Soria or Bell
by hebes31 on Jul 27, 2010 1:02 PM PDT
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First off, this is my first time posting on this blog and I have enjoyed all the different perspectives and opinions. I have been an Angels fan since the mid '90s (since that unbelievable collapse in 1995).
I wanted to get this post in before the trade deadline had passed. With the trades for Callapso and now Haren (and possibly another one on the horizon), there is one trade thay may or may not happen and that is for bullpen help. Earlier in the season, two players mentioned as possibly on the trading block were Heath Bell and Joakim Soria. I know that Bell's name has been linked to the Angels before. While either player could help the team, one in particular would be my choice and that is Soria. Based purely on stats, he looks to be the better option. He's younger (26 to Bell's 32). While Bell has pitched longer, Soria has more saves (114 to 58 alhough in Bell's defense he only had two saves in his whole career before 2009). His career era is 2.12. For his career, batters are hitting .198 although he fares much better against righties. Only 12 blown saves..
His contract is $3 million for this year and $4 million for next season. 2012-2014 are option years so its not a hefty contract to take on.
I'm not going to say who we should give up to get him but saying that he is worth trading for. His stats speak for themselves. Using him as our closer and utilizing Fuentes as left-handed specialist (as others have suggested although he may refuse) would be a good fit.
What do you think?
This Fan-Post is authored by an independent fan. Tell us what you think and how you feel.
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The Royals turned down Montero from the Yankees for Soria. I really doubt the Angels have enough to get Soria from them.
And the Padres are in 1st place, I really doubt they would trade Bell
No way
Would they turn that down.
WTY's ERA+ = 135 : - / -- Kevin Frandsen > Brandon Wood??????
by Figgi4life on Jul 27, 2010 6:35 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions
Soria has a no trade clause to the Yankees.
Now stuck in Colorado Springs
by stuck in Romania on Jul 27, 2010 11:09 PM PDT up reply actions
Montero is probably a top 10 MLB prospect
We have only one guy who can top that – Trout – and he better not be going anywhere. Ever.
"That boy is our last hope" - Obi Wan Scioscia, as Francisco Rodriguez left for the Mets. "No, there is another" - Yoda Reagins.
by RallyMonkey5 on Jul 28, 2010 10:50 AM PDT up reply actions
Montero is hype, like so many other Yankee prospects.
Look at his #’s this year.
by Wally's World on Jul 28, 2010 8:01 PM PDT up reply actions
As good as these guys are
I don’t want the Angels to trade away more young prospects.
Torii Hunter has some Brain Movage
Have you not noticed that the P{adres are in first?
Really, I am sure they are just salivating at the thought of trading him to us.
Soria is exceedingly valuable.
Padres might trade Bell
They are one of those Sabr-friendly organizations that thinks saves are an overrated stat. Plus, everybody in their bullpen has been dominant. The Padres probably think they can get more for Bell than some of the lessor known guys, like Gregorson.
I would not be the least bit surprised if they traded Bell and used another one of their excellent relievers as the closer. Personally, I don’t care if it’s Bell or somebody else, but I’d love to acquire one of their bullpen guys if we can match players up.
"That boy is our last hope" - Obi Wan Scioscia, as Francisco Rodriguez left for the Mets. "No, there is another" - Yoda Reagins.
by RallyMonkey5 on Jul 28, 2010 10:53 AM PDT up reply actions
Jed Hoyer
is way more of a Sabr guy than KT ever was.
"This is no ordinary honey!"
Bolts From The Blue - Heavy with the facts, slightly less heavy with the opinions.
by Zach (maestro876) on Jul 28, 2010 5:43 PM PDT up reply actions
If they did trade him for those reasons . . .
. .. it stands to reason they would want a big bat back to help their offense. Do we have that to trade? Napoli would fit, maybe they would want Jaun Gone as well. I just don’t think there is much more than a 1% chance.
by Wally's World on Jul 28, 2010 8:04 PM PDT up reply actions
I guess it depends on what needs the other two have...
…the Royals are going to be looking for prospects and after the last couple of weeks, I’m not sure we’d want to be shedding too many more of them.
The Padres, on the other hand, since they’re in a race are looking to improve now – that means finding a need on their current 25 man roster that we can match well with.
To me, it looks like their biggest holes are in the outfield. Can we unload Rivera for one of their other relievers (where they appear to have loads of depth) and bring up Bourjous?
