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Reagins says we may be sellers

As reported by the L.A. Times this morning, Tony Reagins, Mike Scioscia, and the team's coaching staff met for 45 minutes after the 7-3 loss to Boston yesterday.  Reagins acknowledged to reporters that he would be open to trading veterans for prospects before the trade deadline on Saturday, and he and Scioscia both suggested that they were looking into options that will improve the team "this year or in future years."

Star-divide

The Times speculated that the team could trade veterans such as Bobby Abreu, Brian Fuentes, Hideki Matsui, and Maicer Izturis, but that the team is "not likely to trade players they consider part of their core for the next two or three years."

"We would consider any move that would strengthen us, whether it's for this year or in future years," Reagins said.  "You have to look at the deal and make a determination."
"There are some things we need to take hard looks at," Scioscia said.  "We want to look at things that make us better now and in the future."

 Although the Times does not identify the "core" of players not likely to be traded, we can reasonably assume that the 2011 Angels will include Dan Haren, Jered Weaver, Ervin Santana, Joel Pineiro, Kendry Morales, Torii Hunter, Erick Aybar, Alberto Callaspo, and Mike Napoli.  Despite all of the problems this year, that is a great foundation for us, and we have many reasons to be confident about next season, particularly because even this year our starting pitching has been among the league's best (and it should be even better next season with the full-time addition of Haren).  In my opinion, that is why the trade for Haren was so great -- it brought in a front-line talent for multiple years without giving up any of the team's core players or taking away our flexibility to sell our spare parts.

With all of that said, having considered the standings, the team's recent play (7-16 since the Texas series a month ago), and the injury to Pineiro, I would be in favor of trading away veterans to re-stock the farm system.  I am pleased that the front office appears willing to do so.

This Fan-Post is authored by an independent fan. Tell us what you think and how you feel.

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I would add Howie to that list

I know he has sucked lately, but his glove and bat will only get better as he matures into a all star caliber player. And we all know he is the second best 2nd baseman (behind Cano) in the American League this year.

Other than that, I agree with you. Time to retool and get ready to kick ass in 2011. Maybe this season will be the “pause that refreshes.”

by bearnut on Jul 29, 2010 8:25 AM PDT reply actions  

I think Howie has more trade value then the other veterans

I think we could get a few decent prospects for him. I just can’t imagine that Matsui, Fuentes or Abreu could fetch much of a deal.

Torii Hunter has some Brain Movage

by ryanfea on Jul 29, 2010 8:29 AM PDT up reply actions  

The only reason we shouldn't trade Howie

is because we’d be selling incredibly low. How do you figure he’s the second best behind Cano? He is currently 12th in the majors in OPS among second basemen and that includes his pathetic .307 OBP. He’s 27, so the maturity should already be here. He couldn’t bounce back and have a solid year next season, but at this point I’m guessing he’ll be splitting time with Izzy and Frandsen next season.

by dmhead on Jul 29, 2010 8:34 AM PDT up reply actions   1 recs

Pedroia on crutches

is a better 2B (trade-value-wise) than Howie.

by Rev Halofan on Jul 29, 2010 8:40 AM PDT up reply actions  

I hate Boston

and everyone who wears their uniform. But come on, Pedroia has been better at everything you can do on a baseball field than Howie.

There was a time when they were both prospects that they looked to have equal value in different ways. Kendrick should have a higher average, more power potential (since he;s not a midget), and more speed. Pedroia had better strike zone judgement, excellent batting average himself, and a better glove.

Sad truth is Pedroia has hit for a better average, more power, and stolen more bases at a better rate. Plus he’s lived up to the superior patience and defense. Howie’s been an decent player before this year, but is no better than middle of the pack among 2B. We have Izturis and Frandsen as 2B options if Callaspo plays third, and Amarista down on the farm.

Don’t trade Howie just to get rid of him, but if you can get something that helps us more in 2011, then go for it.

"That boy is our last hope" - Obi Wan Scioscia, as Francisco Rodriguez left for the Mets. "No, there is another" - Yoda Reagins.

by RallyMonkey5 on Jul 29, 2010 11:16 AM PDT up reply actions  

My evil twin is pulling for HK and Wood to get traded.

Just so that we can see how well they would fare under any other batting coach. It’s way past time to find out once and for all how much of an impact Hatcher has on these prospects.

"Wastin away again in Minor-Leaguer-Ville..."

by Stirrups on Jul 29, 2010 1:45 PM PDT up reply actions   1 recs

very true Stirrups

When I'm not at the stadium, I'd rather be watching my Halos back in Costa Rica!

by Dono Romantico on Jul 29, 2010 1:56 PM PDT up reply actions  

I agree, sort of.

Compared to most MLB 2nd basemen, Kendrick doesn’t appear to be anything special, but compared to those who may be available to replace him, he is considerably better.

- On our current roster, Mouser is too injury prone, and Frandsen is unproven.

- In our minors, we no longer have a viable replacement. I haven’t heard a lot of buzz about Nate Sutton, Hanley Statia, or Luis Figueroa.

- The 2nd basemen available as free agents after this season are pathetic, and the best 2nd basemen are not likely to be traded (Cano, Utley, Pedroia, Phillips…). The only two that seem like possibilities are Ricky Weeks or Dan Uggla. Although Weeks has 1 more year of eligibility for arbitration and Uggla is supposedly in negotiations for a contract extension.

So, even though we would like to see better production out of the 2nd base position, it looks as if it would be better to hang to Howie for at least another year.

"jut keep winning babt" - Moondoggy

by Rally Manatee on Jul 29, 2010 1:37 PM PDT up reply actions  

You're forgetting Callaspo

His natural position is 2B. That’s why his acquisition made no sense at all, unless you unload Howie. I’d probably rather flip Callaspo.

by Suboptimal on Jul 29, 2010 2:01 PM PDT up reply actions  

His fielding ratings suggest he is better at 3B

Even though 2B is his natural position

NA, #34 SP, LAA
Light up the Halo for Nick!

More Howie please...

by hk47 on Jul 29, 2010 3:19 PM PDT up reply actions  

True

I was forgetting Callaspo, and I’d rather flip him too.

"jut keep winning babt" - Moondoggy

by Rally Manatee on Jul 29, 2010 3:30 PM PDT up reply actions  

i hope we get some relief for our vets

and i would certainly be open to trading howie if the price is right. the problem is that MIF isn’t very strong in baseball right now, so even though howie isn’t amazing, he’s certainly not HURTING us.

R.I.P. Nick Adenhart - Always an Angel

by Kernel on Jul 29, 2010 8:31 AM PDT reply actions   1 recs

I doubt we would trade Izturis

He is too valuable as a versatile bench guy, especially with his contract.

However, Matsui, Fuentes, Napoli (if the pieces coming back were good), Kendrick (ditto with Napoli), Kazmir, Wood and Rodney would all be available in my eyes. I’d also throw in Trumbo if we could get some nice pieces in return.

Abreu’s a funny one, he was a team leader last year, and his contract is prohibitive enough that I doubt anyone would want to take it on without us kicking in some cash or taking crap back in return. The cost/benefit would seem to indicate he would not be going anywhere. I’d keep him, and see if he can get back to form this year and the next.

by TheQuestforMerlin on Jul 29, 2010 8:34 AM PDT reply actions  

Abreu has other value

I know that it is really difficult to put a quantitative value on stuff that doesn’t take place on the field, but Bobby definitely helps out the team regardless of where he is playing or how he is hitting. There was a noticeable improvement in a few different players from his coaching and mentoring, and I think that is going to continue to be beneficial, especially if we bring in younger players from these trades.

I think that Wood and Rivera need to be the first two to go. I know that neither of them carries a lot of value right now, but based on their performance this season I want their stench removed from our Stadium.

Rockin' Out in Section 205...

by AP2TUDE on Jul 29, 2010 8:38 AM PDT up reply actions  

I agree with regards to Abreu

His off the field stuff is valuable, if not quantifiable (to fans at least). His impact last year was big, and would still be an important figure at the club this year (despite the drop in stats). Hopefully he’ll snap out of it, and we shift him to the DH spot next year (if we make the right signing – Carl Crawford – and Bourjos plays like a Major leaguer).

I forgot to add Rivera to the list, I haven’t been happy with his play this year either (nor has Scioscia it seems, judging by some video shots of his reactions to misplays etc).

by TheQuestforMerlin on Jul 29, 2010 8:51 AM PDT up reply actions  

Who did he help this year?

I know that it is common to repeat the line from last year but seeing how ALL of our guys are hitting below expectations (exception to Hunter), I’m struggling to see Bobby’s contribution as a mentor.

This club has underperformed. If he gets credit for helping the team (like he did last year) he should also share the blame when the team plays as poorly as it has.

Trade him. You might need to eat $3-4m before you get a decent prospect back. But, he is at the top of my list of players who should be moved.

by bjsguess on Jul 29, 2010 10:30 AM PDT up reply actions   1 recs

I was thinking the same

about him taking credit for last season, but then this season being such a bust.

although I don’t think we should trade him. I like Bobby, and he is a perfect DH for next season. shit, he’s the only guy stealing bases for Scioscia’s speedy, 1st to 3rd ballclub mentality.

by 2pintsofbooze on Jul 29, 2010 10:32 AM PDT up reply actions  

Aybar

His BB rate is even better this year than last year, when it was better than the year before. Abreu got credit for that. It would appear that Aybar is still listening to him.

by jjackflash on Jul 29, 2010 10:40 AM PDT up reply actions  

Napoli

is not hitting below expectation. Any catcher who can hit 20+ HRs and around .250 as well as call a decent game is okay in my book. He’s even throwing out runners over league average this season.

"jut keep winning babt" - Moondoggy

by Rally Manatee on Jul 29, 2010 3:36 PM PDT up reply actions  

I would MUCH rather hold on to Naps,

As opposed to Mathis. ALCS aside, I still don’t get the Mathis love from Scioscia.

YOU DON'T KNOW THE POWER OF THE DARKSIDE.....

by halofolife on Jul 29, 2010 4:05 PM PDT up reply actions  

amen

"jut keep winning babt" - Moondoggy

by Rally Manatee on Jul 30, 2010 6:12 PM PDT up reply actions  

I agree

I’m OK with Abreu sticking around one more year. His season has been disappointing but not “bad”. He just shouldn’t be counted on to be one of our main run producers, nor should he be expected to start in right 150+ times. Hopefully the team embraces who he is at this point in his career and put him batting first or second next year, mostly as a DH.

by dmhead on Jul 29, 2010 8:38 AM PDT up reply actions  

Yup

We’re only a couple of moves away from a really dangerous team in 2011. Hopefully one of those moves is Abreu to the DH (if the right signings can be made).

by TheQuestforMerlin on Jul 29, 2010 8:52 AM PDT up reply actions  

If someone wants him, give him up.

I’d rather see Napoli DH, or at least split it with Rivera if Rivera sticks around.

"jut keep winning babt" - Moondoggy

by Rally Manatee on Jul 29, 2010 3:37 PM PDT up reply actions  

No on Matsui.

Too valuable to the japanese market. Must sell jerseys. What will FSW do about the obligatory japanese cameraman shot? What about the billboards? WHAT ABOUT THE BILLBOARDS????

What do you need a fancy suit for, Charlie, you ain't got no job to wear it to.

by clover_black on Jul 29, 2010 8:38 AM PDT reply actions   1 recs

And?

The guy has sucked this year, and there is no upside. I say get what we can for him.

by bearnut on Jul 29, 2010 8:41 AM PDT up reply actions  

Right you are.

I should have read it a bit more carefully.

by bearnut on Jul 29, 2010 8:50 AM PDT up reply actions  

how many years is he on for?

His potential is not so weathered that I wouldn’t be willing to ride out his contract if its one more year.

by NA1NSXR on Jul 29, 2010 12:24 PM PDT up reply actions  

trade him to Seattle so he can be with Ichiro

and they can corner to Japanese market. Doesn’t Nintendo own the team anyways? We can trade him for some Starbucks coffee.

