Angels Sign Fernando Rodney
by gary matthews jr. jr. on Dec 23, 2009 1:19 PM PST
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PrintAccording to mlbtraderumors.com the Angels have agreed to a 2 year $11 million deal with former Tigers closer Fernando Rodney. I'm always wary of signing relievers to biggish contracts (see: Speier, Justin) but Rodney is an experienced pitcher with really good stuff and hey, it's not my money.
I've been living in Michigan the past couple of years and have been able to watch him pitch quite a bit. He throws a mid-90s fastball and has one of the most devastating change-ups in the game. His success completely relies on his ability to locate the fastball though.
When he is able to keep that pitch down, mixed with his incredible change, he is unhittable. However, he was not able to locate his fastball at all last year and put up 4.88BB/9 (4.40 ERA and 4.56 FIP). Depending on what happens with Shields this year, Rodney will be our 7th or 8th inning guys and if Fuentesuaras sucks too much he could take over closing duties.
This Fan-Post is authored by an independent fan. Tell us what you think and how you feel.
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2/11 isn't bad.
I still would rather have had one more year of Ollie.
Angels baseball. We do what we must, because we can -- HaloDutch
Rather than pay Oli 3.5 million to pitch in the 7th and 8th, we just paid Rodney 11 million (5.5.) to do the same.
by Wally's World on Dec 23, 2009 6:49 PM PST up reply actions
That's fine...
then offer arbitration and get some picks.
And he accepts
and gets 5+ million for 1 year
Teams are not so willing to talk to a 39 year old reliever if they have to give up a 1st to get him
It isn't about the Angels' fear of paying in arbitration
That would be a problem the Dodgers have.
It is about the team honoring Oliver’s desire to pitch closer to his home in Texas. By not offering arbitration, the team removed any possible roadblocks he would have had to signing with a team in Texas.
"He's not a Rhodes Scholar to begin with''~Theo Epstein, talking about Papelbon
by George Kaplan on Dec 27, 2009 5:49 AM PST up reply actions
Yeah, if there was such a deal fine, but I've never seen anything to indicate other than conjecture that there was one.
And following it up with 11m/2yrs for a not at all good pitcher isn’t exactly a smart move.
E X A C T L Y
The Angels and Oliver had a “gentleman’s agreement” … people are really overreacting to losing a middle reliever. I am not thrilled with the Rodney signing but Oliver wanted to play close to home… you don’t jack his market by throwing in an Arbitration roadblock.
agree especially when he has done so much for us.
GO COLTS!!! 09 IS OURS!!!
by TheAngelsColts on Dec 23, 2009 9:58 PM PST up reply actions
also why we didn't offer to vlad if we would have chances are greater no one would want him at the cost of a pic
GO COLTS!!! 09 IS OURS!!!
by TheAngelsColts on Dec 23, 2009 9:59 PM PST up reply actions
Because he would have accepted and gotten a raise on last years salary
What was he making? 14 or so
Vlad for this year at 15-16M would have not been a good thing.
Hard to understand...
anything ANGELSFAITH posts. You’re not the only one…
Peanuts...Get your Overpriced Peanuts!
by Angel Hawker on Dec 24, 2009 9:03 PM PST up reply actions
Gentleman's Agreeement
LOL LOL LOL
Please tell me you don’t believe in the Easter bunny or the tooth fairy, or are you going to be setting out cookies and milk while waiting patiently for Santa to show up tonight?
Please Rev lets get serious this is a business and to think that the club just let him walk with out anything in return is a joke. If that was the case, and the Angels wanted DO to play in Texas then offer arbitration or have him sign a deal and then trade him for a player. Thats how those things play out. You don’t just send him to a team that was in a race with you for first and not get anything but a thank you.
You say that people are over reacting but your spin on things is damn right laughable, and not plausible
by Angel Aviator on Dec 24, 2009 8:45 AM PST up reply actions
I actually agree with this.
You don’t just send him to a team that was in a race with you for first and not get anything but a thank you.
that’s the truth. Texas is retooling hard for a run at the West. Whatever you opinions are of Oliver, he was arguably our most consistent reliever. We just gave him up with absolutely no compensation while making our rival better.
If you think the FO really had that mindset, I’ve got a bridge in Brooklyn I think I should sell you.
by shiftyeyedgoat on Dec 24, 2009 1:40 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
Not to mention
that the sale is apparently final, and Ryan is one of the new owners.
Angels baseball. We do what we must, because we can -- HaloDutch
Tooth Fairy? Easter Bunny?
Santa brought me an i-phone… Wa HOO!
I will take the Aviator’s professional judgment into account.
I guess the Angels thought two years of 33 and 34 year old Fernando Rodney would be better for them than 1 year of 39 year old Darren Oliver.
Only plausible explanation.
I'll buy into 2yrs of F-Rod2
is what they were thinking but there isnt a chance that the FO decided to leave a present under the christmas tree for Nolan’s Rangers
by Angel Aviator on Dec 27, 2009 1:58 AM PST up reply actions
So what happens to Jepsen?
Now we have two set-up guys? If you ask me, MS is hedging that Fuentes will suck out of the gate. If that happens, Rodney will be the closer. Alright by me; I think he’s better.
And by having not-Fuentes close we keep his option from vesting.
For some offseason fun, check out the Mac & Windows Space Shooter game I helped make: Insectoid
So freaking annoyed
Would’ve preferred this money to be spent to take a flier on Bedard, Sheets or Ducsherererer
Time to see what Wood's got!
I highly doubt it was one or the other
our payroll is still down quite a ways from last year.
by Caseys Kiss of Death on Dec 23, 2009 1:45 PM PST up reply actions
My friend, we've got to have faith
that Reagins and Scioscia know what we have and what we need.
If we pay attention, we notice that we’re close to three deep everywhere; that’s the difference in a championship team and a talented team that peters out in the fourth quarter.
It’s Christmas! Let’s have a beer.
or some spiked egg nog.
I love this team.
by Downing Rules on Dec 23, 2009 1:49 PM PST up reply actions
I am far from a "sky is falling" Angel fan, i still have faith
But paying $11 freaking million dollars for a reliever who has posted an average ERA of 4.52 in the last 3 seasons is horrible.
Rodney is only getting $1 mil less this year than Matsui. That’s, just, wrong…
Time to see what Wood's got!
by 101halo on Dec 23, 2009 2:11 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
yea about 5.5 per year probably more like 5 this year and the other 6 next year
GO COLTS!!! 09 IS OURS!!!
by TheAngelsColts on Dec 23, 2009 3:07 PM PST up reply actions
Can't we still make a run
at a Bedard or Sheets?
If the price is right I would hope Arte is willing to spend a few bucks on a roll of the dice pitcher like these guys considering all that we lost this offseason.
by The Blake Griffin Era on Dec 23, 2009 5:34 PM PST up reply actions
At least we know the GM formally known as the ninja is still employed by the Angels…
If the Rodney and Matsui signings are all the Angels do this offseason, the money was wasted. If the team can add a good SP with upside, I’m OK with the $11m investment on Rodney.
Agree...
Matsui, Rodney, and a SP with upside will be a solid winter, though I’d rather have Mike Gonzalez at 2 years, $12 million than Rodney at 2 years, $11 million. I’m assuming that Gonzalez wanted to be assured of a closer job and Rodney was more flexible…
Matsui: Power, Patience, and Porn. What more can you ask for?
But Rodney doesn't cost our 1st round draft pick.
by krush40 on Dec 23, 2009 2:05 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Ah, of course!
I had forgotten Gonzalez was a Type A free agent. Now Rodney makes more sense.
Matsui: Power, Patience, and Porn. What more can you ask for?
For the length of the deal and total cash involved
I can’t complain. The contract seems fair with what the market currently is for relievers. Good signing.
1 line siggy line because I was asked nicely. Go Angels! helpfindscottajob@gmail.com
Rodney will be closer..
I don’t want to see Fuentes close the door anymore….
I believe if Rodney come out to pitch ALCS game 2 11 inning with 3:2 lead, we will win. And finally win ALCS.
We have no lefty
other than Fuentes, Rodney really could become the closer.
by The Blake Griffin Era on Dec 23, 2009 5:35 PM PST up reply actions
Can't wait for the next big one ...
involving a starting pitcher.
I love this team.
by Downing Rules on Dec 23, 2009 2:08 PM PST up reply actions
Trading Hunter, KMo and Aybar for Lowe
and signing him to a 10 year contract extension at his current rate?
That seems to be the MO of the FO these days.
by shiftyeyedgoat on Dec 23, 2009 2:09 PM PST up reply actions
ouch...
that would not be good.
I love this team.
by Downing Rules on Dec 23, 2009 2:11 PM PST up reply actions
Really?
Because I haven’t seen the Angels deal a single player all year, especially nobody of the caliber of Morales, Aybar, or Hunter.
Angels have signed for 2010
Bobby Abreu 2 YRS for option for 3
Hideki Matsui 1 YR
Fernando Rodney 2 YRS.
Doesn’t look like they’ve made any long term commitments or spent a lot of money.
RIP Nick Adenhart 4/9/09
I blog about the Angels at The Diamond Aces
lern2/detect sarcasm.
Didn’t think I’d have to explain this one…
the MO was that the FO has been sucking and failing to reel in any talent that isn’t either shaky or older than fine cognac.
I don’t think anyone would actually entertain the notion of signing D. Lowe through 2020, when he’ll be 47 at 15 mil/year…
by shiftyeyedgoat on Dec 23, 2009 2:45 PM PST up reply actions
Sarcasm only works when it is funny or makes sense
The Angels FO has not overspent on aging vets this offseason, which is a good thing.
I'd beg to differ
That every signing thus far has been an over-expenditure on aging veteran talent.
Whether it will pan out (Matsui holding up in the wrong half of his 30s, Abreu continuing his walk-a-thon, Rodney NOT imploding during tie games when combined with Fuentes’s shakiness) is yet to be seen. However, you can’t say our front office has been successful in the trade market, if not busy trying to.
Also, just because, sarcasm doesn’t HAVE to be funny, and indeed is defined as usually more cutting and caustic than humorous. Hyperbole must not be your style of humor.
by shiftyeyedgoat on Dec 23, 2009 3:01 PM PST up reply actions
I really do hate when the Angels FO fails to sign players who are getting younger by the day.
For some offseason fun, check out the Mac & Windows Space Shooter game I helped make: Insectoid
by AlanFalcon on Dec 23, 2009 3:02 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
We need to sign Benjamin Button
and quick
by TheKingfish on Dec 23, 2009 3:05 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
That assessment was "right on the button"
I love this team.
by Downing Rules on Dec 23, 2009 3:13 PM PST up reply actions
I'm adding puns to my grievance
list.
by shiftyeyedgoat on Dec 23, 2009 3:19 PM PST up reply actions
Why would ants want to grieve? There are so many of them.
I love this team.
by Downing Rules on Dec 23, 2009 3:20 PM PST up reply actions
that was a stretch...
but I’ll give it to you.
by shiftyeyedgoat on Dec 23, 2009 3:24 PM PST up reply actions
No no no... it's not Ants... it's Aunts.
Angels baseball. We do what we must, because we can -- HaloDutch
LOL
nice
"Precious in the sight of the Lord, is the death of His Saints." - Psalm 116:15 Rest In Peace, Nick.
It's true Matsui, Abreu, and Rodney aren't exactly getting any younger
but you can hardly make the argument that they are overpaying vets.
Their combined 2010 salary is roughly the same that Boston will be paying Lackey. Couple that with the salaries most people here wanted to give Figgins, Vlad, and Oliver and we would be old (getting older with multi year contracts) and out a boatload of money which will prevent us from being competitive in the better FA classes coming up in the next 2 years.
Technically
the three above are making a combined total of 6.5 + 5.5 + 9 mil = 21mil$ for aging talent that is easily on the downside of their peaks. Now, I’m not one to condone paying Lackey the Burnett contract he ultimately got, but technically, Abreu and Matsui are receiving the money Lackey would’ve gotten here, with Rodney receiving a couple mil less than Figgy will be receiving next season. This effectively is the same money we would’ve spent keeping our team the same with Figgy and Lackey, but it’s on short-term, medium-risk, medium upside vet talent. Is it a gamble? Sort of. Is it a good signing? We’ll have to see retrospectively.
You can bet in 2012, none of the three will be here. The more poignant question is whether you believe we will have the Mauers, Pujols, and Lees on that future squad, or more of the above types of contracts tendered to players of that ilk.
by shiftyeyedgoat on Dec 23, 2009 3:16 PM PST up reply actions
Technically
Lackey is making 18M in 2010, and we would still be without Figgins, Vlad, Oliver, and Arredondo.
The money saved bought a new and more productive Vlad (Matsui), an experienced power BP arm that could potentially save $4M if Fuentes option doesn’t vest (Rodney), and resigned Abreu who had a very productive year this year. Plus he is a big benefit to our young guys. I honestly don’t think 2/18 is that unfair for his production, but it may also be a little bit of a makeup to him for last years $5M. He may be old, but he still ripped off 30 bags last year.
I honestly don’t see how Mauer or Pujols make it to free agency. Those fans would burn the stadiums down. But I would prefer the team to keep options open rather than be locked into guys like Lackey and Figgins for the next 4-5 years.
As your outlook is retrospective, and mine is primarily prospective
we will not agree on this matter.
You seem to think that (all of) these players will somehow continue to buck the trend of aging and perform exceedingly well. I, however, am unsure of how their seasons will be but believe at LEAST one of them is destined to fail. However, I would be happy and consider the signings successful if at least one of the signings is successful.
I think we’ll be eternally chasing the big fish on the open market, but it takes a special player to want to come to Anaheim. Until we can change our image on the other side of the country to big-market, East Coast-competitor from their current myopic view of us — seriously, go read the comments in Rev’s post on Over the Monster — we’ll be a second-choice to many elite free-agents coming to market.
by shiftyeyedgoat on Dec 23, 2009 4:19 PM PST up reply actions
My point
is would you rather of signed an aging vet on a 1-2 contract for about 5M/yr (Abreu for 9) or aging vets for 4-5 years at 10-18M/yr.
I’d rather the team team the first option. Although that’s just my opinion, and based on the comment over the past week or so, MANY here would disagree.
With the skanks and sux willing to have ridiculously larger budgets than other teams, it is definitely hard to get a top tier FA to come out west. Boston fans will never change their myopic view about anyone outside of Boston. We both know that. ;)
There are always players shying away form teh East Coast MEdia Microscope
Vlad came to Anaheim because he did not want the intrusion that the east coast media brings to the locker room.
The big fish
will always go the bigger market teams like the yanks sox and mets.
I think this is y the draft picks are huge, the angels need to draft and develop there own talent because history has proven that free agents generally don’t come out West.
6 first round draft picks in the last 2 yrs, one of these kids has to pan out.
by The Blake Griffin Era on Dec 23, 2009 5:38 PM PST up reply actions
if we had a lottery draft,
we could luck into one of the first five picks while only being moderately bad.
"come on, eileen."
Of if someone has an oh-so-useful sarcasm detector.
Angels baseball. We do what we must, because we can -- HaloDutch
No fifth starting pitcher = need for solid bullpen
When Rodney is on he is FILTHY. However, if hes off we have a couple guys we can go to from Jespen to Bulger to Shields to even, in a bind, Matt “Groundout king” Palmer. This definitely adds flexibility to our bullpen and fills in the Oliver/Dondo gap nicely.
Also, if we dont get another starting pitcher, were gonna need a solid bullpen. I think pads some of our losses this year nicely.
Do it for Nick '09
by BryanHarvey'sMoustache on Dec 23, 2009 1:56 PM PST reply actions
Good signing by the Ninja! What I think will happen:
Rodney will possibly be part of a closing platoon with Fuentes. Fuentes will still probably do the majority of it but if we are facing the righty-heavy portion of someone’s lineup in the 9th, Rodney may get the call. Other than that he will be part of the late/extra innings team with Shields and Jepsen until Jepsen is ready to close in ’11 or ’12.
This gives us insurance in case Fuentes regresses or if Shields just fails coming off his injury, which I really don’t think will happen.
We should still have a little bit of cash. Get a good-priced #5 and we’re set.
"You gotta have nuts." - Torii Hunter / Part-Time Nemesis of the HH Reply Function
In retrospect, though I cannot help but make this comparison...
The Angels are now paying two guys $14.5 MILLION to do Frankie Rodriguez’s $11.5 million job.
Brian Fuentes 2010 Salary: $9M
Fernando Rodney’s Estimated 2010 Salary: $5.5M
source: COTS
Frankie Rodriguez’s 2010 Salary: $11.5M
source: COTS
I love this team.
by Downing Rules on Dec 23, 2009 2:07 PM PST up reply actions 3 recs
Ugh... this.
And it’s not like we got (or are getting) an upgrade in stability in Fuentes over KRod, and now Rodney+Fuentes over Fuentes.
by shiftyeyedgoat on Dec 23, 2009 2:08 PM PST up reply actions
That is too much money for relief pitchers in any case
IMHO the pen should be built around young cheap talent and the occasional veteran guy filling out a necessary role. It seems like the Angels have spent too much money on free-agent relievers that have failed to pan out.
Speier, Carrasco, Yan, Fuentes?, Romero come to mind with Oliver being the exception.
NA 34
by blochead on Dec 23, 2009 2:43 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
But look at it this way
We have to pay Fuentes this year. He should do well enough but if he doesn’t we have Rodney to step into the closer role. I don’t think Jepsen is quite ready yet to fill those shoes.
If Fuentes’ option doesn’t vest then he comes off the books after 2010 and we have a 1 year replacement for 2011 at only $5.5 million instead of $9 million while we transition to Jepsen.
