Polanco to Phils = 1 Less Figgins Suitor
by Rev Halofan on Dec 3, 2009 12:27 PM PST
in Angels News
Email
PrintThe dominoes may start falling a little faster now with today's free agent news.
Former Detroit Tigers infielder Placido Polanco has signed with the Phillies for 3 years, $18 Million. It has been announced that he will be playing 3B for Philadelphia (replacing Pedro Feliz), meaning that Chone Figgins has one less high profile, big payroll team to bid up the price of his services.
The faithful in Anaheim who worship Figgy Stardust have a reason to celebrate - the bidding for Desmond DeChone just got more affordable for Arte Moreno and his Angels.
For you National League fans, this just makes the Phillies that much better. Wow.
46 comments
|
0 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
Wood's time is now
Brandon is entering his prime, is cheap, and under club control.
We need payroll space to get some more pitching, third base isnt the first priority, and signing Figgins might lock up a lot of dollars we could use to significantly improve in another position of need.
I cannot see Figgins being worth 9 million dollars three years from now.
I brought sexy back, but they only gave me store credit....
I only bring Figgins back
if we’re either shipping Wood or Rivera out for Halladay.
RIP Nick Adenhart 4/9/09
I blog about the Angels at The Diamond Aces
still fascinated that more people want Wood than Figgins
guys a nice backup plan, but I enjoy actual production and winning more than dreaming about potential. If Wood falls flat on his face (which is absolutely a possibility no matter how many Woodies think he’s a 100% lock to hit 80 home runs a year) you’re looking at Izturis and his hamstrings as your third baseman for what we hope is a championship team.
Welcome back Chone. Brandon, thank you for helping us bring Halladay to Anaheim.
RIP Nick Adenhart
forgot to point out
that Figgins’ other major “suitor”, the White Sox, apparently have no financial wiggle room to spend on free agents after acquiring Peavy and Rios’ contracts.
Writings on the wall. Figgins is re-signing in the next 2 weeks.
RIP Nick Adenhart
by ihearhowie2.0 on Dec 3, 2009 1:04 PM PST up reply actions
The push for Brandon is about payroll as well...
if Figgins can be had at the right price then we can afford both…Figgins can play LF and you can rotate Rivera/Abreu through the DH slot. Seems reasonable.
But dropping 10 million a year on a third basemen who has one of the worst slugging percentages at the position, a mediocre OPS among his 3B peers (Figgins is in the middle of the pack), too many CS attempts and on the wrong side of 30?
He had a great year, I don’t expect him to do it again. Ever.
I’d pay him 3 yrs / 24 mill take it or leave it.
I agree with most of what you say.
I think Figgins is only going to require any deal for 4-5 years and make it between 6-7 per year.
RIP Nick Adenhart 4/9/09
I blog about the Angels at The Diamond Aces
so the fact he had an awesome 2007 also lends you no faith?
the .330/.393/.432 line wasn’t too shabby. And he plays incredible defense at 3rd base.
also, the guy learned how to walk. I dont care about his slugging percentage if he gets on base in front of Abreu/Torii/Morales. His job is to score runs, not drive them in. He’s a leadoff hitter and a damn good one who works counts, which is something this team needs to continue to pursue.
I love Aybar but he does not have the approach to lead off. If he doesn’t hit for a high average, you’re left with weird lineups to try and fix it.
2009 saw our offense reach new heights and its because we actually had 2 guys atop the order with .400ish OBPs. Lets not take that for granted because walks aren’t as fun to watch as home runs.
RIP Nick Adenhart
by ihearhowie2.0 on Dec 3, 2009 2:24 PM PST up reply actions
Walks are great..but OPS factors slugging too
and while it’s not the whole story OPS is a reasonable way to judge all around hitting ability. Great hitters both get on base and hit for power. Hitters who command 10 million a year should do that. Figgins has great OBP and lousy SLG. That makes him an average hitter from the 3b position (13th ranked OPS among all 3b).
He gets bonus points for the steals (though the CS is worrisome) and amazing defense. He was worth every penny last year, in fact he was a bargain. That doesn’t mean he’s worth twice that going forward.
He’s also on the wrong side of 30, and history suggests his numbers are only going to decline. Even if he continues a great OBP his SLG and SB will decline along with his defensive range. He might be worth 10 million next year, but in 3 years?
Bobby Abreu ran the bases better last year, had equiv OBP, was able to drive the ball better and was much cheaper over the life of a contract. Unless we can get Figgins for around 7-8 mill a year for a short 3 year deal I say bring on Brandon Wood and let Abreu lead off.