When I'm not at the stadium, I'd rather be watching my Halos back in Costa Rica!

by Dono Romantico on Jul 29, 2010 1:41 PM PDT up reply actions   1 recs

Catcher

Funny how you list our back up first baseman, but not “Golden Boy” Jeff Mathis and his .230 batting average.

by graydog28 on Jul 29, 2010 8:39 AM PDT reply actions   1 recs

Maybe because

Mathis has zero value to contending teams? He needs to be non-tendered and pray for a minor league invite from someone. He made his million this year, I hope he invested wisely.

If Sosh puts so much stock in catcher defense, why not re-sign Jose Molina? At least he’s actually, you know, good defensively.

by dmhead on Jul 29, 2010 8:43 AM PDT up reply actions  

+1

not because signing molina would be a good idea
but i found that funny

One time...

by mikvitu on Jul 29, 2010 9:03 PM PDT up reply actions  

Mathis has value

There are plenty of teams that buy into the myth that Mathis is a good defensive catcher. He won’t net much but I would much rather have a Napoli/Conger platoon in ’11.

by bjsguess on Jul 29, 2010 10:32 AM PDT up reply actions  

Good.

Now batting, our rookie of the year, Miiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiike TROUT!

by angelskid2210 on Jul 29, 2010 8:49 AM PDT reply actions  

I'm all for selling...

 but we should only sell people who we have reasonable replacements for next year. Bourjos is a good replacement for one of our OF. But we probably can’t dump both Abreu AND Rivera unless we know for sure we’re signing Crawford.

I don’t see why we would sell Kendrick unless we got a 2B in return. We have nobody to replace him. Izturis has proven he can’t play everyday.

Dumping Matsui is a no brainer. Napoli DH’s next season.

Fuentes is a good trade if we get relievers in return but I wouldn’t dump him otherwise.

by Nashdiesel on Jul 29, 2010 8:52 AM PDT reply actions  

Napoli

I agree he should be part of the DH rotation to get his bat in there everyday, but he should still catch at least half the time. This season should prove once and for all that he is our only catcher that has the slightest idea how to hit.

by dmhead on Jul 29, 2010 8:56 AM PDT up reply actions  

I want Brandon Phillips at 2B

I don’t think we’ll get him (or that the Reds are selling), but that doesn’t lesson my desire. Prior to this year there was talk that the Reds might move him, but because they’re contending now, I doubt that would happen. Still. Would be all for it.

by TheQuestforMerlin on Jul 29, 2010 8:57 AM PDT up reply actions  

I dont get why
Jeff I cant catch or bat Mathis is actually getting more starts than Naps. Naps has the better bat, even in his slumps, and so far this year, they’ve been pretty much even in D. A DH platoon of Abreu against rightys and Naps catches, and against leftys, Naps DH and Mathis catch.

by phoenix15 on Jul 29, 2010 9:13 AM PDT up reply actions  

Some questions about the universe just can't be explained

Although, objectively, we know that Scioscia has his own way of assessing catchers. He rates Mathis’ defense, no matter what any stat/scout might say. Its the one position on the field he always states that defense comes first.

The catcher spot to Scioscia is like the pitcher spot in the NL, anything coming from it is gravy.

He tries to get Naps offense in on occasion, but he won’t sacrifice defense (i.e. Mathis) totally. We just have to pray that Hank Conger can impress Scioscia with his defense enough to keep is bat in there full time.

by TheQuestforMerlin on Jul 29, 2010 9:21 AM PDT up reply actions  

I have a scary thought

What if Sosh kept Mathis as catcher for the entire length of his contract through 2018?

Torii Hunter has some Brain Movage

by ryanfea on Jul 29, 2010 9:25 AM PDT up reply actions  

THen
don’t expect any deep playoff runs until 2019

by phoenix15 on Jul 29, 2010 9:28 AM PDT up reply actions  

My head would explode

Although, as an experiment, it would be quite interesting. What’s the longest a player has stayed in the Majors, whilst providing the bare minimum offense…

I think Mathis could break some records. Maybe MLB Network could do a special on it.

by TheQuestforMerlin on Jul 29, 2010 9:33 AM PDT up reply actions  

See Cora, Alex

"jut keep winning babt" - Moondoggy

by Rally Manatee on Jul 29, 2010 3:47 PM PDT up reply actions  

Mario Mendoza.

Article

Stats

The Devil went down to Georgia, and all I got was this gold fiddle. Go Angels! helpfindscottajob@gmail.com

by Slasher52 on Jul 29, 2010 3:58 PM PDT up reply actions  

I don't know that Mathis will be back next year.

This may be wishful thinking, but we did take him to arbitration and he won – meaning he’s being paid more this year than th front office thinks he’s worth.

Rather than pay him even more next year, maybe they’ll nontender him. Wilson and Budde offer the same skills as Mathis but at a fraction of the cost.

Warning: The message above may or may not contain sarcasm. Read and interpret at your own risk.

by snowhor on Jul 29, 2010 9:49 AM PDT via mobile up reply actions  

The Angels need to make a choice between Mathis and Wilson this offseason.

Conger will still be in AAA for next year, but we won’t be carrying 3 catchers.

We betrayed Vlad, the greatest Angel. Epic fail.

by Halowood on Jul 29, 2010 11:15 AM PDT up reply actions  

totally agree...

these last 2 months should be used to evaulate Wilson and really determine if he can provide what Mathis has been providing, which is not much. My vote is for Wilson to be our #2 next year behind Napoli or Conger, if he’s ready. It doesn’t look like he will be ready in Sosh’s eyes.

by land4sale on Jul 29, 2010 11:22 AM PDT up reply actions  

naps is #1

sosh needs to bust his balls about D until it improves and work with conger till he is ready to take the reigns and slide naps in to the DH spot

by angelsfaninsc on Jul 29, 2010 11:23 AM PDT up reply actions  

nugget

napoli throws out 26 percent of would be base stealers
mathis throws out 20 percent though in less chances
now i know mauer isnt known most for his defense but hes a producing hitting catcher like naps who also throws out 26 percent of runners
mathis .986 fielding % naps .987 % and naps gives us the versatility at first where hes become quite capable
i dont see how mathis still gets starts over naps

One time...

by mikvitu on Jul 29, 2010 9:13 PM PDT up reply actions  

It is all about need

What the fortunate thing for the Angels is right now is the competiveness of the other divisions and the injuries major contenders have suffered.

Izturis, Kendrick, and Frandsen all have value probably above what they would normally fetch because teams like the Red Sox, Tigers, Twins and others are in need of middle infielders. I think, for a team like the Tigers, Izturis would be a perfect fit. Whether or not they have anything we want in return is something I don’t know. But the Angels could have MIF to offer to any team who loses out on the Jose Bautista bidding.

As for the elder citizens and Juan Rivera, the Angels could make the change of scenery pitch. If the White Sox lose out on getting Dunn, Matsui seems like a viable option for a team in need of a power DH. The fact that Matsui went on a mini power surge recently ups his value. With his one year contract, he is the person I would most like to see traded for prospects.

Juan Rivera would be great for a team like the Padres – change of scenery, move to NL, favorable contract. Abreu stays with Angels. Team leader, chemistry and no team will want to take on his contract with the way he is playing.

by tizzidy19 on Jul 29, 2010 8:55 AM PDT reply actions   1 recs

How about the Braves for Rivera?

Haven’t they been looking for a RH corner outfielder all season? The Tigers also lost Ordonez for the season and they’re still in contention. I bet someone takes a shot on Rivera. We just can’t expect much in return.

by dmhead on Jul 29, 2010 8:59 AM PDT up reply actions  

at this point

 I say 1 “a” prospect or two “B” prospects and them taking his salary would be great! We need to get some money off the books if were going to make a real run at the Devil next year!

by angelsfaninsc on Jul 29, 2010 9:34 AM PDT up reply actions  

Any pitching prospect will do for me

Either someone who can help the pen, or a young guy who might be a decent back of the rotation for us – an O’Sullivan type.

"That boy is our last hope" - Obi Wan Scioscia, as Francisco Rodriguez left for the Mets. "No, there is another" - Yoda Reagins.

by RallyMonkey5 on Jul 29, 2010 11:20 AM PDT up reply actions  

Matsui

to the Yankees. Nick johnson has been out all year, and Matsui performed for them in the playoffs last year. I bet they’d love to have him for another title run.

by 2pintsofbooze on Jul 29, 2010 9:04 AM PDT up reply actions  

Two weeks too late.

So Reagins nukes the farm at the upper levels — over the past year he trades away nine players for three, two of them busts — and now we wants to make up for his lack of vision by replenishing the farm with lesser lights.

This guy simply can’t read the signs. Trading Fuentes, Matsui. Rivera, Abreu, et al is what we should have been doing weeks ago. If he can get something for these guys now, good luck to him, but he’s selling at lowest moment of desperation.

by Turks Teeth on Jul 29, 2010 9:00 AM PDT reply actions  

Two of them busts?

   OK Kazmir sucks but are you talking about Callaspo? He’s been with the team a week. Let’s try to get a bigger sample size please.

by Nashdiesel on Jul 29, 2010 9:46 AM PDT up reply actions  

Callaspo was a bust the minute we traded for him...

…from our pitching depth. We already had four utility infielders, now we have five.

Pitching depth is what we did not have, and now have even less of.

by Turks Teeth on Jul 29, 2010 10:41 AM PDT via mobile up reply actions   1 recs

He's better than Wood and Fransden

 and more durable than Izturis. He’s a legit starting 3b unlike the rest of those guys. We gave up a marginal 5th starter for him. It was a small investment.

Unless you plan on going forward with Wood or Fransden next year at 3b we had to do something.

by Nashdiesel on Jul 29, 2010 11:32 AM PDT up reply actions  

totally agreed here

"I have one word for you...Be careful."
-Jose Guillen

by IE Angel on Jul 29, 2010 4:41 PM PDT up reply actions  

callaspo also gives us the option to move other guys

we can move fransden wood izturis for some prospect and “nuking” the farm system for haren was good in my opinion hes a legit number 1 pitcher
kazmir yeah bad maybe it would be possible to trade him… maybe if we eat some of the contract

One time...

by mikvitu on Jul 29, 2010 9:18 PM PDT up reply actions  

First, only one bust thus far out of those three

WAY too early to tell on Callaspo, and Haren (unless he also somehow has a season-ending injury).

Also, how do you know Tony hasn’t been privately discussing selling before now? It’s possible he’s been talking both sides with other teams while he sees which way the Angels go—we’re not in the front office, so how do we know? Reagins and the Angels FO are NOTORIOUS for keeping things quiet—that it’s just now getting out could mean that this talk’s been going on for a while now.

Light up that halo! RIP, Nick.

by Clutch on Jul 29, 2010 9:52 AM PDT up reply actions  

and also ESPN, has an article on how long trades take.

Buster Olney says that most trades takes months.
Turks teeth would have you believe that the FO has just been sitting on their hands for months now.
A lot of scouts don’t value more than 2-3 of our minor leaguers as valuable, so what do we trade?

Fuentes = The New 'F' Word

by Sinatrasratpack on Jul 29, 2010 10:21 AM PDT up reply actions  

Clearly the FO has not been sitting on their hands.

Nor would I have you believe that. Nor have I said that. (Attributing false opinions to others is arguably a better example of “false” argumentation than my pessimism.)

The FO has been very busy. My point? Activity does not imply alacrity. Nor strategy. Nor wisdom.

by Turks Teeth on Jul 29, 2010 10:58 AM PDT via mobile up reply actions   1 recs

So far this season...

he’s made two solid trades primarily because they look long term. I’ll be even happier if he gets value for some of our dead weight (matsui, rivera, mathis, wood).

by Nashdiesel on Jul 29, 2010 11:33 AM PDT up reply actions  

actually by stating that

“This guy simply can’t read the signs. Trading Fuentes, Matsui. Rivera, Abreu, et al is what we should have been doing weeks ago.”

is saying that. I didn’t attribute anything to you that you didn’t already imply yourself. Not being able to ‘read the signs" and ’should have done this weeks ago’ imply just that

Fuentes = The New 'F' Word

by Sinatrasratpack on Jul 29, 2010 11:47 AM PDT up reply actions   1 recs

False argument unless you point out the wonderful numbers the players he traded away are putting up on their new teams...

Oh wait none of them have done squat.

Oh but I am sure you will spout on about their ‘potential’

Fuentes = The New 'F' Word

by Sinatrasratpack on Jul 29, 2010 10:18 AM PDT up reply actions   1 recs

What about the argument is "false"?

Choose your words better.

Tony traded from the area where we were weakest (pitching) to supplement the area where we were strongest (athletic light-hitting infielders). Callaspo doesn’t need two more seasons to prove he’s roughly a clone of Kendrick or Frandsen.

by Turks Teeth on Jul 29, 2010 10:46 AM PDT via mobile up reply actions  

It seems like you value the pitchers that we traded more than Dan Haren

I agree that Skaggs might be pretty damn good, but don’t you have to have pieces that the other team wants in order to make a trade.
I have no problem with the amount of players traded for these deals, but I will agree with you somewhat that maybe a pitcher or two should have been held back in the deal and replaced with someone else.

But… My argument still stands, who have we traded away (Including the Kazmir trade till now) has put up any sort of numbers in the MLB? You can’t say that we gave up too much when we don’t even know if the pieces we gave up are worth anything. These deals are best analyzed two years after the deal has been made.
If Torres and Rodriguez tear it up in Tampa, or if SOS turns into a #2-3 starter etc.. then I will agree with you. But until then this data is ‘incomplete’

Fuentes = The New 'F' Word

by Sinatrasratpack on Jul 29, 2010 11:53 AM PDT up reply actions  

Follow up. With SOS gone (and Pinata on the DL), who takes Kaz's spot in the Rotation?

Hell, who takes Pinata’s spot?

Angels baseball. We do what we must, because we can -- HaloDutch

by red floyd on Jul 29, 2010 1:01 PM PDT up reply actions  

Palmer and Bell I would assume

Because we don’t really have anyone else in AAA that could step up

Torii Hunter has some Brain Movage

by ryanfea on Jul 29, 2010 1:04 PM PDT up reply actions  

OCR says it's going to be Bell.

Bell will get rung … that dude sucks imho.

I love this team.

by Downing Rules on Jul 29, 2010 1:06 PM PDT up reply actions  

Yeah

He always looks like he’s clowning around throwing fastballs with no movement.

Torii Hunter has some Brain Movage

by ryanfea on Jul 29, 2010 1:20 PM PDT up reply actions  

Maybe so

to those enlightened few on Halos Heaven, but how was he going to sell that to the team and general fan base with 2.5 months to go in the season, a ton of head-to-head match ups with Texas, and only a 5 game deficit? And honestly, was he really going to get more for Fuentes, Rivera, Matusi, etc. 2 weeks ago than he might in the next 2 days? Not likely.

by dmhead on Jul 29, 2010 10:41 AM PDT up reply actions  

+1

"jut keep winning babt" - Moondoggy

by Rally Manatee on Jul 29, 2010 4:03 PM PDT up reply actions  

+10000

Light up that halo! RIP, Nick.

by Clutch on Jul 29, 2010 4:57 PM PDT up reply actions  

I disagree

Two weeks ago, we looked like we could still make a push for the playoffs. Now is exactly the right time to announce a fire sale. The only confusing thing to me is why Reagins thought Callaspo would be the guy to get us back into contention.

"jut keep winning babt" - Moondoggy

by Rally Manatee on Jul 29, 2010 4:03 PM PDT up reply actions  

Well, selling could both get prospects and free up payroll

But I fear that it will ONLY free up payroll—because otherwise these guys (Abreu and MAYBE Fuentes excepted) have pretty much no value beyond teams taking on their salaries.

Anywho, who are some of the deadline buyers, and which prospects could we target?

Light up that halo! RIP, Nick.

by Clutch on Jul 29, 2010 9:03 AM PDT reply actions  

Buyers

I’m just guessing that anyone in contention is a buyer besides maybe the Skanks and TX. BOS, Detroit, and Philly have all had major injury issues.

"jut keep winning babt" - Moondoggy

by Rally Manatee on Jul 29, 2010 4:08 PM PDT up reply actions  

What do we really stand to gain?

I have been hearing about how important our farm system is for years, but those farm players aren’t what really keep us at the top of our division. They are important, but you need key players to pull it all together.

I lost a lot of faith in the Farm System ratings and the “top prospects” when Wood, who was the second coming of everyone here last year, turned out to be worth less than the stitching on his jersey. Everyone was knocking how we needed a power bat, how Figgy wasn’t cutting it and how Wood would turn things around, and he did less than nothing. Now, I just don’t have faith anymore that the guys we put a ton of hope in are going to make the difference that we need.

Rockin' Out in Section 205...

by AP2TUDE on Jul 29, 2010 9:07 AM PDT reply actions   1 recs

Whether your assessment is right or wrong, I don't know, but I agree with it 100%

There is obviously a big difference between playing AAA and playing major league, and minor league numbers just don’t tell the whole story. In the end, I guess you just have to put your faith in the FO, that they ultimately know what they are doing. :(

by agent_99 on Jul 29, 2010 9:13 AM PDT up reply actions   1 recs

Wow your and idiot

what about Weaver, Saunders, Santana, Morales, Kendrick, Thompson, Kohn, the list goes on these were all prospects in the farm system who have proved or are proving that they are major leaguers… Think before you post.

by IWishWeStillHadTimSalmon on Jul 29, 2010 10:25 AM PDT up reply actions  

+1

it seems as if the stupid abounds today!

by angelsfaninsc on Jul 29, 2010 10:26 AM PDT up reply actions  

thats what happens

when the team isn’t a contender. expect much more of this up until spring training next season.

by 2pintsofbooze on Jul 29, 2010 10:28 AM PDT up reply actions  

oh hell no

i may have to take a sabbatical… people like aldo make my head hurt. I would rather discuss politics with my 7 year old.

by angelsfaninsc on Jul 29, 2010 10:29 AM PDT up reply actions  

How is saying that he doesn't have as much faith in the system anymore make him an idiot?

This is not a scientific study, but, I’m pretty sure that for every athlete that makes it in the majors there are many more that become wash-outs. Just by naming a few of the successful ones (and can you really include Kohn just yet?) doesn’t mean anything.

I know your reply was not to my comment, but because I agreed with the guy you are responding to, by extension, you’ve called me an idiot, which requires me to defend myself.

by agent_99 on Jul 29, 2010 1:23 PM PDT up reply actions  

Angels draft to many high schoolers. takes to long for them to bevelop

by FredP on Jul 30, 2010 5:51 PM PDT up reply actions  

They're called "prospects" for a reason.

Think of it in the ol’ timey 49’ers sense of the word. People flocked to Californ-I-A because of the “prospect” of finding gold and getting rich quick. What percentage of those prospectors do you think actually struck it rich?

"jut keep winning babt" - Moondoggy

by Rally Manatee on Jul 29, 2010 4:13 PM PDT up reply actions  

They escaped the hell that is New York, so the correct answer is...

EVERY ONE OF ’EM!!

I wish they all could be California girls!

"Wastin away again in Minor-Leaguer-Ville..."

by Stirrups on Jul 29, 2010 4:16 PM PDT up reply actions  

Boo-Yahh!

Stirrups with the punchline of the day!

YOU DON'T KNOW THE POWER OF THE DARKSIDE.....

by halofolife on Jul 29, 2010 4:30 PM PDT up reply actions  

It's about time

I’ve been one of the first to criticize the front office, and I’d be unfair if there was not balance when they are being smart.

The trade for Haren was a big win for the franchise. Even if Skaggs develops into a front-line starter in 3 or 4 years, the Halos “won” the trade big time and Reagins played the limited cards he had in a masterful manner.

I’ve been chirping for a couple of weeks now about the Halos needing to be sellers at the trade deadline, so I’m pleased that Reagins is there as well. To the list of players posted I’d add: Rivera, Mathis, Rodney, Kendrick, and R. Thompson. I’d also look to sell on Frandsen now given how well he’s played. I’d be a seller on Kazmir and Wood in the offseason since they have zero value right now.

I’d start playing guys like Evans, Wood and Bourjos now. Wood can’t hurt his value any more than it already is, and these other guys need a chance against MLB talent to prove if they have any real value.

If the team doesn’t win another game for the remainder of the season, it just means we get a higher draft choice next year in what is supposed to be a very deep draft.

by mustard_man on Jul 29, 2010 9:07 AM PDT reply actions   1 recs

agree, but

I think we need to keep R Thompson and Kendrick. Thompson is a cheap BP arm that does pretty good for us for the most part, he can come in handy next season, and anything we got for him wouldn’t be all too great sicne he’s not an overpowering force or a big name. plus his nickname is Choppa, which is pretty f’n cool.

who plays 2nd if we trade Kendrick? Izzy? can’t handle a full season. Frandsen? a complimentary player who I don’t trust giving 500 at-bats to. Callaspo? then we’re back in the same spot with 3rd base. I’d rather keep Howie, who we know at least has the potential to be a .300 hitter with decent defense.

Bourjes should be playing tomorrow instead of Juan, but we all know he won’t be.

by 2pintsofbooze on Jul 29, 2010 9:36 AM PDT up reply actions  

Another problem with the Callaspo trade

We can’t play Wood without benching Callaspo, Aybar, or Kendrick, so don’t expect to see Wood much. I think the Callaspo trade was the FO’s way of saying they’re done with Wood.

"jut keep winning babt" - Moondoggy

by Rally Manatee on Jul 29, 2010 4:36 PM PDT up reply actions  

trade all the bums

"You dont need long hair to rip off your sleeves and be a badass" - J. Allen

by DAD OF VLAD on Jul 29, 2010 9:17 AM PDT reply actions  

Time to sell

Abreu, Rivera, Matsui, Rodney, Kazmir, and Fuentes.

Although if Fuentes were to stay on as a lefty specialist, I’d be fine with that, but his contract is up anyway.

by Gokyle45 on Jul 29, 2010 9:21 AM PDT reply actions  

Make Kazmir into a reliever

Yeah, he could be the highest paid lefty specialist next year, but he’s next to worthless as a starter and he is untradeable because of his salary. Might as well, make him work.

by righteous halo on Jul 29, 2010 10:34 AM PDT up reply actions  

i like that idea

as long as he doesnt implode like rodney does

by angelsfaninsc on Jul 29, 2010 10:36 AM PDT up reply actions  

I'm on board...

…but his pitch count is atrociously high to be anything other than mopup duty. I just. . . was SO hoping he could find “it” again. He’s like Wild Thing Rick Vaughn in Major League 2. Scared of the fastball, and trying other things that are away from what worked for him. Throw the slider, don’t think too much, and let ’er rip.

Self-realization. I was thinking of the immortal words of Socrates, who said, "I drank what?"

The Geek.

by The OC Sports Geek on Jul 29, 2010 10:39 AM PDT up reply actions  

He Can't

I’ve suspected all along that Kaz is hurt. The fact that he hasn’t been throwing during his DL stint suggests that there really is something wrong physically. This actually gives me hope, because if he heals, he should be able to pitch better.

by jjackflash on Jul 29, 2010 10:47 AM PDT up reply actions  

Bingo!

RIP Nick Adenhart 4/9/09

I blog about the Angels at The Diamond Aces

by Jay Cal on Jul 29, 2010 2:43 PM PDT up reply actions  

Scott Kazmir

2011 Comeback Player of the Year. Take your bets!

The Devil went down to Georgia, and all I got was this gold fiddle. Go Angels! helpfindscottajob@gmail.com

by Slasher52 on Jul 29, 2010 3:30 PM PDT up reply actions  

we can dream

that he has a productive offseason with a new fitness regime and suddenly reclaims 3-4 mph on the FB and movement and location for the slider that gives us the Kazmir we all remember…

www.appealtoemulsion.com

by feNOMINAL on Jul 30, 2010 4:54 PM PDT up reply actions  

Juan Rivera

We need to make room for Crawford or maybe some other impact FA LF we could sign in the off-season . All what he has done is kill rallies, watch 75% of the balls hit to LF drop in front of him or fly over his head (Tuesday night), and run the bases horribly. He is young enough with some alleged power a reasonable contract through next year. We should be able to get some young talent in return. F it! run Reggie out there the rest of the season. At least he can field.

by Giambi'sGoldenThong on Jul 29, 2010 9:26 AM PDT reply actions  

Don’t we have to move
Juan to RF if we sign Crawford? Boujos and Reggie are the only other OFs actually ready for MLB

by phoenix15 on Jul 29, 2010 9:30 AM PDT up reply actions  

Why stop at Crawford

Sign Jason Werth to play RF… a boy can dream, can’t he?

http://truegrich.blogspot.com
http://twitter.com/truegrich

by True Grich on Jul 29, 2010 9:32 AM PDT up reply actions  

Jayson Werth is slightly better than Juan Rivera and will be 3X the price

No thanks.

"You gotta have nuts." / "Coming Around 3rd, especially if I'm ticked off, that's going to happen." - Torii Hunter

by Commander_Nate on Jul 29, 2010 9:37 AM PDT up reply actions   1 recs

slightly better?

That’s a joke … right?

Werth has been worth 12 WAR over the past 2.5 years. Rivera has been worth 2.7 WAR over that same time period. Werth has been about 5x’s as productive as Rivera since 2008.

by bjsguess on Jul 29, 2010 10:38 AM PDT up reply actions  

btw, hey, what up from MLBTR boards.

“Dude….its’ US again…”

Self-realization. I was thinking of the immortal words of Socrates, who said, "I drank what?"

The Geek.

by The OC Sports Geek on Jul 29, 2010 10:39 AM PDT up reply actions  

No, I'm dead serious

We had the same conversation this winter about Juan and Bay. Werth fits into the same category.

Across 162 games, Bay is slightly the best of the three in most offensive categories. Rivera and Werth are virtually identical in terms of power and RBI production. Rivera is slightly the best in BA and I believe has the strongest arm of the trio. Juan was totally worth is 4 mil or whatever he made last year and is only being paid 5 mil or so this year to underperform.

Bay is being paid 16 or 18 mil or whatever it is to do virtually nothing for the Mets the last time I checked. The Mets get to enjoy that well into this new decade too. Werth is going to draw the same comps and make the same demands this winter. I’ll agree that he and Bay are slightly superior to Juan in offensive terms, but they are not 9-10 mil per season better. Smart GM’s should stay the hell away.

"You gotta have nuts." / "Coming Around 3rd, especially if I'm ticked off, that's going to happen." - Torii Hunter

by Commander_Nate on Jul 29, 2010 11:26 AM PDT up reply actions  

good post

and lets not forget how St Louis completey f’d up the free agent OF market by signing Holiday to a $120 million contract. so even if you tried to lowball Werth, he will be looking for Bay money at least, which he is not werth (see what I did there? too easy? then go eff yourself!!).

by 2pintsofbooze on Jul 29, 2010 11:33 AM PDT up reply actions  

Bay and Werth are a lot better than Rivera

Rivera usually hits for high average and has a good amount of power, but he never, ever walks. With equal average and slugging, there’s a huge difference between guys who get on base 33% of the time and guys who get on base 37% of the time.

That said, Werth is probably going to be overvalued because Philadelphia has inflated his home run totals. But if you’re going to overpay for an outfielder, I’d rather it be for a guy who can actually get on base. Wake me up when Carl Crawford discovers how to steal first base.

by Suboptimal on Jul 29, 2010 11:53 AM PDT up reply actions  

My overall point is that Bay and Werth are not worth the money

Rivera’s contract is very club friendly. We sign Werth to the contract he’s likely to want and we’ll be regretting it in 2-3 years when he’s doing what Rivera did at a lower BA for $15 mil a season and guys like Kendry, Weaver and Ervin are on their way out the door for teams with more cash available.

"You gotta have nuts." / "Coming Around 3rd, especially if I'm ticked off, that's going to happen." - Torii Hunter

by Commander_Nate on Jul 29, 2010 11:57 AM PDT up reply actions  

This is why you stay the hell away from Carl Crawford

I’m fine with the Rivera contract. They paid him about what he’s worth. But if you take 20 points away from Crawford’s batting average, as is likely to happen as he ages, then he’s not much more useful at getting on base than Juan Rivera, but without the power. Sure he’s fast, but speed is the most overrated skill there is, and even that will decline in the future.

by Suboptimal on Jul 29, 2010 12:35 PM PDT up reply actions  

No argument there

We need to spend our cash on pitching this offseason. We’ve already done that by picking up Haren and should do more.

"You gotta have nuts." / "Coming Around 3rd, especially if I'm ticked off, that's going to happen." - Torii Hunter

by Commander_Nate on Jul 29, 2010 1:36 PM PDT up reply actions  

Juan be gone Rivera

I would love nothing more than to see the Angels move that tub of goo. http://truegrich.blogspot.com This team needs to get younger in the OF and more athletic in the corner outfield positions.

http://truegrich.blogspot.com
http://twitter.com/truegrich

by True Grich on Jul 29, 2010 9:31 AM PDT up reply actions  

what
you think we’ve been complaining about the past week? Abreu’s a lock for part time DH with Naps, and I pray that Crawford accepts a deal with the Halos.

by phoenix15 on Jul 29, 2010 9:35 AM PDT up reply actions  

Yup

We definitely need young athleticism on the corners. If you can’t run, leap, climb, or dive for balls out there then you’re not doing your job. You gotta give credit to Torii tho, the dude still dives and jumps out there (even tho it’s always followed by a “sh*t my rib cage” look).

by maze88 on Jul 29, 2010 9:43 AM PDT via mobile up reply actions  

Last night

I seriously had a dream that Rivera was part of a 3 team trade. When I woke up and realized I was dreaming I got really disappointed. I think he would loose a footrace to Bengie Molina

by Giambi'sGoldenThong on Jul 29, 2010 10:02 AM PDT up reply actions  

Come on, a dead turtle wouldn't even loose a footrace to Benjie Molina.

Warning: The message above may or may not contain sarcasm. Read and interpret at your own risk.

by snowhor on Jul 29, 2010 10:13 AM PDT via mobile up reply actions   1 recs

That reminds me of Rex Hudler

He’d say, “If he raced a pregnant lady, he’d come in third.”

"jut keep winning babt" - Moondoggy

by Rally Manatee on Jul 29, 2010 4:47 PM PDT up reply actions  

not necessarily

we did win the WS with GA in LF. but perhaps thats just the exception to the rule. we’ll call it the GA Corrolary.

by 2pintsofbooze on Jul 29, 2010 10:09 AM PDT up reply actions  

GA

was much better in left than Rivera. He wasn’t a liability in the field until 2 years after the Series.

by dmhead on Jul 29, 2010 10:30 AM PDT up reply actions  

true

I guess I was thinking of the running, leaping, climbing and diving that was brought up.

by 2pintsofbooze on Jul 29, 2010 10:34 AM PDT up reply actions  

What are we going to sell - oranges on the side of the road?

We have basically nothing to give up that anyone would want and the few things other teams would want, we need to keep. If some of our underperforming guys were having at least average seasons, then we might be able to get something, but that’s not happening.

Just wait for the winter when Fuentes, Matsui, Shields and Speier all come off the books.

I poured one out for the season yesterday after I heard about Joel…I suggest everyone here do the same and enjoy Fall Training 2010.

"You gotta have nuts." / "Coming Around 3rd, especially if I'm ticked off, that's going to happen." - Torii Hunter

by Commander_Nate on Jul 29, 2010 9:36 AM PDT reply actions  

Fuentes has value since all contendors can use more bullpen arms (except SD), he’s probably the easiest guy to trade. but you’re right, most of the guys we want to trade is because they suck. trading away Kazmir and Rivera ain’t gonna happen, unless we take on 90% of their salary like we did with GMJ. same with Rodney. I could see Abreu having value for a team like the Tigers, Rays or Padres, but I don’t think the Halos would give him up, they’ll see him as an integral part of our ’11 title run.

trading Fuentes should be priority #1 IMO. he’s the main guy that comes to mind who could get us some decent pieces in return, and also he’s a guy we can live without.

by 2pintsofbooze on Jul 29, 2010 9:43 AM PDT up reply actions  

Agreed.

Fuentes has blown a few saves, but he’s saved a lot more. Who couldn’t use more bullpen help. Especially a lefty. His value is probably higher than anyone else, because of the premium bullpen relief he can provide.

RIP Nick Adenhart 4/9/09

I blog about the Angels at The Diamond Aces

by Jay Cal on Jul 29, 2010 2:47 PM PDT up reply actions  

Other teams most likely wouldn't even use him as a closer.

Other teams may be interested in using him differently. His stats show he’d be one heck of a lefty specialist. Som I’d say he has some value.

"jut keep winning babt" - Moondoggy

by Rally Manatee on Jul 29, 2010 4:49 PM PDT up reply actions  

Or we have....

Matsui – Mini power surge lately and could help a contending team in the AL (White Sox, Yanks have homer happy parks)

Rivera – Favorable contract and historically average having a down year, and signed through next year.

Fuentes – Has been very consistent lately and is only signed through this year since his option wont vest.

We aren’t going to bring home the moon with our guys but we could get some “b” level prospects.

NOT MY QUINNY!!!!

by halofan4life on Jul 29, 2010 9:43 AM PDT up reply actions  

then those

B level prospects can perform decently in the minors getting our hopes up only to be called up to give us nothing.

dang, I have a bitter outlook, don’t I? I blame you B Wood.

but yeah, Matsui to the Yanks sounds like a perfect fit.

by 2pintsofbooze on Jul 29, 2010 9:45 AM PDT up reply actions  

I’m all up for it
as long as the Japanese media sponsors don’t take away half their money from the Halos just because Godzilla left.

by phoenix15 on Jul 29, 2010 9:47 AM PDT up reply actions  

I'm tired

of worrying about Arte’s bank account. he seems to be doing alright. screw the Japanese media $$$

by 2pintsofbooze on Jul 29, 2010 9:53 AM PDT up reply actions   1 recs

Somehow I feel...

…like B level prospects are something we aren’t hurting for in the slightest.

"You gotta have nuts." / "Coming Around 3rd, especially if I'm ticked off, that's going to happen." - Torii Hunter

by Commander_Nate on Jul 29, 2010 9:47 AM PDT up reply actions  

As Turk pointed out earlier

We just traded 9 of them in the last year. We could stand to do some restocking.

by dmhead on Jul 29, 2010 10:32 AM PDT up reply actions  

Define "B level prospect"

Because when I hear that term I think of guys named McAnulty, Aldridge, Bell, etc and there’s no way anyone should logically think we need more of that.

"You gotta have nuts." / "Coming Around 3rd, especially if I'm ticked off, that's going to happen." - Torii Hunter

by Commander_Nate on Jul 29, 2010 11:02 AM PDT up reply actions  

Thank you Nate.

Could not agree more. If a “B” level prospect equals Bell or McAnulty, I say screw that noise. Players like that are half the reason we’ve struggled so much this season.

YOU DON'T KNOW THE POWER OF THE DARKSIDE.....

by halofolife on Jul 29, 2010 4:40 PM PDT up reply actions  

are there any other prospect grades?

or is B the lowest one? after watching him play way more than he should have, I’d have to say Macanulty is a grade F prospect, if there were such a thing.

I long for the days when we here on HH will be laughing about those few weeks in 2010 when Macanulty was our starting first baseman. not quite there yet.

by 2pintsofbooze on Jul 29, 2010 5:12 PM PDT up reply actions  

"B Level"

is essentially what we have traded away: Sean Rodriguez, Will Smith, SOS, Tyler Skaggs, Alex Torres and Pat Corbin all fit in that category. Fernando Rodriguez and Matt Sweeney probably classify as “C” level prospect. Our only “A” prospect right now is Trout. A’s you expect to become all stars. B’s you’re looking for solid regulars. C’s are usually long shots.