When you think about it that way it makes sense.
"You gotta have nuts." - Torii Hunter / Part-Time Nemesis of the HH Reply Function
by Commander_Nate on Dec 23, 2009 3:09 PM PST up reply actions
I understand the idea of preventing the Fuentes option from vesting
but the issue i have with the signing is that it follows the flawed strategy of composing a bullpen almost entirely out of expensive arms.
Because of this expensive strategy the 2010 the angels will be paying
9 for Fuentes
5.35 for Shields
5.25 for Speier
5.5 for Rodney
NA 34
Especially frustrating
Even if you subtract Shields, who was pretty much rock solid as the set-up man prior to his unfortunate injury and deserved his money, that is nearly 20 million dollars being committed to 2 middling relief pitchers and 1 so awful that he is being paid to stay away from the team.
Once again this money could have been used for premium talent such as John Lackey instead of a grab bag of overpriced relievers. Though Lackey is being overpaid right now in Red Sox nation, I rather have a top of the rotation starter that’s going to give me 160+ innings than to spend that cash on perhaps the most unpredictable thing in baseball, relief pitching.
RIP Nick Adenhart
critical difference
Not a contract in the pen past 2011.
by Rev Halofan on Dec 23, 2009 7:45 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
What does that matter...
…when it’s been the strategy for several years running? Still way too much sunk cost and way too little value.
Every arm in our bullpen is a question mark this season, we’re paying for one arm in Speier to not pitch for us, and sinking almost $30M into this bag of spare parts.
The Rodney signing is another bad bet in a string of them. Our bullpen ROI is abysmal.
by Turks Teeth on Dec 24, 2009 3:30 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
It matters in that if the young arms pan out, we'll have a cheap bullpen
$19.6 million potentially comes off the books if Fuentes doesn’t vest after the 2010 season. Even if you were to keep Shields around at his current salary, that’s $14 million+. If Jepsen/Bulger/Thompson solidify, Rodney does OK, and anyone else at all helps out from the minors, we’ll be in a position to finally not spend that savings on overpriced Esteban Carrascos.
Not that I would count on it, mind you.
Agree
I really despise this move. You and I might be in the minority here, but I don’t think it’s prudent to invest so heavily into relief pitchers since they are so volatile. Instead of putting 11 million into such a BB prone reliever in his 30s, IMO the Angels should either be putting it towards more premium talent this year or save it for the premium talent coming out next year. What’s even worse is that they could have resigned Oliver to a cheaper amount without the 2 year commitment.
Of course it’s not my money and most Angels fans seem to think this is a good signing, so as long as the majority are happy I guess that’s all that matters.
RIP Nick Adenhart
The majority is fickle.
If you participated in the Halosphere discussions when Matthews signed, his signing was one a majority of fans applauded as well, and many of those folks were browbeating the naysayers when GMJ flashed moments of usefulness in the first half of ’07. But when he sunk like a stone, it was Rashomon all over again, and many of the GMJ boosters were among those who averred that they thought his contract sunk from day one. So it goes. The crowd is always fickle.
I join you in the minority. This deal sucks — there’s no data-driven argument that can justify it in this market. And paying $20M for Speier, Rodney and Fuentes this season underscores the mismanagement and dysfunction of building a bullpen through fre agency and multiyear contracts.
by Turks Teeth on Dec 24, 2009 3:55 PM PST via mobile up reply actions 1 recs
I'm on the fence.
For this money, I wish we’d resigned Ollie.
Angels baseball. We do what we must, because we can -- HaloDutch
I certainly don't remember it that way
Would be worthwhile to dredge up the links here. I think the nickname “Garbage Matthews Jr.” stuck even before the HGH thing cropped up.
What world was this?
I remember thinking Stoneman shit on my Thanksgiving, and most of the people here agreed
Play Wood already. Willits sucks.
i got everyone on the GMJ signing
I was against it when it was just a rumor. I was against the Finley signing. The Hillenbrand signing, i gnashed my teeth at it all.
I am not thrilled about the Rodney over D.O. but it is not the end of the world.
Yogi Kurosawa?
it was Rashomon all over again
"He's not a Rhodes Scholar to begin with''~Theo Epstein, talking about Papelbon
by George Kaplan on Dec 27, 2009 5:53 AM PST up reply actions
Bah humbug.
Yankees get Granderson and Vazquez.
Red Sox get Lackey.
We get Fernando freakin’ Rodney.
I've got nothing.
And Matsui
I don’t see how you say bah humbug to .274/28/90 with practically no GIDP and a guy who converted 37 of 38 Saves with an ERA in the 2’s in those situations.
"You gotta have nuts." - Torii Hunter / Part-Time Nemesis of the HH Reply Function
by Commander_Nate on Dec 23, 2009 1:58 PM PST up reply actions
Matsui was a lateral move.
And as for Rodney, people in the streets of Detroit are celebrating his departure. That worries me.
I've got nothing.
You mean the great vacant plains of Detroit?
I thought they were celebrating the Lions’ first and second wins, still…. and the lack of Matt Millen running the football operations. ;)
I love this team.
by Downing Rules on Dec 23, 2009 2:59 PM PST up reply actions
at least they still have hockey :p
They want power. We want respect...
by SenorChuckles on Dec 23, 2009 3:02 PM PST up reply actions
How is it lateral and not an upgrade?
Vlad: .295/15/60+ RBI a bunch of DPs
Matsui: .274/28/90 under 10 DPs
I don’t know the exact DP numbers, but Matsui hardly ever grounds into one. Just on those numbers we get a net gain of 13 HR and 30 or so RBI from the DH spot.
"You gotta have nuts." - Torii Hunter / Part-Time Nemesis of the HH Reply Function
by Commander_Nate on Dec 23, 2009 3:19 PM PST up reply actions
And Vlad is going to have a torn pectoral again limiting his time on the field?