Also check out wOBA (weighted on-base average)
http://www.insidethebook.com/woba.shtml
The above link is an excellent explanation of wOBA.
As the name implies, wOBA assigns proper weights to various events.
When you look at wOBA numbers, just think OBP.
In other words, an average hitter is around 0.338 or so, a great hitter is 0.400 or higher, and a poor hitter would be under 0.300.
www.fangraphs.com has wOBA stats for all players.
by Fan Since 1981 on Dec 3, 2009 6:16 PM PST up reply actions
Why are you comparing him to other 3B men?
That’s ridiculous. Compare him to other lead-off hitters, then get back to me. Of course he isn’t going to slug like Aramis Ramirez or A-Rod. He weighs half as much.
No matter what happens from here on, it has been a great season.
by Rally Manatee on Dec 3, 2009 3:03 PM PST up reply actions
"leadoff hitter" is just code for someone who happens to have a nice OBP and who can't really hit for power..
if you could stack your lineup top to bottom with .900 OPS sluggers you would do so and you’d gladly ignore “leadoff hitters”
Hitting for power is kinda important if you’re commanding 10 million a year. If you only want 5 million then you can have a slugging under .400.
Not buying it
And I think Sosh is on my side. He does not want all power bats. He wants speed at the top AND bottom of the order. That’s why Aybar has been a #9 hitter even though he led the team in avg.
A team with all power hitters has to be more of a station to station team, waiting for the big blast. Sosh is the opposite. He wants guys that can go 1st to 3rd, steal bags, etc. in front of a few run producers. One dimensional, typical sluggers are usually, well, sluggish.
One might argue that the Angels have had zero typical sluggers since Glaus. And all those flags flying by the rock pile tell me that we tend to do just fine without top to bottom power.
And the idea that a guy should get paid more if he’s a slugger is ridiculous. A guy should get paid more if he’s a good ball player. I wonder who has been paid more, Jeter or Giambi?
No matter what happens from here on, it has been a great season.
by Rally Manatee on Dec 3, 2009 5:13 PM PST up reply actions
I'm not saying a "slugger" should get paid more...
I’m saying the guys with higher OPS, all other things being equal…should get paid more.
Those “sluggers” happen to get on base at an almost comparable clip to Figgins.
“sluggers” don’t have to be slow either. There are plenty of guys who hit for power that can run the bases well. They don’t have the speed of figgins but they don’t have to be station to station guys either.
I’d rather take my chance with Wood than get saddled with another Darin Erstad type contract, or worse, Gary Matthews Junior.
oh ok
so we just need to get 9 guys with .900 OPS. I didn’t know it was that easy. Maybe call Tony and let him the secret to scoring runs. I mean, we came in 2nd last year in runs scored so clearly what we were doing was a total failure. Tear it down and go with unknowns.
I like Wood but the reality of the Angels is that we are a world series contender each year and guys like Wood who need time to adjust just don’t fit in the picture as much as some would like. Sure, I would love to see him blossom on our team but what’s the point of spending all this money on Hunter and Abreu and Kazmir and guys that are here to win RINGS if we’re just going to rebuild at the hot corner? We’re going to go with what gives us the best chance to win and that is Chone Figgins.
Wood’s value at this point is as a trading chip to land a starting pitcher. He’s a waste sitting on the bench and needs too much work on adjustments to play everyday for a contender.
RIP Nick Adenhart
by ihearhowie2.0 on Dec 3, 2009 5:20 PM PST up reply actions
You're making it sound like Figgins is going to be free.....
he isn’t. He’s going to cost 40 million dollars over 4 years if we’re lucky. That might be a good contract next year but in 2013 it’s gonna look terrible.
Actually we need guys *who are playing third* to have a .900 OPS
Because the position is not defensively demanding enough to have someone batting sub .850 there.
I brought sexy back, but they only gave me store credit....
Does figgins signing = no halladay?
I mean, we keep hearing with arbitration, arte is looking at 15 million to spend this winter. 9 on figgins only leaves 6-10 and makes it sound like lackey or halladay aren’t gonna happen. I would guess each would be looking for at least 10-15 a year. I’m sure he would open up the man-purse for the “right” player, but it just makes me wonder.
And for all the wood lovers, remember a guy named Todd Greene? The next big thing, 45 homers in AAA in something like 120 games, moon shot power, can’t miss prospect. Got to anaheim and flopped like a dying fish.
I’m not saying that’s gonna be wood, but shouldn’t we have some backup/ contingency plan?
by Balls and Strikes on Dec 3, 2009 1:15 PM PST reply actions
Potential fallback options at 3b...