McAnulty and Aldridge are NOT prospects.

by dmhead on Jul 30, 2010 7:49 AM PDT up reply actions  

someone needs to post

what our books look like by player after the season, so we can all start playing Ninja on the CPU

by angelsfaninsc on Jul 29, 2010 9:46 AM PDT up reply actions  

sooo....

when is our golden boy Mike Trout going to be ready? I really hope he can be a situation like Kendry, where, for once, we dont get screwed with false projections. More Kendry, less Woody… Bring on the Fish MAN!

by angelsfaninsc on Jul 29, 2010 9:38 AM PDT reply actions  

then maybe
we shouldn’t expect prospects to hit .300 30 HRs with 90 RBIs in their rookie year. I expected a .250 avg. with 10 HRs and 40 RBIs. Guess I was wrong too.

by phoenix15 on Jul 29, 2010 9:40 AM PDT up reply actions  

a middle ground is fine

we got way lucky with KMO. Just praying that our luck changes that way… “Quinlan has the potential… blah” “Wood could win batting title… blah” “Our minor leauge releivers will round out nicely”… so far its been pretty bleak to listen to FO projections.

by angelsfaninsc on Jul 29, 2010 9:44 AM PDT up reply actions  

FA Q's

is there any realistic hope that we could pull off picking up Lee and Crawford in offseason? Give lee 18M/yr x 7 yrs with full no trade clause (so he feels he wont have to stay a whore for the league). Crawfords value?

by angelsfaninsc on Jul 29, 2010 9:42 AM PDT reply actions  

I don't think we'll be able to sign either of them

Yanks will outbid everyone for Lee, that is a given. I just have the feeling that Crawford will sign elsewhere.

Torii Hunter has some Brain Movage

by ryanfea on Jul 29, 2010 9:44 AM PDT up reply actions  

Dept. of CouldaWouldaShoulda...

…IIRC, Jose Valverde was available at the same time as Rodney and was asking for similar $ and terms. I also seem to recall we signed Rodney before the Tigers signed Valverde. Too bad.

Valverde’s ERA is 1.8, he’s converted 21 of 22 save opportunities, and he has an approximate ratio of 2.5:1 for strikeouts to walks. His WHIP this season is .918.

Too bad we didn’t take a closer look at Valverde.

by sothball on Jul 29, 2010 9:47 AM PDT reply actions  

But we have Fuentes

Now batting, our rookie of the year, Miiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiike TROUT!

by angelskid2210 on Jul 29, 2010 9:48 AM PDT up reply actions  

Having that good of a closer
only hurts Fuentes’s feelings so Sosh wanted the badder closer

by phoenix15 on Jul 29, 2010 9:48 AM PDT up reply actions  

Rodney would be

25-25 in save opps, and have an era of 1.25 if he were the closer. he sucks in any other role besides closing. its been proven.

if we trade Fuentes and make Rodney the closer, I bet he dominats for the rest for the season.

by 2pintsofbooze on Jul 29, 2010 9:51 AM PDT up reply actions  

I was exaggerating to make my point

but his era in save sitauations compared to non-save situations was like night and day.

by 2pintsofbooze on Jul 29, 2010 10:10 AM PDT up reply actions  

That means nothing

He got lucky last year, and a weeks’ worth of save chances earlier this year don’t prove a thing. Mike essentially has used Rodney the same way he uses his closer: one inning, save situation. If Rodney couldn’t acclimate to that, what good would he have done in the ninth? Keep dreaming.

by dmhead on Jul 29, 2010 10:43 AM PDT up reply actions  

I guess going off a season of his stats

doesn’t mean anything. you’re right, he got lucky. oh wait, we’re Angels fans, we’re not aloud to believe in luck, remember?

I’m going off of the stats I’ve looked at along with what all the Detroit fans were saying after we signed him. but your argument of him being “lucky” seems like a better way to go.

by 2pintsofbooze on Jul 29, 2010 10:48 AM PDT up reply actions   1 recs

I AM going off his stats

Save percentage just doesn’t mean anything to me. He is not a good pitcher. His stuff is good enough that his overall numbers aren’t horrible (other than his walk rates) but he is not someone we want to rely on in key situations. I bet most Detroit fans would tell you the same.

by dmhead on Jul 29, 2010 10:54 AM PDT up reply actions  

ok

I just know that going in to this season the word on him was that he was good when in save situations and not good when in other situations. the times he had to save games for us he’s been good, the times he hasn’t, he’s been bad. seems like more of the same, but I could be wrong.

by 2pintsofbooze on Jul 29, 2010 11:01 AM PDT up reply actions  

To me, that just means he's a headcase

And typically headcases can’t be relied on, regardless of the situation.

by WiHaloFan on Jul 29, 2010 11:48 AM PDT up reply actions  

No

His performance when the game is on the line is exactly the same as when it isn’t. Last year he was just fortunate in where the runs were distributed. He would give up two runs when he was pitching with a three run lead, but none in one-run games. That’s not skill, that’s dumb luck.

by Suboptimal on Jul 29, 2010 11:56 AM PDT up reply actions  

ok

but I still remember his era being waaay lower in save situations then when in non-save situations. perhaps it was due to luck. I could see him loading the bases and then getting the save, a la K-Rod in his last couple season with the Halos.

by 2pintsofbooze on Jul 29, 2010 12:01 PM PDT up reply actions  

I could be wrong

but wasn’t Valverde a “type A” and offered arbitration? Rodney was signed because it would only cost money, not draft picks. It was still a bad signing, but I think that was the justification. Why didn’t we re-up Oliver again?

by dmhead on Jul 29, 2010 10:35 AM PDT up reply actions  

No on Lee. Long term deals for FA pitchers rarely pay off & can hamstring our flexibility

Yanks & Sox will both be all in for Crawford, but TR has proven he will pull out the $ for a guy with Crawford’s skill set. Torii was unexpected, but was seen as a 5 tool guy and a good match for the Halos.

by BigSnyan on Jul 29, 2010 9:48 AM PDT reply actions  

I don’t see
the Yanks going after Crawford with their OF. Gardner’s basically the same thing proving himself this year. The BoSox OF is pretty solid without their injuries as well.

by phoenix15 on Jul 29, 2010 9:49 AM PDT up reply actions  

Yeah I see us as the top team to sign him.

The Yanks will bid along with the Sux just because that’s what they do. But I think he either stays in Tampa or comes to the Halos

Now batting, our rookie of the year, Miiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiike TROUT!

by angelskid2210 on Jul 29, 2010 9:53 AM PDT up reply actions  

Detroit

Or Detroit. They have about $60m coming off the books, an owner willing to spend serious jack, a need in the lineup for a leadoff hitter, and a spacious outfield to maximize his defense.

If I was Detroit I would be all in on Crawford. He is a perfect player for that team.

by bjsguess on Jul 29, 2010 10:44 AM PDT up reply actions  

be quiet

maybe they don’t know that

by 2pintsofbooze on Jul 29, 2010 10:46 AM PDT up reply actions   1 recs

while you may be right...

I find it hard for the Yanks to pass on Crawford when their current OF is Granderson, Gardner, Swisher, Thames, and scraps. They have to view Crawford as a decent upgrade over ALL of those options.

And the Sox have plenty of OF (and even more $ tied up in their OF), but Bill Hall, Hermida, Ellsbury, Cameron, Drew & their young guys are not huge game changers.

Both teams will seriously bid, I believe.

by BigSnyan on Jul 29, 2010 9:58 AM PDT up reply actions  

He's not enough of an upgrade to justify 5 years and 15 per.

Seeing as though it’s pretty much a lock they’re going after Lee and are going to have to horribly overpay Jeter, I doubt their interest in Carl is anything more than token to drive his price up.

Strikeouts are boring- Besides that, they're fascist. Throw some ground balls - it's more democratic.

by CasanovaWong on Jul 29, 2010 11:02 AM PDT up reply actions  

Did you forget the offseason

in which the Yankees signed Teixeira, Sabathia, and Burnett, i.e. the three most expensive free agents?

by Brody on Jul 29, 2010 2:43 PM PDT up reply actions  

Or

to flip Granderson and move Gardner to center?

by dmhead on Jul 30, 2010 4:44 PM PDT up reply actions  

Are you saying what I think you're saying?

Granderson may be available?

"jut keep winning babt" - Moondoggy

by Rally Manatee on Jul 30, 2010 6:15 PM PDT up reply actions  

I will say

that I feel much better about our GM now knowing that the Lee trade proosal was prior to the Callaspo trade. it makes much more sense now. the thought of Tony trying to make that trade yesterday really made me worry for the team.

don’t get me wrong, I in no way wanted Lee on the team, but knowing the timing of it now makes it a little easier to swallow.

by 2pintsofbooze on Jul 29, 2010 9:55 AM PDT reply actions  

Torii is the least of our problems, he is actually one of the few good pieces on our team. Good luck getting a better offensive and defensive cf. You’re not using your brain.

In Kobe we trust!

by robi s on Jul 29, 2010 10:07 AM PDT up reply actions  

well said

aldo seems to have an anal-cranial inversion

by angelsfaninsc on Jul 29, 2010 10:08 AM PDT up reply actions   1 recs

Peter Bourjous will take his place Torri has been playing shitty D

Seriously hes old now . I cant play because im sore but i can run and cash that 18 million .

by aldo H on Jul 29, 2010 10:10 AM PDT up reply actions  

are u retarded?

that hit he took off the wall caused a concussion. he has been a spark for the team. a representative for the community, and the best thing to happen to the halos all around since Vlad. please stop talking… your just making your stupidity cemented into the brains of those around you.

by angelsfaninsc on Jul 29, 2010 10:12 AM PDT up reply actions   1 recs

higher than juan rivera's or matsui's

i fucking gaurantee it. you would rather keep rivera and put bourjos in CF? please refer to the above statement. READ CAREFULLY… let it sink in … accept that you know nothing of what you speak.

by angelsfaninsc on Jul 29, 2010 10:17 AM PDT up reply actions  

who said i would keep rivera?

i never even talked about rivera now your putting words in my mouth. who says we cant find someone to replace Rivera

by aldo H on Jul 29, 2010 10:25 AM PDT up reply actions  

sorry dude

but this is a losing argument. Torii leads the team in just about every offensive stat there is, Napoli’s solo homeruns notwithstanding.

he is the face of our franchise and leader in the clubhouse. we need him, even if his defense isn’t GG anymore. its still above average.

by 2pintsofbooze on Jul 29, 2010 10:19 AM PDT up reply actions   1 recs

de nada

I hate it when people are stupid

by 2pintsofbooze on Jul 29, 2010 10:24 AM PDT up reply actions  

me too

its like trying explain math to a monkey… they just stare and act like they understand

by angelsfaninsc on Jul 29, 2010 10:25 AM PDT up reply actions  

or they argue

2+2 = 5 is the quivalant of get rid of Torii, he sucks.

ummmm, ok.

by 2pintsofbooze on Jul 29, 2010 10:29 AM PDT up reply actions  

+1

Torii’s only “problem” isn’t his fault- He shouldn’t be the best hitter on a contending team, but he has been our best all year.

by BigSnyan on Jul 29, 2010 10:23 AM PDT up reply actions  

he was last year too

until he got hurt and Kendry emerged. if he hadn’t gotten hurt and kept up his pace last season, he would’ve been MVP.

by 2pintsofbooze on Jul 29, 2010 10:26 AM PDT up reply actions  

so true

he was one of the 2 leading candidates for MVP last year before he got hurt doing the very kind of thing that probably gave him a big edge: going balls out for another amazing home run-robbing snag at the fence

by Raaddad on Jul 29, 2010 9:58 PM PDT up reply actions  

Like I said above

Torii seems to be the only OF who can still run, leap, or dive for a ball.

by maze88 on Jul 29, 2010 10:27 AM PDT up reply actions  

It really is hard for him to play CF...

and chase down every ball in the gap while Rivera, Abreu, and GA’s spirit watch it roll to the wall

by BigSnyan on Jul 29, 2010 10:37 AM PDT up reply actions  

At least

he’s the only one trying

by maze88 on Jul 29, 2010 10:40 AM PDT up reply actions  

him and weaver

look like they are carrying the load. with naps trying his best to help with the bat

by angelsfaninsc on Jul 29, 2010 10:47 AM PDT up reply actions  

Totally

I feel so bad at times bcuz Weaver does a hell of a job and then our offense does him in the rear without lube.

by maze88 on Jul 29, 2010 10:56 AM PDT up reply actions  

true

but at least our offense pulls his hair

by 2pintsofbooze on Jul 29, 2010 10:57 AM PDT up reply actions  

dinner

someone should at least buy him dinner before raping him like that… guess with the bats fucking him and pulling his hair… dinner is on the bullpen!

by angelsfaninsc on Jul 29, 2010 10:58 AM PDT up reply actions  

Rec'd LOL

dine-n-dash.

By the looks of Rodney’s thuggish hat gear, he’d be the first to do that.

by maze88 on Jul 29, 2010 11:12 AM PDT up reply actions  

not to mention the less-than-stellar defense his last 2 starts...

I hope we extend Weaver before he reaches free agency. Him hiring Boras doesn’t make that likely.

by BigSnyan on Jul 29, 2010 11:00 AM PDT up reply actions  

nope

the big dick of boras will once again rape the ass of an angel franchise… just prepare yourself for it.

by angelsfaninsc on Jul 29, 2010 11:01 AM PDT up reply actions  

speaking of Boras

can we petition Arte to not give Boras the homeplate suite? having to see him behind home plate for good games and playoff games makes my stomach queezy. I feel like Satan is sitting right there figuring out how much money he can make off each Angel player/pitcher as they come to home plate.

and when Weaver pitches a gem I can see his mind working the numbers of how he is planning on screwing the FO when he hits free agency.

by 2pintsofbooze on Jul 29, 2010 11:05 AM PDT up reply actions   1 recs

Hahaha

“GA’s spirit”. This one made me lol at work.

"You keep shooting. You hope it goes in, and you smile." -Teemu Selanne

by haloduck on Jul 29, 2010 11:05 AM PDT up reply actions  

at $18 mill/yr he's always been expensive...

1. No other team will take him unless we pay him
2. He has been our #1 or #2 hitter the entire time he’s been here (which includes 2 AL West titles). Even if he’s not “worth” $18 million/yr this minute, there is no reason to trade him.

by BigSnyan on Jul 29, 2010 1:18 PM PDT up reply actions  

Yard sale...

Agreed, we gotta find a way to ship out Kaz, Shields, Rodney, Fuentes, Matsui, Abreu, and Mathis.

I love mice tits, but if we get something good for him, i guess he can go too.

In Kobe we trust!

by robi s on Jul 29, 2010 10:08 AM PDT reply actions   1 recs

nobody wants most of the guys you listed

if a team actually made a trade with us for Shields I would probably s%#@ my pants

Fuentes has the most value of the guys you listed, which should tell you something right there.

by 2pintsofbooze on Jul 29, 2010 10:13 AM PDT reply actions  

lol I am aware nobody wants the people I listed… if u notice I listed the worst players on our team haha

by robi s on Jul 29, 2010 2:18 PM PDT up reply actions  

i would just be happy

to get one prospect for each of the losers, and lose the massive payroll they are sucking away from Arty. Seems like this season a lot of the tream learned from GMJ

by angelsfaninsc on Jul 29, 2010 10:15 AM PDT up reply actions  

yeah, that would be great

but what kind of prospect is Shields or Mathis going to bring us? more of the same, or probably worse. guys who will never sniff the MLB, let alone AAA.

by 2pintsofbooze on Jul 29, 2010 10:17 AM PDT up reply actions  

We are not trading Shields

Nor should we. Everyone should stand and applaud when he makes his last appearance this season, because that will be the end of an era and a deserving tribute to one of our all-time greats.

by Brody on Jul 29, 2010 10:22 AM PDT up reply actions  

Good one red. Rec'd.

YOU DON'T KNOW THE POWER OF THE DARKSIDE.....

by halofolife on Jul 29, 2010 4:48 PM PDT up reply actions  

nice

I hope he gets one more shot. Only problem is, if we wait until the last home game or two of the season, there won’t be anyone there to applaud him.

by yeswecan on Jul 29, 2010 5:21 PM PDT up reply actions  

Crazy.

No more 02ers.

"jut keep winning babt" - Moondoggy

by Rally Manatee on Jul 30, 2010 4:31 PM PDT up reply actions  

bite ur toungue

he’s the only hope ive got left, man!

by angelsfaninsc on Jul 29, 2010 10:34 AM PDT up reply actions  

good point!

they said a couple games ago that the Halos are 1-44 when behind after the 8th inning. guess its 1-46 now because I think that was prior to the last 2 losses.

maybe the monkey is hiding an injury. he doesn’t “jump around” quite as good as he used to

by 2pintsofbooze on Jul 29, 2010 10:36 AM PDT up reply actions  

including the 8th inning

"Ballplayers play baseball." -Jose Mota

by Fred Fredrix on Jul 29, 2010 11:09 AM PDT up reply actions  

Time for a new era!

RALLY MANATEE!

"jut keep winning babt" - Moondoggy

by Rally Manatee on Jul 30, 2010 4:32 PM PDT up reply actions  

Wow. Lots of Drama here today. Is it buy one get one free for stupid?

I saw blow it up and save as much money as you can but keep the following (and I know this has been said, but here’s MY two cents, not that anyone cares)

Seriously kick the tires on ANYONE and EVERYONE not named: Napoli, Kendrick, Morales, Weaver, Aybar, Haren, Santana, Pieneiro, and Jepsen.

Fuentes MUST be worth SOMETHING to a contender – - even as a LOOGY -

Wood, MAthis, Izturis, ANY member of the ‘pen not mentioned above…honestly, I’m SORT of on the fence w/ Kendrick only because of potential trade value.

Personally, I really want Ty Wigginton this winter. Then we could ship all 143 3B we have at the “major league ready level” – -

But Wigginton, Crawford, and hell, let’s dream, Werth, this off season. Get ’er done.

Indulge this:

Aybar SS
Kendrick 2B
Crawford LF
Morales 1B
Hunter CF
Wigginton 3B
Napoli C/DH
Werth DH/RF
Bourjos RF

I know I’m high. But I like it like that.

Self-realization. I was thinking of the immortal words of Socrates, who said, "I drank what?"

The Geek.

by The OC Sports Geek on Jul 29, 2010 10:36 AM PDT reply actions  

oh yeah, keep Torii too, I knew I forgot someone.

Self-realization. I was thinking of the immortal words of Socrates, who said, "I drank what?"

The Geek.

by The OC Sports Geek on Jul 29, 2010 10:37 AM PDT up reply actions  

wait a minute

if you listen to Aldo you shouldnt need him… LOLOLOL

by angelsfaninsc on Jul 29, 2010 10:38 AM PDT up reply actions  

+1000

Bwoody looks at the guy and has pity

by angelsfaninsc on Jul 29, 2010 10:41 AM PDT up reply actions  

bases loaded, 2 outs and

“now batting for HH, Aldo Wood.”

all posters quickly head to ESPN.com

by 2pintsofbooze on Jul 29, 2010 10:43 AM PDT up reply actions  

hahahaha

winner of the “crack of the day” award goes to… drumroll…. BOOZE!!!!!
and the crowd goes wild

by angelsfaninsc on Jul 29, 2010 10:46 AM PDT up reply actions  

Werth sucks, no thanks. he isn’t worth Torii money, and thats what he’ll want.

and Crawford would be #1 or 2 in our linup, without question.

and napoli can go. we’ve got Conger in the minors just about ready. offensive catchers are pretty rare, so they could prob get some decent prospects for him.

by 2pintsofbooze on Jul 29, 2010 10:41 AM PDT up reply actions  

This
Werth sucks, no thanks. he isn’t worth Torii money, and thats what he’ll want.

"You gotta have nuts." / "Coming Around 3rd, especially if I'm ticked off, that's going to happen." - Torii Hunter

by Commander_Nate on Jul 29, 2010 11:05 AM PDT up reply actions  

Napoli would be a great DH for us. If anyone can go, its Mathis, who would be replaced by Budde, Wilson, and Conger whenever the team thinks he is ready

by robi s on Jul 29, 2010 2:20 PM PDT up reply actions  

Mathis shouldn't be traded...

he has NO trade value. He will likely be a non-tender FA next year. Budde, Wilson, and Conger can all be fine backup catchers.

by BigSnyan on Jul 29, 2010 2:21 PM PDT up reply actions  

What? Who's the stupid one?

Why would you NOT put Napoli on that list? We have a logjam at catcher, our all-star first baseman is coming back next year. Napoli is all or nothing hitter who, as someone pointed out about 2 months ago on here, has the second WORST success rate with RISP than another other player. Just this year alone, the dude is batting .158 with runners in scoring position. In his career, try .217

Oh and I can also showcase for you that over the past three years his K/BB ratio has gotten increasingly worse. OH AND he sucks defensively as a catcher….

Don’t come on here calling people stupid when you statements can be defined as the same….

dissenter, dubious and devil's advocate to blog monitors everywhere.

by BryanHarvey'sMoustache on Jul 29, 2010 10:58 AM PDT up reply actions  

Booze may have errored

on Naps… but come on… we cant led the shit Aldo tried to pass really slide.

by angelsfaninsc on Jul 29, 2010 11:00 AM PDT up reply actions  

hahaha....

Man, Aldo is still too green….I just roll right past those comments.

dissenter, dubious and devil's advocate to blog monitors everywhere.

by BryanHarvey'sMoustache on Jul 29, 2010 11:04 AM PDT up reply actions  

i can just let it go

i aplly it to everyone i can in life… Shame the retard out of them… eventually they will have a blissful awakening or Darwin will excise ultimate judgement

by angelsfaninsc on Jul 29, 2010 11:06 AM PDT up reply actions  

I said to trade Nap

don’t get me wrong, I make errors every friggin day, but not in this instance.

you’re speaking of the OC Sports Geek

by 2pintsofbooze on Jul 29, 2010 11:07 AM PDT up reply actions  

i am....

dissenter, dubious and devil's advocate to blog monitors everywhere.

by BryanHarvey'sMoustache on Jul 29, 2010 11:10 AM PDT up reply actions  

ya...that was me

I like Napoli, and while I agree he’s no stud, I think he’s shown this season that he provides a little (albeit small) amount of depth defensively at 1B – - I think we’re all pretty happy or at least “satisfied” with his glove at 1B – - and while there’s no shortage of backup 1B, I think a platoon of him and conger would complement each other as conger got his feet wet. We all know what happens to our “prospects” when they become heir apparent (see Wood, McPherson) to anything.

Thats all. He’s still leading the team in HR’s, which is got to be worth something out of the C spot….

Self-realization. I was thinking of the immortal words of Socrates, who said, "I drank what?"

The Geek.

by The OC Sports Geek on Jul 29, 2010 11:11 AM PDT up reply actions  

oh, and my stupid comment

really just referred to Aldo. That’s all. Wasn’t trying to call anyone in particular out besides him. I’m not much in terms of “less green” than that guy is, I’ll admit that. I was just trying to be funny, not accusatory. So yeah, sorry Harv’s Stache. No offense intended beyond playfulness.

Self-realization. I was thinking of the immortal words of Socrates, who said, "I drank what?"

The Geek.

by The OC Sports Geek on Jul 29, 2010 11:13 AM PDT up reply actions  

What is this log jam you speak of?

Mendoza Mathis who can’t throw anyone out? The replacement-level army of Wilson and Budde? Or our stud prospect Conger who can’t stay healthy?

I get that you don’t care for Napoli, but right now he’s the best we got.

by dmhead on Jul 30, 2010 7:57 AM PDT up reply actions  

Biting

sorry just wanted to see what we could get….maybe a football team for LA….Lebron James for the clippers gosh wishing big

by IWishWeStillHadTimSalmon on Jul 29, 2010 10:37 AM PDT reply actions  

Anyone we would want to trade has little value

Abreu makes 9 million next year, Fuentes is so awful and overpaid rest of the year, Matsui I guess could have value

We would have to eat most of their contracts to get worthwhile prospects in return.

RIP Nick Adenhart

by ihearhowie2.0 on Jul 29, 2010 10:40 AM PDT reply actions  

Fuentes has value

there’s always a market for bullpen arms during the deadline.

by 2pintsofbooze on Jul 29, 2010 10:44 AM PDT reply actions  

damn

meant to be a reply to post above.

I suck

by 2pintsofbooze on Jul 29, 2010 10:44 AM PDT up reply actions  

dammit

I was hoping nobody would notice.

stop stalking me!! :)

by 2pintsofbooze on Jul 29, 2010 10:50 AM PDT up reply actions  

muahahaha stalking I am not

checking out your attractive posting mishaps I am :) watch your last post you never no where I may reply

by IWishWeStillHadTimSalmon on Jul 29, 2010 10:54 AM PDT up reply actions  

you just love to see me fail

I’d be worried you were my exwife, but I’m not divorced!

by 2pintsofbooze on Jul 29, 2010 2:28 PM PDT up reply actions   1 recs

Obama What?