I think that Vlad will continue to outperform Matsui, average-wise, but it will be a push on the HR/RBI front. Both will end up at 19 and 85, imho. The DP’s are certainly going to plummet with Matsui.
So, in that respect, it was lateral.
But, we won in terms of years since Matsui’s is only a one year “flyer.”
I love this team.
by Downing Rules on Dec 23, 2009 3:23 PM PST up reply actions
We also get some KEY Japanese market money.
That will get us mad luminous respect.
by shiftyeyedgoat on Dec 23, 2009 3:26 PM PST up reply actions
Yoshina?
Woof. That crap smells like Kal Kan kitty food. MEOW!
I love this team.
by Downing Rules on Dec 23, 2009 3:30 PM PST up reply actions
Yoshinoya
I can spelz Japaneze.
I love this team.
by Downing Rules on Dec 23, 2009 3:30 PM PST up reply actions
Maybe some soo-shee?
I’d personally love to be served a Matsuhsi-roll and start a new tradition for his ABs.
by shiftyeyedgoat on Dec 23, 2009 3:31 PM PST up reply actions
Sushi had been served at the stadium. I remember tripping out that at a Rams game in 1993 people were eating sushi at a football game. Not my idea of carnage one should consume at a football game. Of course, after a few world travels between then and now, I don’t mind me some raw fish at the game.
I love this team.
by Downing Rules on Dec 23, 2009 3:34 PM PST up reply actions
Given the Rally Rat, I wouldn't trust any sushi I got at the Big A.
Sorry, Arte.
Angels baseball. We do what we must, because we can -- HaloDutch
"We" get some Japanese market money?
Well “shifty..” I hate to break this to you, but I don’t think you or I are going to see any of that Japanese market money.
It's lateral only if one discards the internal alternatives.
Matsui had a fine year last year. But he can’t play the field, and the reason why is physical, which doesn’t inspire confidence when he’s a hired gun who is supposed to provide consistent power. A DL stint shouldn’t surprise anyone in 2010.
This isn’t a good time to add defensive inflexibility to this team. Napoli taking half the DH at-bats and leaving the remainder to rest Abreu and Hunter was the wisest course of action. Now every time Abreu and Naps will be in the lineup, they’ll also be on the field, subtracting from their value.
The composition of this lineup just screams injuries waiting to happen.
by Turks Teeth on Dec 24, 2009 4:19 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
Vazquez is a dead horse...
He was not going to head out west, unlike the origin of mini sirloin burgers…. “way out west…”
I love this team.
by Downing Rules on Dec 23, 2009 2:08 PM PST up reply actions
the big question now is what we happens with the #5 starting role??
i get the feeling they will leave palmer where he is as the long reliever as he really seems to excel there
GO COLTS!!! 09 IS OURS!!!
Palmer as long reliever = 7-man bullpen
Fuentes
Rodney
Shields
Jepsen
Bulger
Thompson (who’s out of options, and ready to be next year’s Jason Bulger)
Palmer
That leaves only 4 extra position players on a team with geriatric outfielders. So, Izturis, Mathis, GMJ, and Willits. I gotta think Sosh would want an extra IF guy, or even (god forbid) bring the out-of-options Wilson up as a third catcher.
Though obviously injuries will probably render the above scenario outdated even before ST.
why you say (god forbid)?? wilson isn't bad also he would provide depth for first and izturis will be backup for the other infield positions
i would imagine
GO COLTS!!! 09 IS OURS!!!
by TheAngelsColts on Dec 23, 2009 3:15 PM PST up reply actions
What I have seen of Bobby Wilson's bat at the ML level...
I like what I saw. Good gap power. Maybe it was an extremely small sample size, but I like his bat much better than Jeff Mattress’s.
I love this team.
by Downing Rules on Dec 23, 2009 3:20 PM PST up reply actions
i think mathis just needs to find consistency as we have seen what he can do at time such as this last postseason
GO COLTS!!! 09 IS OURS!!!
by TheAngelsColts on Dec 23, 2009 3:23 PM PST up reply actions
I don't buy "Mendoza Mathis" as a 270 hitter. Ever.
I love this team.
by Downing Rules on Dec 23, 2009 3:25 PM PST up reply actions
na i think though he is very capable of being a .250 hitter with around 10-12HR and 40 rbi's
GO COLTS!!! 09 IS OURS!!!
by TheAngelsColts on Dec 23, 2009 3:37 PM PST up reply actions
well we have already seen the type of power and such to put up those numbers in HR.
we have also seen him put up 40 rbi’s when he batted under .200. so i think he can do it but id dont know that he will do it with us reason being i think he needs to play everyday, which is also what would help napoli as well.
GO COLTS!!! 09 IS OURS!!!
by TheAngelsColts on Dec 23, 2009 3:47 PM PST up reply actions
I will be here next year at this time...
and I am sure hope you can say “I told you so.”
I love this team.
by Downing Rules on Dec 23, 2009 3:51 PM PST up reply actions
haha just know i didn't say "he will bat .250" i said i think he is capable of doing so.
probably wont though if i had to guess id put it right at .220 or so
GO COLTS!!! 09 IS OURS!!!
by TheAngelsColts on Dec 23, 2009 3:57 PM PST up reply actions
Because I hate three-catcher rosters
Catchers generally can’t hit or run or field other positions very well, and so tend to waste space.
We've still got enough spare parts made up of out-of-options guys
for a trade. Either that, or we lose someone through waivers.
Because of the “geriatric outfielders”, we’re probably going to have two reserve outfielders. Without any trades, it’s GMJr and Willits. If we trade GMJr, it’s TEvans and Willits.
All along, I’ve figured that the extra IF guy is Freddie Sandoval: 1B, 2B, 3B, SS, Switch Hitter.
We’ve still got catchers and outfielders that need to go somewhere.
i expect both Evans and wilson to be on the 25 man roster unless there is a trade. yes if we brough on another infielder it would
most certainly be sandoval
GO COLTS!!! 09 IS OURS!!!
by TheAngelsColts on Dec 23, 2009 5:31 PM PST up reply actions
Like others on here
I feel like this money could have gone toward other more pressing needs. Rodney is not worth this much money, but stupid ed wade drove up the price of relief pitchers by signing Rodney’s set-up man to a 3/15 contract. Wait, i’m confused, why would Reagins pay this much for middle-relief? There has to be an underlying purpose for the signing.
