Are Angels disproportionately snubbed in the All-Star game?

by mattwelch on Jul 3, 2009 12:07 PM PDT Comment 16 comments

In my HTML clusterfudge of a comment on the Matt Holliday thread, I had a throwaway line about Bengie Molina being arguably the best catcher in Major League history to never make an All-Star game. So I decided to look at which active position players had the most career Win Shares (as of 2008, anyway; for some reason the Hardball Times is no longer keeping track of Win Shares in season) without having ever been named to an All-Star team. There are, shall we say, some familiar names on the list:

C Bengie Molina (122)
1B Kevin Millar (135)
2B Adam Kennedy (104)
SS Orlando Cabrera (169)
3B Adrian Beltre (186)
LF Raul Ibanez (150)
CF ~~Coco Crisp (82)~~ Mark Kotsay (146)
RF Matt Stairs (151)
DH Pat Burrell (163)

Some other current and former Angels nearly crack this list, too, including Jose Guillen (125) and Chone Figgins (101). And, as we all know, Tim Salmon was the best eligible player of all time to never make an All-Star team.

Something to think about whenever someone talks down an Angels or West Coast player's Hall of Fame candidacy based on number of All-Star teams made. Hopefully Joe Maddon will stoke Chone and Jered Weaver, and maybe even Mike Napoli or Juancho this year.

Poll

Best eligible player to have never made an All-Star team

Tony Phillips

1 votes

Tim Salmon

91 votes

Kirk Gibson

12 votes

Jose Cardenal

0 votes

Hal Trosky

2 votes

Adrian Beltre

4 votes

O-Cab

3 votes

113 votes | Poll has closed

This Fan-Post is authored by an independent fan. Tell us what you think and how you feel.

0 recs | Comment 16 comments

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Comments

Hal Trosky was awesome.

Put up awesome numbers year after year, even though he battled migraines almost constantly. His 1936 season was one for the ages 42 HR, 162 RBI’s, .343 BA, and a 1.026 OPS (wouldn’t you love to see that production in the middle of our lineup). But hey, don’t take my word for it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hal_Trosky Wikipedia page

http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/t/troskha01.shtml baseball reference page

Guy was a monster in his prime.

Phys: Well, Coon doesn't have a lot of power but he's a good bunter
Coon: F$%# That!
Thanks Zu

by halofan4life on Jul 3, 2009 12:38 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

So nice to see the anti-halo bias in such stark detail

these “numbers” of your have some uses

This team is gonna kill me.

by HaloDutch on Jul 3, 2009 12:39 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Oh well, I guess we're used to disappointment.

Remember when OC got absolutely snubbed in ’07? Yeah. Typical anti-Angel bias.

by 27up27down on Jul 3, 2009 6:05 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

But what would be the reason? Since this is fan voting based on first half results...

1. Failure of we Halo fans to take voting as seriously as fans of other winning teams? (Winning teams, because you need to have lots of wins in order to have lots of win shares.)

2. Failure of the media to promote, proportionally, the talent on the club to fans elsewhere?

3. The Halos being a second half team, or the stars being second half players?

We don't have a Bullpen. We have a Cowpen. Before we get to call it a Bullpen these guys gotta grow a pair.

by Stirrups on Jul 3, 2009 6:24 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

#1 is and always has been a huge problem

The only time we’ve done well in AS voting is when we imported perennial All-Stars, like Rod Carew.

Salmon was a bit of a second-half player, but click on my link there to see how that was much less so than most of us think.

Also, remember that fan voting is but a minority influence on overall team selection these days.

by mattwelch on Jul 3, 2009 6:47 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Well...

fan voting is but a minority influence on overall team selection these days

but what about those days?

IIRC, MLB put the #1 player on the depth chart of each team at each positon on the ballot and let the fans have at it.

We don't have a Bullpen. We have a Cowpen. Before we get to call it a Bullpen these guys gotta grow a pair.

by Stirrups on Jul 5, 2009 12:53 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Number 3 … only recently have the Angels been a second half team. They used to collapse at the ASB in the past.

I love this team.

by Downing Rules on Jul 6, 2009 8:09 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I voted for Salmon

While Gibson and Beltre had monster seasons, Salmon had a monster career. Likewise, OCab has had a great career (as had Tony Phillips) but neither of them had the career impact of Salmon upon a team.

by George Kaplan on Jul 4, 2009 6:19 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Bill Doran, Gary Maddox and Kevin McReynolds have decent arguments, too

by mattwelch on Jul 4, 2009 6:49 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

And I remember some chatter somewhere about Gibson red-assing his way OFF the team

Something about how in one or more of his best years he told MLB to get bent.

by mattwelch on Jul 4, 2009 6:50 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

that's the spirit

by Sethy on Jul 4, 2009 1:50 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Wah wah wah

who gives a spit? I was stoked when GA was MVP of the all-star game. Less so, when we didn’t make the playoffs that year. I’m also not happy with how it screws up rotations. If WTY is chosen, I hope he pitches so close to the game as to remove him from actually playing.

Success is the best revenge. Get snubbed and win the WS.

This season just seems jinxed. If it can go wrong, it does

by Moondoggy on Jul 4, 2009 4:43 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

I'm sorry, was someone crying?

And at this point in the game’s evolution, it hardly screws up any rotations any more.

by mattwelch on Jul 4, 2009 6:25 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

sure sounds like it

anti halo this, anti angel that. Nobody is AGAINST the Angels, they’re just for other teams. There is a huge large market bias, so NY Boston, Chicago and LA always seem to have questionable choices and I have no idea why halo fans are so blase, but they are. I enjoy the all-star game, I just don’t particularly care if our guys get in or not. I went last year (all 15 innings) and I’ll certainly go in 2010. My guess is that we’ll have a few players there (guaranteed if we win the WS and Soth does the choosing).

While rotations may not be “screwed up,” misuse of pitchers is certainly possible. For example, George Sherrill pitched in the 12. 13, and 14th inning. Baltimore cannot have been happy about that.

This season just seems jinxed. If it can go wrong, it does

by Moondoggy on Jul 4, 2009 9:41 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Not "anti-halo," but "disproportionately snubbed"

Do you see how there might be a difference there?

It’s something you’re either interested in or not, but the former doesn’t automatically imply any whining or conspiracy theories about ESPN.

by mattwelch on Jul 5, 2009 7:59 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I do see the difference and I agree that you are arguing for "disproportionate"

but the posting here is consistently discussing the “anti” argument:

“So nice to see the anti-halo bias in such stark detail”

“Typical anti-Angel bias”

I never mentioned anything about ESPN, although there clearly seems to be an east coast bias. But that’s all about money, not fairness. The Nielson’s and the advertisers dictate that.

I must not fear. Fear is the mind-killer.

by Moondoggy on Jul 5, 2009 8:21 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs