Adenhart 4/9/09
I blog about the Angels at The Diamond Aces
I agree.
He’s got the raw skill set, just not as much patience as you’d like to see at the top spot. that’s why I’d put Abreu there if Figgy walks.
Nick would be proud.
I think your love for Figgins is skewing your thinking
First off, I like Figgins…I really do. But, he’s going to be 32-years old, prior to this season his career OBP was .356 (not bad, but certainly not as great as you’re making it out to be), he may age gracefully…or be one sprung hammy away from being a $40M bust (4yr/$10M).
According to baseball-reference the 10 most similar players are:
1. Tony Boeckel (938)
2. Debs Garms (932)
3. Tom McCreery (932)
4. Bob Dillinger (931)
5. Farmer Weaver (926)
6. Emmet Heidrick (924)
7. Gene Richards (923)
8. Jack Rothrock (922)
9. George Stone (921)
10. Bill Barrett (920)
Who the hell are those guys??
Also, he’s played just as many games in RF, why are you not advocating moving him there?
Figgy may have lost 1/2 a step
nothing more, so the man can still run just as fast. As long as he doesn’t get injured he will be the same old Figgy we all know and love…
They want power. We want respect...
Despite Chone Figgins disappearance in the post season
The Angels were only 2 games away from the WS. The main reason we did not play in this years WS was due to the Angels beating themselves with pathetic errors. When you look at what this team accomplished with this lineup this year, the 1 2 of Figgins/Abreu had alot to do with it. Our younger postition players are maturing nicely into fine players and Chone is an intregal part of the nucleus of our lineup at the plate, on the bases, and on the field.
Sign Chone, sign Lackey, and make a splash in the free agent market or make a creative trade. I firmly believe the later will happen.
When I'm not at the stadium, I'd rather be watching my Halos back in Costa Rica!
Good point about only 2 games away, AND .....
we should add that had it not been for effin Fuentes, we’d in all likelihood be talking about the American League Champion Angels (if not the WS Champion Angels), with Figgy having delivered the key winning hit in the 13th Inning of Game 2. That pitch by Fuentes totally changed the perspective on Figgins in PS. Despite his low average he would have been viewed as clutch.
Trade Matthews & Rivera and put Figgins in Left
Free Brandon Wood to play 3rd. Save some salary on the Matthews Rivera trade, sign Lackey.
If it’s let Guerrero walk and bring in Tome, than if it isn’t much different dollar wise, keep Vladdy.
When I'm not at the stadium, I'd rather be watching my Halos back in Costa Rica!
Don't we have some money, from Escobar.
Look Escobar made 10 million last year.
3 million went to Abreu (9 a year, up from 6 (5 plus his incentives) this year).
That is 7 mill to spread around. What is the difference between what Lackey made and wants?? Figgy?
How much cheaper can we get Vlad for?? if we keep him at all??
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by matthiasstephan on Nov 7, 2009 3:52 AM PST up reply actions
age
I do not like the signing because Id rather move Figgins to the outfield,he is younger. I am very disappointed with the signing of a 36/37 year out fielder. We are getting older as a team. Figgins to outfield and wood to 3rd would of been the best choice.
by Ca1IFORNIA ANGELS on Nov 6, 2009 1:44 PM PST reply actions
Getting older as a team?
look at the entire infield, if figgy leaves then its Wood/Aybar/HK/K-Mo/Mathis/Napoli, that doesn’t look old to me. Our rotation has only one guy over 30 and its Lackey. Abreu could DH instead of Vlad (which I would absolutely hate), I have no problem with Hunter, Rivera, Holliday/Bay outfield and Hunter is barely 34, that number might look old but he still has a lot left.
They want power. We want respect...
by SenorChuckles on Nov 6, 2009 2:11 PM PST up reply actions
I think he meant an old OF...
which is where you arguably need your most explosive speed.
I love this team.
by Downing Rules on Nov 6, 2009 2:20 PM PST up reply actions
Speed?
this aint the NFL. We should just hit em out of the park ;)
They want power. We want respect...
by SenorChuckles on Nov 6, 2009 2:24 PM PST up reply actions
Still might happen.
Abreu could become a full time DH. And Figgins could be re-signed and moved to left. Juan to right.
RIP Nick Adenhart 4/9/09
I blog about the Angels at The Diamond Aces
Everyone is complaining about Figgins D in the OF...
but, I think he will produce error-free fielding as an OF given enough games. His errors in center in his “utility years” were definitely related to his constant shifting from IF to OF. If given enough reps, he is going to be a fantastic outfielder as well, IMHO.
I love this team.
by Downing Rules on Nov 6, 2009 2:31 PM PST up reply actions
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