…don’t forget two seasons ago Brown carried the Bees to that incredible start hitting over .400 for a couple months…nagging injuries set him back last season.
Seems like Sandoval had quite the year last season and plays 3b also…
Gazoo plays Figgins quality defense at 3B too…we know Soth loves the guy! Stayed healthy most of last season…
I think the only way you re-sign Figgy is with the intent for him to play another position such as LF…and maybe backup at 3B…you have got to play the younger / less expensive players somewhere in order to afford what Lackey / Halliday / Haren / Johnson are going to make.
People ask me what I do in winter when there's no baseball. I'll tell you what I do. I stare out the window and wait for spring. ~Rogers Hornsby
Figgins to Left Field
Wood to 3B. Rivera to Right or to be traded.
RIP Nick Adenhart 4/9/09
I blog about the Angels at The Diamond Aces
This is tempting.
No matter what happens from here on, it has been a great season.
by Rally Manatee on Dec 3, 2009 3:04 PM PST up reply actions
I don't think the Angels re-sign Figgins
Without taking care of the pitching issue first. Halladay has the biggest price tag, but will probably have the highest reward too. Lackey only costs money, but he isn’t the pitcher Halladay is. I think the Angels will acquire a pitcher before committing money to Figgins.
RIP Nick Adenhart 4/9/09
I blog about the Angels at The Diamond Aces
I think it's the other way around
I think the Angels are waiting to resolve the 3rd base situation before they go after Halladay.
I think Tony wants Figgins signed so he can comfortably include Wood in a package to Toronto. If we make that trade before Figgins is back and he signs somewhere else, that’d be bad.
RIP Nick Adenhart
by ihearhowie2.0 on Dec 3, 2009 5:25 PM PST up reply actions
Todd Greene..
You bring up a very valid point, one that I think a lot of Wood’s proponents forget. Being highly valued and touted is one thing, but what if he doesn’t produce? I actually voted for giving Wood his shot, but I wonder if he doesn’t put up Kowbell like numbers if his biggest fans will remain patient, or, will they demand immediate success and scream for his head if he falters? Yet, I am also apprehensive about giving Figgy the type of contract that will guarantee his re-signing if it will handcuff the team financially.
YOU DON'T KNOW THE POWER OF THE DARKSIDE.....
As much as I like Figgins
He doesn’t do jack in the playoffs. Ever.
"Well make more fuckin' money. This is America. You don't make money, then you're a fuckin' douchebag." - Mr French "The Departed"
"You gotta have nuts." - Torii Hunter
Same could be said about A-Fraud until this year.
Angels baseball. We do what we must, because we can -- HaloDutch
Or, as the financial types say...
Past performance may not be indicative of future results.
Angels baseball. We do what we must, because we can -- HaloDutch
Or, to put a Jose Mota spin on it,
“The past, may not be happy or good, but, the Halos will succeed, when they are done with the past, which was not so good, but now, is good, since the past, is now done”.
YOU DON'T KNOW THE POWER OF THE DARKSIDE.....
Oooh Yeah....
Figgy played guitar good defense, jamming good with Weird and Gilly,
and the spiders from Mars. He played it left hand
But made it too far
Became the special man, then we were Figgy’s band.
God needed a starter. RIP #34
Ashes to ashes
Funk to funky. We know 3rd Echelon’s a junkie.
No matter what happens from here on, it has been a great season.
by Rally Manatee on Dec 3, 2009 3:08 PM PST up reply actions
Wow. Surprising vote.
I hope Figgy doesn’t see this!
Guys (and 2 gals or so), the question isn’t who should play 3rd base in ‘10, but who should lead off? I am not convinced that Aybar is ready for it. Using Abreu there will diminish his run producing. And please don’t say we should sign Granderson. I just don’t see a viable replacement for Figgins in the lead-off spot yet.
However, I would also hate to give Wood up. I’m growing fond of the idea of putting Figgins in LF, Wood at 3B, and rotating Rivera/Abreu at DH. Although, I’ve heard people say that Figgins wants to stay at 3rd. And I can see how a player with a lot of pride in his game might be pissed to have to move to make room for a rookie (i.e. Michael Young). I don’t know if Figgins is that way, or if he’d be happy to move for the good of the team. He seems like more of a team player.
Overall, I still say it is more important to sign Figgins than Lackey. We have a better chance of finding a replacement for Lackey than we do Figgins. Any of the following are good pitchers who could step into the role of staff ace: Weaver, Santana, Saunders, or Kazmir. And any of the following are functional pitchers who could step into the role of the 5th man: Moseley, Palmer, O’Sullivan, or Bell. That is a lot of options.
