Bobby Wilson is the PTBNL

by rghan on Aug 30, 2009 9:15 AM PDT

...Based entirely on my own and Halosheaven contributor WUMBUG's speculation. Here's why:

Tampa's current back-up catcher, 38-year-old Gregg Zaun, comes with the steep annual price tag of $2 million. He's had a good season, hitting .258/.352/.404 and catching 24% of basestealers. His defense looks solid but not outstanding. Do the budget-conscious Rays really want Zaun's age-39 season enough to exercise his $2 million, 2010 option? I think they're looking for alternatives. By writing off Zaun's $.5 mil buyout and picking up Bobby Wilson, they save a cool $1 mil plus change.
Tampa's primary catcher, Dioner Navarro, is still under control for a couple more seasons, but he took a big step backwards after an allstar '08. He's hitting a paltry .220/.255/.333 in '09 and his defense has slipped too - he's stopped only 25% of basestealers this season after nabbing 38% in '08. The Rays have good reason to procure a talented back-up, both to light a fire under his ass and/or to absorb some playing time.
Tampa's in-house heir to the backup job, almost-26-year-old John Jaso, has disappointed this year. After hitting a combined .273/.391/.426 across AA and AAA last season, earning Baseball America's recognition as the Rays' 13th best prospect, Jaso is hitting just .256/.352/.353 this year in AAA. Moreover, his defense has always been suspect, and this year he's allowed 11 passed balls, committed 8 errors, and thrown out only 16% of basestealers. That's not what you want to see from a back-up catcher.
Bobby Wilson continues to impress behind the plate. AAA managers voted him best defensive catcher in the PCL, where he's caught 38% of basestealers in '09 ( (he caught 42% last year), allowed only 2 passed balls, and committed just 6 errors. He's had a down year with the bat, hitting only .271/.314/.399 in AAA, but he put up a much better .821 OPS last season. While his walk rate is down a little, his contact rate is about the same as last year and he's even hitting more line drives in spite of the lower BABIP. He's a great defender with some upside in his bat - think Bengie Molina as a best-case comp.
Jeff Mathis and Mike Napoli block Bobby at the MLB level and 21-year-old Hank Conger is on the verge of overtaking him. Despite the lack of opportunity, Bobby is popular in the Angels organization - Eddie Bane calls him major league ready - so I think they'd be happy to send him to a place where he's got a legitimate shot at playing time. That would also explain Maddon's enthusiasm for the PTBNL, as he's familiar with Bobby's work.
Bobby is too good to pass through waivers, so the Halos and Rays have to wait until the offseason to move him. Jjackflash points out that the Angels retain Wilson as a back-up for the remainder of this season, which works for both teams.

From Tampa's perspective, Bobby is the perfect "throw in" to the package, while the Halos lose little in seeing him off and gain a roster spot this offseason. What do you think?

Tweet Comment 49 comments | 0 recs |

Do you like this story?

Comments

Could be

but I don’t think Wilson is someone that Maddon would be excited about

by MH252525 on Aug 30, 2009 9:18 AM PDT reply actions

Sciossa isn't the only manager to appreciate the work of a catch-and-throw backup

by rghan on Aug 30, 2009 9:42 AM PDT up reply actions

First Jordan Walden, now Bobby wilson

Should we start a poll? Hell, I wish it was Jeff Mathis

I must not fear. Fear is the mind-killer.

by Moondoggy on Aug 30, 2009 9:25 AM PDT reply actions

In addition, it would allow the Angels to retain Wilson’s services as an emergency catcher. Wilson > Ryan Budde. As you note, the Rays doesn’t need Wilson this year because they still have Zaun & Navarro.

by jjackflash on Aug 30, 2009 9:29 AM PDT reply actions

Agreed

by rghan on Aug 30, 2009 9:42 AM PDT up reply actions

I Find It Amusing

How obsessed we (myself included) have become over trying to determine the identity of the PTBNL.

by jjackflash on Aug 30, 2009 9:32 AM PDT reply actions

With good reason

If it’s Walden, Reckling, Sean-Rod, or Wood, then we’ve given up way too much for Kazmir and it’s a terrible trade. I like Bobby Wilson and think he could well be a better backup C than Mathis, but I can live with that trade.

The HK-47 hitting droid is the finest line drive machine ever built

by RallyMonkey5 on Aug 31, 2009 3:03 PM PDT up reply actions

Can't we just lose Jeff Mathis on a roadtrip?

Maybe drop him off at a AA park where he’ll fit right in. No one will know he doesn’t belong there. Then we can promote Wilson like he deserves….

RIP Nick...

Jim Scully
Jim Scully Home

by jimmuscomp on Aug 30, 2009 9:35 AM PDT reply actions

Maybe it's Walden and Wilson

throw is Willits and I’ll be happy.

by Quinlan's Goofy Swing on Aug 30, 2009 10:02 AM PDT reply actions

Bobby Wilson is Darkman

Tell your statistics to shut up

by HaloDutch on Aug 30, 2009 10:17 AM PDT reply actions

Maybe Maddon is just excited about choosing a new pet

Soth already has three in Q, Mathis & Willits to pick from and Maddon probably can’t make up his mind which is the pick of the litter. They’re all so cute & adorable no matter how many hot steaming piles they leave at the plate.

2009 Halos:
"Don't worry bout a thing,
Cause every little thing gonna be all right!"

by Quad Fin Rider on Aug 30, 2009 10:45 AM PDT reply actions 1 recs

+1

NA 34

by blochead on Aug 30, 2009 11:37 AM PDT up reply actions

it very well could be wilson because of the previously...

mentioned organizational depth of napoli, mathis, conger and don’t overlook ramirez who we just drafted out of a.s.u and is off to a great start at orem. he has the tools and the leadership skills/swagger soth likes.

by thejd on Aug 30, 2009 10:54 AM PDT reply actions

Could be. I hope so

Navarro has been said to be “lazy.”

Play Wood already. Willits sucks.

by hauldog on Aug 30, 2009 10:55 AM PDT reply actions

Uncle Dioner's Sleepy Time Jamboree?

by BruinHalo on Aug 30, 2009 5:21 PM PDT up reply actions

I didn't check into the salary relief.

I looked at Gregg Zaun’s numbers and realized that he’s getting a bit old. They need a replacement.

Navarro’s numbers didn’t look great either. Also, another Rays’ poster on another thread made comments that read as if they are not completely sure of Navarro’s future.

by wumbug on Aug 30, 2009 11:01 AM PDT reply actions

I'm sold

Lest you think I have nothing but grassy-knoll theories to expound, the explanation above makes perfect sense. I looked more at Wilson and likewise came to the conclusion that he wouldn’t pass through waivers. Thus, waiting for the end of the season is logical.

Likewise, he was drafted in 2002, so it would follow that Maddon would have some familiarity with him—unlike, say, Walden—and that would account for the “excited” comment he made.

You and M. Poirot did an excellent job of sleuthing. Even better, my Kendrick home jersey retains its currency. Win/win!

"He's not a Rhodes Scholar to begin with''~Theo Epstein, talking about Papelbon

by George Kaplan on Aug 30, 2009 11:20 AM PDT reply actions

Definitely Not Wilson

At least according to Rob Neyer’s “Transaction Primer”

“a player to be named later.” – There are two restrictions at work here. First, the transaction must be completed within six months. And second, the player named later can’t have played in the same league as the team he’s being traded to. That’s why the player named later is almost always a minor leaguer.

Wilson has played with the Angels this season in the AL, the same league the Rays play in, making him ineligible to be a player to be named later. This also eliminates Sean Rodriguez from being the player to be named later.

by TRrrr on Aug 30, 2009 12:30 PM PDT reply actions

Not sure I buy that, since there must be qualifications in the rule book regarding "played in the same league"

And I can’t find a copy of the rule book online – just rehashes of ESPN’s and Wikipedia’s summary of the rule. You’re assuming that “hasn’t played in the same league” means only that season, so perhaps there are further qualifications like, “the player has to accrue enough time to get past rookie status” (ie, 130 AB’s?)? Mark Trumbo is the only player on the Halos’ 40 man roster who’s never played in MLB, and Matt Brown, Terry Evans, Freddy Sandoval, and Ryan Budde, the only other guys who haven’t played mlb this year, all don’t make much sense.

Ok, so this is what we think we know…

The Rays know who the PTBNL is (supposedly)…

They could have just traded a minor leaguer not on the DL outright…

So, if this rule is true at face value, the only player who makes sense is….

Jordan Walden. And that’s no throw-in. I don’t believe it’s him.

by rghan on Aug 30, 2009 12:54 PM PDT up reply actions

wrong

“League” refers only to the league the player is in when the trade occurs. Wilson and S-Rod are in the PCL and the Rays are in the AL.

by Rev Halofan on Aug 30, 2009 2:37 PM PDT up reply actions

Neyer disagrees

He distinctively uses the past tense “played”.

by TRrrr on Aug 30, 2009 3:06 PM PDT up reply actions

if that is the case

then it is Mason Tobin, Jordan Walden, Matt Brown, Ryan Budde, Freddy Sandoval or Mark Trumbo

by Rev Halofan on Aug 30, 2009 3:53 PM PDT up reply actions

I am pretty sure that Micah owings of the Adam Dunn to the DBacks rules this out

Play Wood already. Willits sucks.

by hauldog on Aug 30, 2009 4:40 PM PDT up reply actions

Hauldog is correct

As he pointed out to me, Sons of Sam Horn has a better explanation than Neyer.

“PTBNL, the player must not have been playing in the league to which he is being sent at the time of the trade (e.g. if the Red Sox receive a PTBNL, the player may not have been playing in the American League at the time of the trade).

Thanks Hauldog.

I do still think that Trumbo is a distinct possibility.

by TRrrr on Aug 30, 2009 6:20 PM PDT up reply actions

I'm pretty sure this is correct

I think it just can’t be the same league at the same time.

Bad Left Hook - The SB Nation boxing blog
"Baseball is played on the field, not on a calculator."

by Brickhaus on Aug 31, 2009 8:19 AM PDT up reply actions

Whew!

If this is accurate, then Wood and Rodriguez are not it. That mostly allays any fears. I’d worry about a guy like Conger or Reckling going though.

The HK-47 hitting droid is the finest line drive machine ever built

by RallyMonkey5 on Aug 31, 2009 3:05 PM PDT up reply actions

Trumbo makes a lot of sense.

But it is also possible that the Rays have an option of players (minor leaguers not on the 40 man) and Maddon is just excited about all the names.

If it’s Trumbo, it should be announced soon after Sept. 1

It it’s a choice of minor leaguers, the Rays have plenty of time to decide.

Also possible the PTBNL is contingent on Kazmir’s performance in September. And once again, Maddon is excited by all the choices.

Never seen a definitive source, but I don’t believe being on the minor league is any impediment to being traded. I don’t believe it is Walden either.

by TRrrr on Aug 30, 2009 1:09 PM PDT reply actions

Maybe it's Shane Loux

"He's not a Rhodes Scholar to begin with''~Theo Epstein, talking about Papelbon

by George Kaplan on Aug 30, 2009 2:03 PM PDT reply actions

Now that sounds plausible

from a value standpoint. He’s pretty much worn out his welcome here. And Maddon could be excited because he thinks they can get more out of Loux than we did.

The only question I have is why he would not simply be named now. Didn’t he have to clear waivers to be sent back down?

by rspencer on Aug 30, 2009 2:18 PM PDT up reply actions

He cleared waivers and pitched in relief last night for Salt Lake

But he too has “played in the same league” even if he’s not on the 40 man. So who has access to the MLB rule book on this?

by rghan on Aug 30, 2009 2:24 PM PDT up reply actions

Sorry kids

I was joking.