NA 34
Fuentes needs to finish 55 games to get vested for 2011, and we don't want him to vest
Having a Proven Closer makes it easier to create a more platoonish closing situation, which will deny Fuentes’ vest, freeing up money, and paving the way for Jepsen to close by 2012 at the latest.
My problem with this whole thing is
the angels have a bullpen that is costing about 26 million dollars! Last night I went to bed hoping this whole Rodney rumor would go away because, even before the eventual signing, the amount of money allocated to the bullpen is ridiculous.
Saito could have served the same purpose at half the money and contract length.
NA 34
Look above a little ways
The way it appears to be planned out, this move will actually save the Angels $4.5 million next year without sacrificing much in the way of talent and depth.
"You gotta have nuts." - Torii Hunter / Part-Time Nemesis of the HH Reply Function
by Commander_Nate on Dec 23, 2009 3:14 PM PST up reply actions
Ya, so it seems like all that's left is a low risk/high reward starter.
Really not a bad offseason.
I like this move...and here's why...
If we had the bullpen we have had in prior years, we would have won the WS this season. In prior years, Angels baseball has meant “game over” from the 6th inning on…2009, this was not the case. Our bullpen was our achilles heel. What this team needs is some late inning heat to slam the door. This is a step in the right direction. Nice move Ninja! I for one, approve!
People ask me what I do in winter when there's no baseball. I'll tell you what I do. I stare out the window and wait for spring. ~Rogers Hornsby
by K3YEROUT on Dec 23, 2009 2:37 PM PST reply actions 1 recs
According to my salary logic listed above, yes...
a 3 million dollar mistake. However, the market turning against Frankie led him to lower his salary demands and that was unforseen. He originally wanted 3yr/$45M and the halos only went to 3yr/$34. He got 3/$39 IIRC.
Regardless, Rodney’s signing increases overall bullpen depth… we had a crappy pen last year and now Arredondo and Oliver are gone. Shields is coming back, but how effective will he be? Good move, in spite of appearances of Fuentes-induced “buyer’s remorse.”
I love this team.
by Downing Rules on Dec 23, 2009 2:58 PM PST up reply actions
3yr/$45M would have been a mistake (overpaid)...
why he did not return to the Angels’ table and ask for $3yr/$39M or so, is a question I’d like to ask.
I love this team.
by Downing Rules on Dec 23, 2009 3:00 PM PST up reply actions
Or was he so bitter about losing $2.5M in the arbitration hearing?
that he just didn’t want to play for the Halos any longer?
I love this team.
by Downing Rules on Dec 23, 2009 3:01 PM PST up reply actions
And Brian Fuentes had a 3.93...
what’s your point?
I love this team.
by Downing Rules on Dec 23, 2009 3:24 PM PST up reply actions
Fuentes was cheaper and has a shorter contract, he was just as effective
as Frankie last year, -Frankie really had a terrible second half - my post was aimed more at mustard man who said letting Frankie go was a mistake — I would have signed him for 13 million a year but not 15 million a year as you stated
Angels in 2010!
I agree with your perspective
My point was that with this signing, the Angels ended up paying more than what it would have taken just to keep Frankie. As someone noted above, for 2010 the team is paying:
$9.0m for Fuentes
$5.3m for Shields
$5.2m for Speier
$5.5m for Rodney
That’s approximately $25m for three arms + one guy that’s not even on the team. Therefore, if the intent was to spend this much cash on bullpen arms, then why not keep a player who is one of the top 5 closers in the game?
I’d love to know how hard the GM formally known as the Ninja worked to try to trade for Heath Bell, and who was the player that the Angels would not include in a deal for him. He’s the guy I’d really like to see coming out of the pen for the 7th and/or 8th innings for the Angels in 2010……
I see what you are saying
certainly the Speier resigning was a big mistake. Yet, I think that good bullpens have good 7th and 8th inning set up guys. I have said before that I think Shields had a tougher job than Frankie. It was Shields who came in with the bases loaded and one out and a one run lead. Last year, Jepsen had this role late in the year. So I would rather pay for several good arms to set up the 7th or 8th —then spend for a guy who pitches the 9th inning with the bases empty. At least, this is how Soth uses the closer. Note, that the Yanks use Rivera differently at least in the playoffs and a closer like Rivera, who is used like Rivera would be worth 15 million a year.
BTW, I think Jepsen is our future in the bullpen.
Angels in 2010!
Maybe because
spending that money on two arms as good as Frankie makes more sense then spending it all on Frankie alone? If Rodney and Fuentes can combine for 120-140 innings out of the pen, with each putting up basically the same numbers as Frankie, isn’t that a much better value? Not that I’m all that crazy about this signing. I thought the pen would have been fine with a couple young guys mixed in. But this move is hardly crippling and I doubt it will be seen as a huge mistake.
I wonder if they're really just stoked to be in 3rd place for the forseeable future?
"You gotta have nuts." - Torii Hunter / Part-Time Nemesis of the HH Reply Function
by Commander_Nate on Dec 23, 2009 3:13 PM PST up reply actions
Rodney is our new Hector Carrasco/Esteban Yan
I’ll cross my fingers Rodney eekes out two decent years without imploding completely.
He has the stuff, but lacks the consistency.
Or is Kendry perhaps the one who needs to sit?
by BBFan1 on Dec 23, 2009 3:11 PM PST reply actions 1 recs
I don't hit well, but I'm athletic and my CERA is grrreat!
Or is Kendry perhaps the one who needs to sit?
by BBFan1 on Dec 23, 2009 7:52 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Rodney=No Bueno
Nearly 5 walks per 9 innings in 2009 and a decreasing K/9 rate from his 2008. Not good signs.
RIP Nick Adenhart
Yep
Perfect comparison. Why spend on a guy like that when you already have 4 guys in the minors capable of putting up Rodney numbers in the majors? Makes zero sense to me. But whatever…here’s hoping he re-discovers his ability to be decent like he was in 2006.
Seems like the guy is either dominant or horrible game to game. Anyone who thinks he is an improvement over Fuentes is kidding themselves.
The Angels bullpen
Was sort of a mess in 2009:
Scot Shields was injured
Justin Speier was released
Jose Arrendondo never really found his footing in a sophomore slump
Jason Bulger and Kevin Jepsen entered the 2009 season as unknown commodities.
In 2010
Darren Oliver is gone.
Shields may never be as dominant coming out of the pen, like he was for much of the decade, so Rodney gives the Angels a viable late inning option. At this point, the Angels don’t know how much Shields still has left and Rodney is an insurance policy.
Sure, Rodney is kind of inconsistent, but the Angels hope he can be serviceable [especially with his stuff], which takes pressure away from Jepsen [from being the only 8th inning guy] and allows Bulger to be more of a middle-relief guy.
In a perfect scenario, Jepsen will eventually be the Angels closer, when Brian Fuentes is no longer on the team.
Or is Kendry perhaps the one who needs to sit?
Not sure why there is a lot of people thinking Shields will be a ??
He did not have any arm issues so I tend to think that he will be just fine. His arm is fresh the thing that might be tough for him early will be his control. I think he will settle in and be just fine. His biggest issue had been the knee and him altering his mechanics to take the pressure off the knee.
I think he will be just fine and be that reliable guy that will start the season as the 7/8 inning guy
by Angel Aviator on Dec 24, 2009 9:02 AM PST up reply actions
Agreed his arm is good. Not coming off of another 110+ inning season either
Play Wood already. Willits sucks.
Not an improvement over Fuentes, but an improvement over Arredondo & Speier....
… not to mention first-half Jepsen & Bulger. He’s an expensive if short-termish insurance policy that one arm in the pen won’t go 7.00 ERA on us.
?
Why the Helck was my comment deleted?
Eat My Angel Dust.
Isn't there an MLB policy on failing to dress properly that could allow him to be fined heavily?
Please?
I see red people
Red Floyd, did you delete your "I should kill you where you stand" comment?
That entire section is now missing. If you didn’t delete it, maybe Angle95’s comment disappeared too.
i expect both evans and wilson to be on the 25 man roster unless there is a trade. yes if we brough on another infielder it would
most certainly be sandoval
GO COLTS!!! 09 IS OURS!!!
by TheAngelsColts on Dec 23, 2009 5:29 PM PST up reply actions
I can't find it either. I didn't delete it. It still shows up on my user page.
Angels baseball. We do what we must, because we can -- HaloDutch
I went over to Bless You Boys Tigers fan member blog to see what they thought of Rodney.
This is what I got:
As with Fuentes, it sounds like business as usual to me. The more heart attacks the merrier.
The 2009 Pregame Picks Winner and Iron Man of Halos Heaven.com
by 44FAN on Dec 23, 2009 5:49 PM PST reply actions 1 recs
Holy Crap!!!
the games are going to be real long next season. We will be averaging a minimum of 6 pitchers a game. Part of Arte’s plan to make more cash selling more beer
When I'm not at the stadium, I'd rather be watching my Halos back in Costa Rica!
Just so I can cite it later...
…this is a horrible signing.
For the record and to show I’m not just hating on the offseason… I didn’t want Lackey or Figgins back at their respective prices, and love the draft picks we got. I understood that Halladay likely wasn’t possible given that Toronto needed great near-to-the-majors-but-not-yet-there prospects, and that’s something we’re lacking. And Cliff Lee is NOT going to sign an extension with Seattle, so that too is an understandable non-move by our FO.
I also wholeheartedly support the Matsui pick-up. While old, Matsui is an extremely good player coming for pretty darn cheap.
Rodney, however, is neither developing, nor good, nor cheap (for the bullpen). We could have likely gotten the same production for the league minimum from our farm system. Horrible, horrible signing.
Time to see what Wood's got!
by 101halo on Dec 23, 2009 7:57 PM PST reply actions 4 recs
I posted earlier
Mainly just hating. Figured I’d give some time to think it through. And 6 hours later I hate the move just as much as when we first found out. Just found better words for expressing why, ha.
Time to see what Wood's got!
I pretty much agree, i did want them to sign someone not just use the farm system though. i felt with us losing oliver we should go
get another vet. but RODNEY?? i just think there were a lot of better options
GO COLTS!!! 09 IS OURS!!!
by TheAngelsColts on Dec 23, 2009 8:16 PM PST up reply actions
Alright, think this may have either been stated earlier, or in different terms
And if so, I apologize for repetition, but it IS an important consideration:
Fuente’s $9 mil 2011 option is dependent on closing out games this year. IF Rodney steals a large chunk of save opportunities, then Fuente’s option will not kick in.
THUS, IF (and only if) the Halos use Rodney (or Shields or Jepsen for that matter), as the closer this year, then this $11 mil contract will save us $9 mil, in effect making it only a $2 mil contract.
So, while I seriously, seriously doubt that Rodney was signed to be the closer, if he was, this doesn’t look quite as bad.
Time to see what Wood's got!
i think the idea was stated multiple times but not the last part.
na i see your point and agree with what you say but where there not better people we could have gone after to fill the same role for the same amount? personally i think we will be ok one way or another if he struggles he wont pitch as much just like if fuentes struggles he will be pulled back some and others will close more (jespen as the third option probably)
GO COLTS!!! 09 IS OURS!!!
by TheAngelsColts on Dec 23, 2009 8:34 PM PST up reply actions
Agreed
If anything, this second line of thinking is just a way for me to think the signing could be potentially LESS-horrible, not GOOD.
