The 2011 ASG in Arizona - Should MLB Take A Stand?

should they pull it. I dont need our Cuban Missle getting detained by a bunch of over-reacting, sun-bleached jerk-offs who think racial profiling is constitutional.

Ridiculous.

First, to compare this new law with the the whole Arizona MLK national holiday debacle is like comparing apples to oranges. On the one hand, nearly all americans were in agreement with setting aside a day to nationally honor a man whose efforts helped bring equality to an entire people- truly an american hero, and Arizona turned its head and looked the other way. And on the other hand, this same state has authored legislation to more clearly define already existing federal laws governing immigration to this country. While inherent racism is transparent in the one action, I do not think racism is necessarily involved in the second. Remember, to immigrate to this country by means other than legal ones is already a federal crime.
Second, the law being passed in Arizona does not allow police officers to simply pull over anyone and ask for proof of citizenship. To do so in itself is illegal. The new law merely allows police officers to act on evidence that a person in question is in this country illegally. Of course, the law is more complex and covers more ground than that, but that’s really how it affects the average person on the street.
As far as the law being racist, it only appears racist because Arizona happens to border a hispanic country and is a gateway to hispanic countries. If Vermont had a problem with illegal Canadians entering its state to the extent that Arizona is experiencing with hispanics, would Vermonters be seen as racist against Canadians if that state enacted a similar law?
Are Arizona lawmakers motivated racially in enacting this law? Maybe, but I doubt it. Do I support this law? Not necessarily. Should baseball allow itself to get mired in a political boondoggle? Absolutely not! Play ball!

Already Arizona makes most of its profit off of impounds and ticketing, and the judicial system there backs up some questionable, if not borderline corrupt, practices.

The fact that racial profiling can now be used as probable cause in any pull over, any questioning, any sort of initial police activity makes the entire state of Arizona an absolutely horrible place for anyone who is not white, rich, and a cop.

Fuck Arizona, next step is making all immigrants brand something on them to signify residency. Then a blitzkrieg into Mexico itself.

but this was because the PLAYERS boycotted the game not a decision by the league

Is how a country can’t control who come across its borders, but apparently believes that it’s capable of changing the weather in fifty years time.

This week, Arizona signed the toughest illegal immigration law in the country which will allow police to demand identification papers from anyone they suspect is in the country illegally. I know there’s some people in Arizona worried that Obama is acting like Hitler, but could we all agree that there’s nothing more Nazi than saying “Show me your papers?” There’s never been a World War II movie that didn’t include the line “show me your papers.” It’s their catchphrase. Every time someone says “show me your papers,” Hitler’s family gets a residual check. So heads up, Arizona; that’s fascism. I know, I know, it’s a dry fascism, but it’s still fascism.

It doesn’t matter what MLB should do, only what it will do: Nothing. Under no circumstances will Bud Selig involve the league in a political issue not directly related to baseball. The reason? The potential political backlash. You piss off the right well-connected congressman and all of a sudden your business model is being picked apart in a public hearing and subject to pending legislation. So the last thing MLB is about to do is align itself with a political cause. That makes political enemies who can ruin your proverbial birthday.

Congress has mostly left MLB alone to enjoy its antitrust exempt status. Bud Selig has been particularly aggressive in using this freedom to build a very effective cash-making machine. He’s not about to rock the boat. This is why drug-testing was such a big deal: Bud had to wallpaper it over before Congress could reconsider MLB’s antitrust exemption. If they start passing laws, the whole system has to be changed. Ticket prices, expansion teams, public-funded construction, the contract-labor system, probably just about everything, depending on the nature of the new regulations.

The union is another question: they do have an obligation to represent the interests of the players, many of whom are immigrants. But they’re still under federal scrutiny for allegedly facilitating commerce in illegal substances, so they don’t want to make enemies either. I think they’ll stay quiet so long as it doesn’t affect their membership. It’s unlikely that someone is going to hassle Albert Pujols over his immigrant status (he is a US citizen, by the way) anyways. But if some kids from the Dominican get in trouble during the Arizona Fall League or something, well, they aren’t even MBLPA members. You have to have a major-league contract.