"He's not a Rhodes Scholar to begin with''~Theo Epstein, talking about Papelbon

by George Kaplan on Aug 30, 2009 2:59 PM PDT up reply actions

Not good if you want serious discussion

by rspencer on Aug 30, 2009 3:00 PM PDT up reply actions

Loux sucks - I got the joke.

If the other options are Wilson, S-Rod, Walden, B-Wood and Loux – there is, how do you say….a discrepancy. One of these things is not like the others.

RIP Nick...

Jim Scully
Jim Scully Home

by jimmuscomp on Aug 30, 2009 3:11 PM PDT up reply actions

then say something that is funny

don’t quit your day job chasing that standup comedy dream…

by Rev Halofan on Aug 30, 2009 3:54 PM PDT up reply actions

Pending a decision on what "different leagues" really means

I think this makes a lot of sense. That may be wishful thinking on my part, since I really don’t want to see another legitimate prospect go. Bobby Wilson had nowhere to go in the Angels organization. This would be fine as a throw-in from the Angels perspective.

I feel the need, the need...for speed!

by Gorbachav5 on Aug 30, 2009 3:16 PM PDT reply actions

Micah Owings was the PTBNL in th eAdam Dunn deal. He had played in the National league that year

Play Wood already. Willits sucks.

by hauldog on Aug 30, 2009 4:40 PM PDT reply actions

Reds to Az

Owings was in AAA at the time of the deal but started the year in the Diamondbacks major league rotation.

Therefore it only matters were you are at the time of the trade league wise.

Play Wood already. Willits sucks.

by hauldog on Aug 30, 2009 4:42 PM PDT up reply actions

uh oh

then bye bye Wood or S-Rod

by Rev Halofan on Aug 30, 2009 4:58 PM PDT up reply actions

Not necessarily but yes they certainly are elligible.

That whole “excited” thing makes me nervous.

Play Wood already. Willits sucks.

by hauldog on Aug 30, 2009 5:01 PM PDT up reply actions

the Rays need a catcher

maybe it’s Conger? (I hope not)

by Fred Fredrix on Aug 30, 2009 6:24 PM PDT reply actions

Halo Nation would explode if that happened

The Big Red Machine V.2 is coming this Fall 2009. Go Halos!

by Slyintine on Aug 31, 2009 12:55 AM PDT up reply actions

Conger's not on the 40-man

He would have just been traded outright.

Bad Left Hook - The SB Nation boxing blog
"Baseball is played on the field, not on a calculator."

by Brickhaus on Aug 31, 2009 8:21 AM PDT up reply actions

Has anyone actually HEARD the interview with Maddon?

Maddon has a sense of humor. Was he saying it tongue in cheek?

And even it was in seriousness, manager’s have to say that kind of stuff. It’s not like he would come out and say, “Well, that PTBNL, he’s just kind okay. But we’ll give him a shot.” He’s going to say he’s excited whether he is or not.

I feel the need, the need...for speed!

by Gorbachav5 on Aug 30, 2009 6:48 PM PDT reply actions

Ugh

Who puts a damn apostrophe to pluralize managers. FAIL.

I feel the need, the need...for speed!

by Gorbachav5 on Aug 30, 2009 6:48 PM PDT up reply actions

I catch myself doing it all the time. And then sometimes I don't catch it...

by rghan on Aug 30, 2009 7:02 PM PDT up reply actions

Mike Scioscia is the PTBNL

RIP #34

by linkbruin on Aug 30, 2009 11:54 PM PDT reply actions

The Rays don't need another so-so catcher!

They already have Navarro (okay … he’s bad, but they’ll keep him), Zaun (they WILL exercise his option), Riggans (coming back from injury and having been solid in ’08), Jaso (got better defensively and could be a useful backup) and Lobaton (looks good so far)!

Even if Wilson is a superb defender, he can’t fully make up for his very bad plate discipline! The Rays love players with excellent plate discipline!

by BurGi on Aug 31, 2009 2:25 AM PDT reply actions