Time to see what Wood's got!
yea i was looking and there really are no closers or other left handed relievers id be asking them to go after that i see
also for closers specificly there is capps who is 26 and has pretty much already signed, and 4 others including rodney that are all 33 or 34
here is a link for those interested:: http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2008/12/2010-mlb-free-a.html
GO COLTS!!! 09 IS OURS!!!
by TheAngelsColts on Dec 23, 2009 9:28 PM PST up reply actions
Agree x 10
Don’t get it, don’t get it, DON’T GET IT!
Agree with all the other moves – or at least the thinking presumably behind them. This? This is a scary, confidence shaking move. Dude is not a gamer, is not the cheapest available, is not… I just don’t get it.
"Sometimes I've believed as many as six impossible things before breakfast."
I agree with everything EXCEPT
The “likely” same production from minor leagues. As Arredondo & last year’s first half Bulger/Jepsen showed, the worst-case scenario for minor league help is indeed truly terrible. And not something Rodney’s likely to replicate.
Also, as mentioned above, he’s a mechanism to help us non-vest Fuentes. That’s crass, but it’s also true.
Don't like this
The only good thing about Rodney is his stuff – 95 MPH fastball ad great change. But you don’t judge guys like this on stuff. That’s OK for young guys – when Kevin Jepsen was struggling to start the 2009 season you can look at his stuff and decide it’s worth giving him a chance to figure out how to use it.
But Rodney is 33 years old. Walks too many guys and doesn’t even miss that many bats. 4.28 career ERA. What you see is what you get. For all his stuff, Rodney has proven he’s no better than an average reliever.
The HK-47 hitting droid is the finest line drive machine ever built
Desperation
Nothing but desperation. First, a gimp outfielder and now the pitcher who gave the WS to the Cards almost singlehandedly. There is no benefit to the Angels in either of these sad moves.
by tuffdeal on Dec 23, 2009 9:02 PM PST reply actions 1 recs
Must be the fastball
Rodney was throwing a fastball that was consistently 95+ in 2009 as the graph below illustrates.
This could be a high-risk signing, given Rodney’s age and control issues. I get the sense the Angels are enamored with Rodney’s blazing fastball.
Speaking of fastballs, Jepsen battled back problems early in the season. But once healthy he lit up the radar gun with a heater in the mid-to- upper-90s.
It appears the Angels want to have an “old-school” one-two punch in the bullpen featuring a couple of guys with hard fastballs.
So, he's gonna be "Fur-Rod"?
"Sometimes I've believed as many as six impossible things before breakfast."
Might I be the first to suggest
Playing David Bowie – Cat People whenever Fuentes and Rodney pitch consecutively?
by 3eyes on Dec 24, 2009 2:11 AM PST reply actions 1 recs
concerns
I have concerns about his declining K ratio and the career high in number of homeruns he gave up last year. Plus Tiger fans are laughing… that has to be some kind of barometer…
http://twitter.com/truegrich
as a Twins fan, I am a little concerned by this signing just from seeing Rodney pitch a few times
It seemed like every time we faced Rodney, he would give up a couple walks or hits, sometimes a run, but never enough to blow the save. I can see how he gave Tigers fans a heart attack every time he came on the mound. If he’s being paid for his save %, that would be a mistake, as most of those saves were not clean saves. I know my analysis is subjective, but it is backed up somewhat by his 1.47 WHIP.
There is also the declining K rate and increasing HR rates that you mentioned. Overall I think this is a risky signing – hopefully Rodney will pan out for you. I’m not trying to be a dick – I think the Angels are awesome and you were my guys in the playoffs after the Twins got knocked out – but I just don’t like this signing.
"So [Kouzmanoff]’s going to make decent monkey, but he’d be affordable." - Jesse
by what_would_gil_thorp_do on Dec 24, 2009 8:42 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
I appreciate the comment...
as it is easy to be blinded by moves your own team makes. Outsider perspectives are always less biased. I think your analysis is right on as well. Thanx
Peanuts...Get your Overpriced Peanuts!
by Angel Hawker on Dec 24, 2009 9:53 PM PST up reply actions
I like this--but I will also go on the record--this could very easily become J.C. Romero 2.0.
Which would be epic suck and Grand Epic Fail for the FO.
RIP Nick Adenhart.
"When the Babe tries to call his shot, I hope Nick puts one in his ear."
--RallyMonkey5
At least we didn't give up a big prospect for him, or even any draft picks, so it's already more successful than Romero--I still have faith in this all the same!
RIP Nick Adenhart.
"When the Babe tries to call his shot, I hope Nick puts one in his ear."
--RallyMonkey5
My thoughts exactly.
We need an option “meh” in the poll
Nick would be proud.
by halofan4life on Dec 24, 2009 12:41 PM PST up reply actions
To 31% of you who don't like this signing
Remember, we are a part of the haves in baseball. If we were a have-not, Rays, Royals, Marlins, etc, this would be a terrible signing. If a have-not gives Rodney this contract it means that there is $11 mil less to give a better player. However, the $11 mil we are paying this guy has no effect on whether or not we will sign someone later. This is one of the many conveniences that come along with being a have.
Is Rodney worth this amount of money? Absolutely not. But that’s not the issue. Let me drop a simile on you. It’s like paying to park in the VIP section in the Angel Stadium parking lot. It seems ridiculous to a have-not. My family can park our car across the street for $7 and walk half a mile to the stadium. It is not worth $40 to park near the stadium because we are already dropping some of our hard earned money on tix and food. But for a have, the $40 to park close to the stadium is worth the convenience. Is it a good deal for them? Absolutely not. They are getting fleeced and they know it. But it doesn’t matter because the $40 they spent to keep them from walking a half mile has no effect on their future spending habits. They’re still getting there 16 year old a brand new BMW for Christmas.
We’ll still get that big name player if he’s available. Arte has $11 million in his sock drawer.
by gary matthews jr. jr. on Dec 24, 2009 12:49 PM PST reply actions 2 recs
spoken like arte's financial advisor.
What do you need a fancy suit for, Charlie, you ain't got no job to wear it to.
by clover_black on Dec 24, 2009 5:36 PM PST up reply actions
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