I love the game of baseball as much as anyone, but you can’t forget what the business is all about: Money. It’s run by people who are worth kajillions of dollars, it’s played by people who are worth kajillions of dollars, and as a fan it doesn’t really matter to them what I think is the right thing to do (which I’m not going to say in this case) as long as I keep paying. Sad, really, but I don’t let myself think about it more than a couple of times each season. It’s much easier to just pretend everything to see is out there on the field.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TG4f9zR5yzY

we are talking about conservatism in Orange County in my seminar today. Oh I love my day.

No need to make the fans of Arizona suffer losing the opportunity to hose their FIRST All Star game. The Super Bowl is hosted in a neutral city, not the host team of a winner. What if Arizona was in the World Series this year? Should it go between Anaheim (naturally the AL winner) and a neutral NL city because of politics?

Agree with the law or not but that’s no reason to tarnish or deny Diamondback fans the privilege of the All Star game. How would you feel if California passed a controversial law and people were suggesting we lose the All Star game this year?

I think it proves that baseball is definitely going to have to deal with this issue in some way or other. I just learned there is now a movement to boycott the Diamond Backs because of their supposed support for this law. Celebrities are already lining up against this and don’t be surprised if a ball player or two does so eventually (not that either of their opinions are more or less valid than others).

I still lean towards “No” that MLB should not move the ASG next year, because that is simply running from the issue. Full debate about this should be had in public just like we’ve had here. I do think that unless this issue is solved before then, MLB should seriously update it’s crowd control plan for the 2011 ASG. Regardless of how much we want politics out of baseball and vice-versa, I think on this issue we’re going to have to put up with the two mixing to some extent.

The Angels are tied for first!

Film at 11.

I gotta say I enjoyed this thread immensely. It is a treat to read the points of view being discussed and reasoned here in such a civil manner. I realize this is blog about our beloved Angels but it is refreshing to see this kind of give and take going on.

I just pasted a link in my original post and here it is again.

Link here and in original post.

We’d like to see your papers.

HERE

The Phoenix Suns played in jerseys with “Los Suns” as the team name. Apparently with David Stern’s approval.

Senator Menendez is now asking MLBPA to boycott the 2011 ASG. Here’s the link again.

Figured it was worth including since this thread is back in the recent feed.

…what if this law is popular? Well, according to this polling data, it is a popular law. 51% say the law is about right, while another 9% saw the law doesn’t go far enough (!). That’s leaves 36% that believe the law goes too far and 4% that are apparently clueless.

And – as the Rev argued above – this is the type of issue extremists latch onto, churning their own agendas to the detriment of all.

…because something is popular, it must be right. So, on that we agree. I was simply providing an answer to the question the Rev asked above, and I found the reults interesting. I mean, 60% either think the law is about right or doesn’t go far enough! That’s a strong headwind for any proposed boycott by any politicians or MLB executives. Worse, (my other point which echoes the Rev) it plays into the hands of extremists. With few exceptions, I don’t like extremists or extreme views.

Cracking down on employers that hire illegals is like cracking down on drug dealers to eliminate the use of narcotics. You may put a small dent in the overall numbers, but the economic incentives for employer and illegal immigrant are far too powerful to control at the employment level. How do you stop a transaction where both sides are grateful for the outcome? Besides, the employer crackdown provisions are already in place from the 1986 immigration reform law. They just aren’t being enforced to any great extent.
I return to what I wrote above. You won’t slow the flow of immigrants unless;
1) A fence is built along our southern border.
2) Economic conditions improve in Mexico (and to a lesser extent in other central American countries) to where a healthy worker can earn 2/3 or 3/4 of what they can earn in the USA.

Short of that, the human tide will ebb and flow based on relative economic opportunities. The irresistible force of human migration will overwhelm the not-so-immovable object of arbitrary, man-made borders.