I see red people
Welcome to HH
but neither. Bell will not get traded because they are 1st place and Soria is going to require Trout in return. He has a team friendly contract so they have no reason to give him up cheap.
Now batting, our rookie of the year, Miiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiike TROUT!
yea I concur
the cost of Soria is prohibitive to acquiring him.
Soria for Callaspo!!!
Straight up baby!
Now stuck in Colorado Springs
by stuck in Romania on Jul 27, 2010 2:02 PM PDT reply actions
Both
are unlikely. We’ll need to unload a huge package of prospects for Soria and the Padres trading Bell is as likely as the Halos trading Weaver. I’m still saying the Halos gotta sign Darvish. In the WBC he did close out some games for Japan so the closer mentality and the stuff is there. He’ll probably be another K-Rod in the closer role. Walk a couple for heart attacks, then strike out the side.
Indians
I would like to see a trade done for Carmona and/or Westbrook. Won’t cost a lot and they could be starters or relief.
Bullpen
Everyone is on point regarding both those options, in that they aren’t really options at all.
In terms of bullpen, the Angels don’t need to make a splash. They just need some depth, a guy that can throw an inning and not give up 3 or 4 runs.
Thanks
Thanks for the welcome. So it looks like either player would require too much. If its for depth, who out there is worth getting for nothing?
The Padres would be open to trading Bell
but it would cost you dearly.
"This is no ordinary honey!"
Bolts From The Blue - Heavy with the facts, slightly less heavy with the opinions.
by Zach (maestro876) on Jul 27, 2010 6:22 PM PDT reply actions
Say what?!?
The Padres are in first place in the NL West. They have won 58 games as of this morning, and fully half of those wins are also saves for Heath Bell.
For what good reason would a team looking to win its division after being a horrible, horrible team last year go and trade the guy who is the anchor of the bullpen when any team trying to win its division needs just such an anchor?
It appears you have confused the 2009 and 2010 San Diego Padres. Heath Bell isn’t being traded for anything less than an Pujols-level player, and no team is going to make that stupid a deal just to get Heath Bell.
"I can't tell people what to think or not to think. Their perceptions are their perceptions. We just feel we've taken a step forward. At the end of the day, we have to play 162 games. Once that happens then we'll be able to evaluate the offseason moves."~Tony Reagins, on the Angels' offseason
by George Kaplan on Jul 27, 2010 9:42 PM PDT up reply actions
The padres have a ton of solid relievers
They would trade bell because it wouldnt really hurt them. It would be like when we let percy walk since we had francisco rodriguez and a ton of other solid bullpen guys.
They would trade him because they want the prospects. We would not get a fair trade for him, we would have to overpay.
by Balls and Strikes on Jul 28, 2010 8:57 AM PDT up reply actions
You wrote it, but I think you missed it
We let Percy walk in the offseason. We didn’t trade him with two months to go while leading the division in a tight race.
Trading the closer in the height of a pennant race can send the wrong message to the players.
"I can't tell people what to think or not to think. Their perceptions are their perceptions. We just feel we've taken a step forward. At the end of the day, we have to play 162 games. Once that happens then we'll be able to evaluate the offseason moves."~Tony Reagins, on the Angels' offseason
by George Kaplan on Jul 28, 2010 10:58 AM PDT up reply actions
+1
Yah that is another good point, team morale.
by Wally's World on Jul 28, 2010 8:06 PM PDT up reply actions
While I don't think it will actually end up happening
I think they’d be open to the possibility if the price was right. Bell is almost certainly not going to be on the Padres next year. He’s getting up there in age and price. True, he’s a great bullpen arm and the Padres are in a pennant race. However, as was pointed out, San Diego possess a half dozen other guys who are extremely talented, cheaper, and younger.
So, that’s why I said they would be open to the possibility, but it would cost the Angels (or anyone) quite a bit.
"This is no ordinary honey!"
Bolts From The Blue - Heavy with the facts, slightly less heavy with the opinions.
by Zach (maestro876) on Jul 28, 2010 12:45 PM PDT up reply actions
The Padres have new owners. San Diego is not a small market.
by Wally's World on Jul 28, 2010 8:06 PM PDT up reply actions
Second-largest city in California...it certainly isn't "small market"
More people than San Francisco and Oakland combined.