Just not the change we were looking for in the Angels organization

by IWishWeStillHadTimSalmon on Jul 29, 2010 10:48 AM PDT up reply actions  

neither do we...

but we dont give up on the future either… and honestly, if we dont do some rebuilding now… we will spend next year doing it…

by angelsfaninsc on Jul 29, 2010 10:49 AM PDT up reply actions  

its not really giving up

so much as peering a lttle farther into the looking glass.

by angelsfaninsc on Jul 29, 2010 10:50 AM PDT up reply actions  

Dump Howie

Anyone still drinking the Kendrick koolaid is a sentimenalist of the highest order

by Rev Halofan on Jul 29, 2010 10:51 AM PDT via mobile reply actions   1 recs

and see

i would say the same about shields

by angelsfaninsc on Jul 29, 2010 10:52 AM PDT up reply actions  

Kind of like:

Wimp Lo: Ha! Face to foot style, how do you like it?
Chosen One: I’m sure on some planet your style is impressive, but your weak link is: this is Earth.
Wimp Lo: Oh yeah? Then try my nuts to your fist style!

Angels baseball. We do what we must, because we can -- HaloDutch

by red floyd on Jul 29, 2010 1:10 PM PDT up reply actions  

Have to disagree

Who would replace him seriously…he has been a decent and solid player this year one of the few with aybar and Hunter

by IWishWeStillHadTimSalmon on Jul 29, 2010 10:53 AM PDT up reply actions  

I doubt you could get great value for Howie...

And he’s not a horrible 2B. Not great, but not bad and cheap & under club control for a few more years. If he didn’t hit his recent cold streak, he’d still be on pace for near 100RBIs. He’s a .290+ career hitter that averages 10 HRs & 75+ RBIs per 162 games. Not bad for 2B.

I’m not in love with HK. I just don’t think any replacements will be much better for the price.

by BigSnyan on Jul 29, 2010 11:26 AM PDT up reply actions  

I actually think there are a lot of teams still drinking the Howie Koolaid..

I, for one, would trade him if a good deal was sent our way. He is 27 and I don’t expect much improvement from what we are seeing. Wish I was wrong. I like the kid.

I definitely don’t envision future batting titles like I once had.

by land4sale on Jul 29, 2010 12:12 PM PDT up reply actions  

what protection does he have

who strikes fear around any of our players where the pitcher and catcher say “we need to throw a fastball to HK and try to get him out”
I think as the lineup improves Howie improves, but this is true for all

Fuentes = The New 'F' Word

by Sinatrasratpack on Jul 29, 2010 11:59 AM PDT up reply actions  

That theory has been debunked several times

Plus, Howie was batting second for a while this year and actually performed his worst. If the problem is pitchers aren’t challenging him, maybe he should take a walk once in a while.

by dmhead on Jul 30, 2010 7:59 AM PDT up reply actions  

No Can Do

too much advertising revenue lost.

When I'm not at the stadium, I'd rather be watching my Halos back in Costa Rica!

by Dono Romantico on Jul 29, 2010 1:37 PM PDT up reply actions  

+1

"Ballplayers play baseball." -Jose Mota

by Fred Fredrix on Jul 29, 2010 4:09 PM PDT up reply actions  

but he’s supposed to win a batting title!

They want power. We want respect...

by SenorChuckles on Jul 29, 2010 9:19 PM PDT up reply actions  

SELL SELL SELL

As I stated earlier this month

SELL Matsui

SELL Abreu

SELL Juancho

SELL Fuentes and/or Rodney

This team is boring, old and while some say they aren’t playing to their potential, I believe, with the likes of aging stars like Abreu and Matsui, are actually completely playing to their potential.

Lets get some draft picks, shore up the minor league system which is looking dangerously thin in the upper levels and let some young studs like Bourjos, Conger or hell, even Trumbo, play out the rest of the season.

And let me just add Napoli and his .158 batting average with RISP, increased K/BB ratio and shitty D as a catcher.
Kendrick can take a hike too. The dude has never had MORE than 20 BB in a season…ugh…

dissenter, dubious and devil's advocate to blog monitors everywhere.

by BryanHarvey'sMoustache on Jul 29, 2010 11:03 AM PDT reply actions  

Completely Agree with your stache amigo.

When I'm not at the stadium, I'd rather be watching my Halos back in Costa Rica!

by Dono Romantico on Jul 29, 2010 1:34 PM PDT up reply actions  

Sad Reality!

Angels are 6th WORST (rank= 24/30) in the Entire League in ERA with a 4.46 team ERA

Angels are 10th Worst (rank = 20/30) in the Entire League in BA with .255 AVG

Angels are 7th Worst (rank = 23/30) in the Entire League in OBP with .318 OBP

Angels are 8th Worst (rank = 22/30) in the Entire League in WHIP with 1.41 WHIP

this add up to

Total = Failure

by IWishWeStillHadTimSalmon on Jul 29, 2010 11:04 AM PDT reply actions  

Your math is one off on all your values

We are 7th worst in Team ERA, 11th worst in team BA, etc..

by linkbruin on Jul 29, 2010 10:40 PM PDT up reply actions  

Ah man, don't jump on that bandwagon...

I hate it when Hatcher gets used as a scapegoat. This team at one point last season had all nine starters batting over.300…that shit hadn’t happened since 1931. Its not him, man….

dissenter, dubious and devil's advocate to blog monitors everywhere.

by BryanHarvey'sMoustache on Jul 29, 2010 11:06 AM PDT up reply actions   1 recs

maybe

it just seems like last year was the exception to the rule…
No plate discipline

by angelsfaninsc on Jul 29, 2010 11:07 AM PDT up reply actions  

if you look at the Hatcher years...

I dunno man, look at the Hatcher years. We’ve done pretty well getting to the playoffs with him around. I think a hitting coach is really just someone who is there to make sure you maintain our batting mechanics and to support you psychologically…by the time a player gets the bigs, their batting approach is pretty much set.

dissenter, dubious and devil's advocate to blog monitors everywhere.

by BryanHarvey'sMoustache on Jul 29, 2010 11:09 AM PDT up reply actions  

For those who say "blow it up"

That’s not easily done. The fact is that Reagins will make a couple of moves, but less than most on here think.

What we can do:

Shed Salary and pick up middle tier prospects by moving Juan Rivera and Brian Fuentes.
Trade Wood and Frandzen. Personally I don’t mind Izzy backing up.
Also move Mathis, though Sosh might not let that happen, which would suck.
If Matsui has any suitors then we should move him too.

Napoli, Hunter, and the starters have performed well enough this year, but we should hold on to Aybar, Kendrick, Callaspo, and Izzy. With Morales it’s hard to find a deeper younger better infield outside of the Yankees.

If we find enough value for Abreu we might move him, but I doubt it because I don’t see another team giving up much for him. Regardless we’ll have the funds to go after Carl Crawford, and we should. 1 great OF is a whole lot better than 3 avg ones in LF (Matsui, Rivera, Willits).

Finally, pick up Vlad? JK, but a DH rent-a-bat would would be needed too.

So next year:

Crawford LF
Abreu RF
Hunter CF
Morales 1B
Napoli C
Glaus DH
Kendrick
Callaspo
Aybar

by lightupthehalo29 on Jul 29, 2010 11:05 AM PDT reply actions  

Nah, doesn't suck.

Braves fans hated him at first, but he’s having a solid year. Been surprisingly durable.

The Devil went down to Georgia, and all I got was this gold fiddle. Go Angels! helpfindscottajob@gmail.com

by Slasher52 on Jul 29, 2010 1:44 PM PDT up reply actions  

Braves fan in my office

Is of the opinion that Glaus had a hot end of May and part of June, and has been hitting somewhere around .200 since then. So yes I would say suck.

Light up that halo! RIP, Nick.

by Clutch on Jul 29, 2010 3:36 PM PDT up reply actions  

Just to be fair

As I recall, Glaus has always slumped in July, even in his best years.

by rspencer on Jul 30, 2010 1:49 AM PDT up reply actions  

First off, who would want Wood and Frandsen??

Frandsen got picked up off of waivers. LET ME TELL YOU…NOW THATS some TRADE-BAIT!! OH, or maybe a dude who is batting .168 in Brandon Wood….HOW CAN YOU REFUSE AN OFFER LIKE THAT????

ugh…put a brain in that head.

dissenter, dubious and devil's advocate to blog monitors everywhere.

by BryanHarvey'sMoustache on Jul 29, 2010 11:08 AM PDT up reply actions  

+1

and the truth stings again

by angelsfaninsc on Jul 29, 2010 11:08 AM PDT up reply actions  

Mario Mendoza thinks Brandon Wood sucks.

YOU DON'T KNOW THE POWER OF THE DARKSIDE.....

by halofolife on Jul 29, 2010 4:57 PM PDT up reply actions  

IMO, that OF still sucks! Does not go far enough.

Hunter needs to move to a corner and Abrew needs to DH. PERIOD!

by K3YEROUT on Jul 29, 2010 11:12 AM PDT up reply actions  

Napoli will be gone dude.

this winter he’ll be done as an angel.

They want power. We want respect...

by SenorChuckles on Jul 29, 2010 9:20 PM PDT up reply actions  

With Marte being on the DL the Yanks could be looking for another Loogy

What do you guys think it would take to pry Fuentes loose?

Strikeouts are boring- Besides that, they're fascist. Throw some ground balls - it's more democratic.

by CasanovaWong on Jul 29, 2010 11:09 AM PDT reply actions  

a case of beer

and not much else… take salary and fucking run with him

by angelsfaninsc on Jul 29, 2010 11:09 AM PDT up reply actions  

If we are a sellin', the I propose Ervin...

His value is back up and we could probably get some serious value here. IMO, his elbow is a UCL just waiting to happen. We’ve been lucky thus far, let’s sell high here.

by K3YEROUT on Jul 29, 2010 11:10 AM PDT reply actions  

disagree

our SP is the one good thing we’ve had this year. thats something to build around. more offense, more reliable BP, and some defense is what we need.

by 2pintsofbooze on Jul 29, 2010 11:12 AM PDT up reply actions  

really

please tell me your not serious. right now we have three solid starters including ervin while joel is DL. come on now…

by angelsfaninsc on Jul 29, 2010 11:13 AM PDT up reply actions  

100% serious...

I love Ervin as much as anyone, but the risk/reward on that elbow is a very fine line.

Go read HERE. I think it is just a matter of time before his elbow goes.

by K3YEROUT on Jul 29, 2010 11:16 AM PDT up reply actions  

if we lose him

what does our rotation look like
Weaver (ace)
Haren (ace)
pineiro (solid 2-3)
AAA Meat (good luck)
Kazmir (were fucked)

sorry… your not going to be able to sell this one to me

by angelsfaninsc on Jul 29, 2010 11:18 AM PDT up reply actions  

The only way I would make this trade would be to a Philadelphia or someone with a prospect such as Drabek (just an example) in return. Someone who is close to our rotation for next season or for the rest of this season.

by K3YEROUT on Jul 29, 2010 11:21 AM PDT up reply actions  

so you want to trade

a performer who “might” get injured for someone like Drabek?

fuck me…. its like Aldo all over again…

by angelsfaninsc on Jul 29, 2010 11:22 AM PDT up reply actions  

oh
we’re trading for guys who might get injured? Then we gotta trade Kendry right away before he breaks another leg. Weaver and Haren might get injured too. Let’s trade them for prospects too. Trout might get injured. We gotta give him away.

by phoenix15 on Jul 29, 2010 11:24 AM PDT up reply actions  

well said

maybe we should close the doors… cant field a team with maybe injured players…..

by angelsfaninsc on Jul 29, 2010 11:25 AM PDT up reply actions  

My position is that you could get several top quality prospects in return for him. I fully realize he is a strength of ours…

My argument is that the tendon is already partially torn…would you rather plan to lose him now and get something in return or get nothing and play w/out him sometime in the next year or two? OBVIOUSLY this is not a sure thing…it is a gamble either way!

by K3YEROUT on Jul 29, 2010 11:25 AM PDT up reply actions  

or
we could be stuck with a bunch of worthless prospects like B-Wood while Ervin’s having a career year with the Phillies. This is a gamble, but unless Ervin shows that he can’t stay healthy (Izturis) there’s no reason to trade him.

by phoenix15 on Jul 29, 2010 11:29 AM PDT up reply actions  

see

 i knew someone had an intelligent perspective. thank you phoenix

by angelsfaninsc on Jul 29, 2010 11:30 AM PDT up reply actions  

Sheets
had value before being DLed. But my point is, most pitchers can’t avoid the DL with the strain on their elbows. There is an injury risk with all pitchers, but just because they landed on the DL once, doesn’t mean they’re injury prone. You have to hope Ervin has a slider motion that causes less strain and good mechanics.

by phoenix15 on Jul 29, 2010 11:36 AM PDT up reply actions  

I agree with you

Santana is not off the table at all for the right offer. He’s had some injuries in the past, and someone comparing positional player possible injuries with the Santana possibly getting injured is comparing apples to oranges.

by MH252525 on Jul 29, 2010 1:06 PM PDT up reply actions  

The only problem is that we have no one ready to take Santana's spot.