The only hitter who could possibly lead off in Figgins place is Aybar. Aybar had a .353 OBP to Figgins .395. Plus, some people keep worrying about Figgin’s caught stealing #‘s, but Aybar hasn’t even figured out how to steal yet. 14 SB, and 7 CS! Yikes! At best, he’d be a project that we’d hope would work out.
I wish everyone would see how right I am!
No matter what happens from here on, it has been a great season.
Perhaps Johnny Damon could be the new leadoff hitter
The Good
- career OBP of .355
- double-digit BB% in each of the last four years
- 68 steals (caught 11 times) over the last three seasons (86% success rate)
- Type A free agent not offered arbitration, so he doesn’t cost any draft picks
The Bad
- He’s 36
- Poor defensive outfielder
His bad defense could be partly mitigated by having him share the DH role with Rivera and Abreu.
If he’s available at a reasonable cost for a 1 or 2 year deal, he’d be a nice pick up for the Angels. I actually would prefer Damon over Bay or Holliday. Not because Damon is better, but because I think the market might grossly overprice Bay and Holliday. Bay apparently turned down $60m over 4 years (which is too much as it is) and I get the sense Holliday only thrives in the weaker NL.
by Fan Since 1981 on Dec 3, 2009 6:59 PM PST up reply actions
and tomorrow
Heyman will say they can’t afford him. Offseason rumors are just lies the teams put out to try to mislead other teams or to entertain their fans. The only time the Angels make a move is when no one is writing about them making a move.
It isn't that I hate Boston, just that I hate Bostonians.
Here is another article saying that the M's are the frontrunner's for Figgins
http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/10471160/Sources:-Mariners-lead-race-to-sign-3B-Figgins
"F it, let's pitch." - Ervin Santana
by Chzburger Jones on Dec 3, 2009 6:17 PM PST up reply actions
M's going after Figgings makes sense
Given that the Mariners have had six consecutive seasons where they have been outscored by their opponents, they probably are (oh I don’t know) in the market for players who are actually good at baseball.
by Fan Since 1981 on Dec 3, 2009 7:54 PM PST up reply actions
Yep
I had been saying the Red Sox would sign Figgins, since he does a lot that they like and need, but I forgot about the Mariners. They love the new defensive stats, they need a 3rd baseman, and I guess they still have a fetish for former Angels.
We just need to bid Figgy up to make sure whoever gets him overpays, but it looks like he is gone to me.
Polanco (returns) to the Phillies.
I saw him playing there for the Phillies when I visited Citizen’s Bank Park in 2005.
I love this team.
Does anyone know how much money the M's got?
can they sign Figgy and Lackey?
They want power. We want respect...
Seattle could, in theory.
But it’s not likely. They has about 40M coming off the books this year, of which ~25M will go towards new talent. (King Felix will get a raise, paying Jack Wilson, etc to eat the rest) So to get Lackey and Figgins could happen if the payroll was stretched a bit more, but it’s unlikely, given that there’s also a desire for a new left-fielder.
I don’t get the impression that Seattle is really in the Lackey hunt—more in it to gamble on Rich Harden or similar.
muneez
they haz it
Thank you, Nick Adenhart. You will always be remembered. #34
by howiestheman on Dec 3, 2009 11:10 PM PST up reply actions
maybe figgy gets offered 4/36
and overpay for Lackey, the future could look decent for seattle. Given that there young kids are barely making their way up to the MLB.
They want power. We want respect...
by SenorChuckles on Dec 3, 2009 9:47 PM PST up reply actions
As much as i love the Figster
it’s wood’s time. Although i may secretly think he will fail, i will root for him. (Wood, that is)
"Figgins' OBP is still over 40!" -Steve Physioc
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Recommended FanPosts
Recent FanPosts
In Association With
Big League Stew - MLB - Yahoo! Sports
- Josh Hamilton on public relapse: ‘It was just wrong. That’s all it comes down to.’
- Photo: The Marlins’ ridiculous-looking home run sculpture is almost complete
- Yankees GM Brian Cashman lures alleged stalker into police dragnet
- Report: Josh Hamilton had a relapse with alcohol
- Happy Birthday Boy! Wes Ferrell, the best-hitting pitcher of all-time, would be 104
Certain photos copyright © 2012 by Associated Press or Getty Images. Any commercial use or distribution without the express written consent of Associated Press and Getty Images is strictly prohibited.