"I can't tell people what to think or not to think. Their perceptions are their perceptions. We just feel we've taken a step forward. At the end of the day, we have to play 162 games. Once that happens then we'll be able to evaluate the offseason moves."~Tony Reagins, on the Angels' offseason
by George Kaplan on Jul 28, 2010 8:42 PM PDT up reply actions
You don't quite understand the financial situation of the Padres.
The team has a ton of debt from Petco Park and are still reeling from Moores’s divorce. The new ownership group doesn’t have a lot of money, and the team’s budget depends largely on attendance, attendance which has been down this year from last, despite the fact that the team is winning.
I don’t think the Padres would look to trade Bell, because they like the chemistry of what they have going in their bullpen, and what Heath brings in terms of performance. But if a team really wanted him and was willing to give up a bunch they’d do it. That’s all I’m saying.
"This is no ordinary honey!"
Bolts From The Blue - Heavy with the facts, slightly less heavy with the opinions.
by Zach (maestro876) on Jul 28, 2010 11:55 PM PDT up reply actions
I don't think you understand the current ownership
Moorad, whose 12-member investor group now owns 50% of the Padres (purchasing in increments from Moores) and is now calling the shots, boasts that his investors have an aggregate net worth of $4B.
There is no need for the owners to play cheap. There certainly isn’t a need to run a Yankee-sized payroll, but the requirement to limit payroll to approx $38M should be no longer in force. These owners know that winning teams and post-season dreams can bring out the fans.
"I can't tell people what to think or not to think. Their perceptions are their perceptions. We just feel we've taken a step forward. At the end of the day, we have to play 162 games. Once that happens then we'll be able to evaluate the offseason moves."~Tony Reagins, on the Angels' offseason
by George Kaplan on Jul 29, 2010 9:54 AM PDT up reply actions
I realize that.
But at the same time, it doesn’t change the fact that Moorad has stated numerous times in public that it’s going to take time to raise the payroll. The only thing he’s offered is vague promises to get it up to the $70m range “at some point down the road”. I would be surprised if the Padres’ 2011 payroll exceeds $45m dollars.
"This is no ordinary honey!"
Bolts From The Blue - Heavy with the facts, slightly less heavy with the opinions.
by Zach (maestro876) on Jul 30, 2010 12:37 AM PDT up reply actions
Those are decisions a team makes in the offseason
It doesn’t trade its closer in the midst of a pennant race.
"I can't tell people what to think or not to think. Their perceptions are their perceptions. We just feel we've taken a step forward. At the end of the day, we have to play 162 games. Once that happens then we'll be able to evaluate the offseason moves."~Tony Reagins, on the Angels' offseason
by George Kaplan on Jul 30, 2010 9:31 AM PDT up reply actions
So's Heath Bell.
"This is no ordinary honey!"
Bolts From The Blue - Heavy with the facts, slightly less heavy with the opinions.
by Zach (maestro876) on Jul 27, 2010 7:16 PM PDT up reply actions
I thought that was an interestng point, so I looked it up.
This year, Bell has been better, in pretty much every category. Last year, they were roughly equal, Bell slightly better. In 2008, Soria was better. In 2007, they were roughly equal.
If you want to say Soria is younger and cheaper, that’s true. But in terms of sheer performance, they’re about the same with Bell being slightly better.
"This is no ordinary honey!"
Bolts From The Blue - Heavy with the facts, slightly less heavy with the opinions.
by Zach (maestro876) on Jul 28, 2010 12:43 PM PDT up reply actions
I also have doubts about NL relievers after the whole Fuentes debacle
Which is probably why I would rather have Soria.
But you provide an excellent point. As of right now I call it a push just looking at the stats
Yeah but you can look at the two and see the differences (Bell and Fuentes).
Fuentes is a soft-tosser, always has been. He depends on deceptive delivery and fooling hitters. Bell is a power pitcher who over-matches hitters with his mid-90s fastball and keeps them off balance with his slurvy breaking ball. He also gets a lot of ground balls, which help him keep the home runs down.
And really, Fuentes isn’t as bad as he’s appeared this season. Not dominating, but not horrible either.
"This is no ordinary honey!"
Bolts From The Blue - Heavy with the facts, slightly less heavy with the opinions.
by Zach (maestro876) on Jul 29, 2010 12:00 AM PDT up reply actions
You're worried about the closer now?
I would be more concerned about the offense and our inability to score more than three runs in game.
Our hitting is worse than anemic
good god i thought this post was going to compare trevor bell to joakim soria
What do you need a fancy suit for, Charlie, you ain't got no job to wear it to.
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