I agree that if someone really wanted Santana he’s available, but I think at the moment he would be pretty hard to get.

by ~MMP~ on Jul 29, 2010 1:09 PM PDT up reply actions  

at least one of the guys coming our way would have

to be a guy the Angels think could start next year.

by MH252525 on Jul 29, 2010 1:21 PM PDT up reply actions  

If Santana got dealt, a proven MLB pitcher better be part of the deal

"You gotta have nuts." / "Coming Around 3rd, especially if I'm ticked off, that's going to happen." - Torii Hunter

by Commander_Nate on Jul 29, 2010 1:48 PM PDT up reply actions  

This is my thought

There are no viable replacements for Santana in the system, and anyone of his quality is going to cost more than $8 million on the free agent market. I think the Angels have to take the chance that his elbow’s okay.

Defending maligned chants since 2009

by Gorbachav5 on Jul 29, 2010 1:48 PM PDT up reply actions  

you do know
there’s that kind of risk on an elbow for almost everyone who throws sliders or a pitch not called a knuckleball.

by phoenix15 on Jul 29, 2010 11:19 AM PDT up reply actions  

I also disagree

He’s our best pitcher with an agent not named Satan.

At least before Haren. I’m still new to baseball and don’t know much about him. This joke would’ve been funnier a week ago.

"You keep shooting. You hope it goes in, and you smile." -Teemu Selanne

by haloduck on Jul 29, 2010 11:14 AM PDT up reply actions  

This would be a good thought

If he wasn’t signed so cheaply. I doubt we get full value back for him. I don’t think you can trade a guy based on unpredictable injuries.

Defending maligned chants since 2009

by Gorbachav5 on Jul 29, 2010 11:15 AM PDT up reply actions  

yeah...

we should ditch Sosh before his fat ass has an aneurism on the field and dies… wait…….

by angelsfaninsc on Jul 29, 2010 11:16 AM PDT up reply actions  

I'm saying the history is there already with Ervin...

He has not bounced all the way back, but has made significant progress. UCL’s do not repair themselves EVER. You either strengthen the muscles surrounding and some scar tissue or you have the TJ surgery. My recollection was that he had a partial tear…

by K3YEROUT on Jul 29, 2010 11:18 AM PDT up reply actions  

You're right.

Either rest or surgery. If the season is really over for the Angels, they should drastically cutback on Santana’s innings so he’s completely ready for 2011.

by WiHaloFan on Jul 29, 2010 12:06 PM PDT up reply actions  

NO WAY -- We cannot trade Ervin

The idea is to trade for ace starting pitchers, like we did last weekend with Haren, not to trade them away. Ervin is a 27-year-old pitching stud. He was 6th in Cy Young voting at age 25, and he now is one of our four most valuable talents, along with Weaver, Haren, and Kendry.

How good has he become? Well, he has an ERA+ of 120, and he has averaged just under 7 innings per start. I will cry and begin breaking things if we trade Ervin, especially if we do so (as you propose) in return for a prospect.

by Brody on Jul 29, 2010 3:44 PM PDT up reply actions  

did anyone see

that A-Rod is trying to stop the Rangers auction?

I’m thinking instead of A-Rod, his name should be A-Hole. he’s got an inny, not an outy.

the guys making $300 million and he’s doing this. seriously, what an A-Hole.

by 2pintsofbooze on Jul 29, 2010 11:11 AM PDT reply actions  

I’m all for protecting one’s business interests, and enforcing contracts, but this reinforces (to me) that he’s a whiner. If I’d heard any other name (Mark McLemore and your $970,051.97, I’m looking at you) associated with this before I heard A-Rod’s, it wouldn’t bother me in the least.

by cath619 on Jul 29, 2010 12:59 PM PDT up reply actions  

I have no issue with his action

I’m not interested in debating whether or not ARod is a douche bag, we all know the answer. However, the freaking Rangers gave him that $250m contract, why would anyone take a risk when they are still owed $26m (as a creditor) from Tom Hicks? If your employer owed you money and you had the ability to protect your interests, would you forgo the right? Hicks signed the contract, and ARod should get paid.

Additionally, it’s not just ARod who has the ability to block the auction. These players are also creditors to Hicks: Kevin Millwood ($12.9 million); Vicente Padilla ($1.7 million); Mickey Tettleton ($1.4 million); and Mark McLemore ($970,051.97).

Rodriguez didn’t file the only objection Wednesday to the auction plan, Major League Baseball, the Major League Baseball Players Association and the team’s lenders also objected to various parts of the plan.

by mustard_man on Jul 29, 2010 12:27 PM PDT up reply actions  

^yes^

As rich as A-Hole is, he’d be an idiot to let someone essentially steal $26 million from him.

by yeswecan on Jul 29, 2010 4:14 PM PDT up reply actions  

No

This deferred money that Texas owes him from when he played there, not money that Texas owes the Yankees.

Defending maligned chants since 2009

by Gorbachav5 on Jul 29, 2010 5:24 PM PDT up reply actions  

Oh I see.

Yay rich a-rod getting richer! /sarcasm

Light up that halo! RIP, Nick.

by Clutch on Jul 30, 2010 11:49 AM PDT up reply actions  

does anyone else find this therapeutic?

to finally say how feel about how how are beloved team is underperforming… lining those deserving of it up like cattle and just blowing there brains out on this blog! i feel better!

by angelsfaninsc on Jul 29, 2010 11:14 AM PDT reply actions  

should rename this thread Catharsis 101

Self-realization. I was thinking of the immortal words of Socrates, who said, "I drank what?"

The Geek.

by The OC Sports Geek on Jul 29, 2010 11:15 AM PDT reply actions   1 recs

If we can't trade our underperforming, overpaid losers,

can we drive them to the desert, drop them off, and see which ones can find their way home?

Rory Markas. Alex Chilton. 2010, you suck!

by LazorkoRules on Jul 29, 2010 11:23 AM PDT reply actions  

Palm Springs has a team of wannabe professionals.

a perfect fit. Trade them to the Palm Springs Power for a couple of rainbow flags.

When I'm not at the stadium, I'd rather be watching my Halos back in Costa Rica!

by Dono Romantico on Jul 29, 2010 1:45 PM PDT up reply actions  

Not that there's anything wrong that.

YOU DON'T KNOW THE POWER OF THE DARKSIDE.....

by halofolife on Jul 29, 2010 5:05 PM PDT up reply actions  

Just ignore anybody who thinks Napoli is an untouchable piece in the angels franchise.

What do you need a fancy suit for, Charlie, you ain't got no job to wear it to.

by clover_black on Jul 29, 2010 11:26 AM PDT reply actions  

If you can find anyone else in the organization

With a track record of patience and power who isn’t over 35, then let me know. The Angels would do well to realize that Napoli can DH with the best of them and just get a new catcher.

by Suboptimal on Jul 29, 2010 12:05 PM PDT up reply actions   1 recs

mancrush to the extreme.

Naps isn’t untouchable. If a trade presents itself, and is beneficial to the organization, and napoli is a piece, … pull the trigger.

What do you need a fancy suit for, Charlie, you ain't got no job to wear it to.

by clover_black on Jul 29, 2010 12:54 PM PDT up reply actions  

Mancrush?

Mancrushes are what get wastes of space like Jeff Mathis playing time. Napoli can actually earn his meal ticket, unlike about 20 other guys on the roster. He has to be really, really low on the list of guys you’d want to trade.

Sure, I’d move him if the return was worth it. But I’d make damn sure it was worth it first. It makes no sense to sell low on a guy who can hit the ball a long, long way.

by Suboptimal on Jul 29, 2010 1:23 PM PDT up reply actions  

perhaps

the reasoning behind trading Naps is that he’d actually be able to get the team something decent in return. Mathis, Wood, Rodney, Rivera will get the team nothing in return, and everyone screaming to trade them away need to understand that.

the fact is that the Halos have a logjam at the catcher position, and Nap holds the most value, which also means he’s the last one the fans want to see go.

by 2pintsofbooze on Jul 29, 2010 1:31 PM PDT up reply actions  

Yes, he has value

But so does Weaver, and he’s not going anywhere. Mike Napoli is the best hitter the Angels have produced since Troy Glaus. People just don’t realize it because he’s always batting way down in the order. He’s technically having a down season this year, and even that just might be good enough to lead the whole team in slugging when it’s all over.

You’re not going to get much for Juan Rivera or Brian Fuentes, true. But they’re not in much of a position to help the team in 2011. Napoli is.

by Suboptimal on Jul 29, 2010 1:43 PM PDT up reply actions  

The talk about moving Rivera/Rodney/Abreu is primarily about $ in 2011

Whereas Naps is about a prospect. If the FO wants decent prospects, he’s the only one that would warrant a prospect. But you’re right, hes a good hitter who is reasonably priced and under control for a few more years.

by BigSnyan on Jul 29, 2010 1:46 PM PDT up reply actions  

I actually think

Fuentes should be the first guy traded. he holds value, and contenders are always looking for BP help at the deadline. not saying he’ll get us the next Hanley ramirez, but he should be able get the Halos a decent prospect, or even 2. he holds zero value for the Halos this season and next, that much is obvious.

and the comp to Weaver doesn’t really apply since we don’t have a stock of starting pitchers waiting in the wings. we have 5 catchers.

by 2pintsofbooze on Jul 29, 2010 2:05 PM PDT up reply actions  

Yes, Fuentes...

after Rodney & Rivera. Both Rodney & Rivera would be off the books for 2011.

by BigSnyan on Jul 29, 2010 2:06 PM PDT up reply actions  

What we really need to get rid of is future salary

We’re trying to build for the next few years, right? So we should be looking at whose getting paid next year. Here’s the guys signed beyond this year:

Torii ($18.5 for two more years) – Like it or not, he’s kind of the face of the franchise now; he’s not moving
Abreu ($9MM, 1 yr) – I’d be fine moving Abreu who is a zero in the OF and has clearly entered the decline phase at the plate
Haren ($12.5, 2yrs) – Not going anywhere
Kazmir ($12, 1 yr) – Ugh, if only…but no, no one is taking this contract
Pineiro ($8, 1 yr) – This is a good contract
Santana ($8, $11.2) – This is also a good contract, although K3 brings up his sketchy injury history; if the Angels got a good offer, I would pull the trigger, but I don’t see it happening
Rodney ($5.5, 1 yr) – If someone offers a club sandwich, please take it; this was a mistake
Rivera ($5.25, 1 yr) – Half a club sandwich in this case; Rivera can’t hit enough to justify his terrible play in left field
Izturis ($3.5m, 2yrs) – This is a fine contract

Guys I’d look at seriously trading: Abreu, Rodney, Rivera
Guys I’d trade if I can find a dumb enough GM: Kazmir

Trading Fuentes or Matsui isn’t a bad idea either, but like I said, that won’t affect next year’s books at all. Still, if someone will give up decent assets, take em.

Defending maligned chants since 2009

by Gorbachav5 on Jul 29, 2010 11:28 AM PDT reply actions   1 recs

exactly!

salary dump to free up our free agency capabilities.

by BigSnyan on Jul 29, 2010 11:31 AM PDT up reply actions  

Follow-up

Here are arbitration eligible players who will be getting a serious raise next year:

Weaver (estimated $7.5 million): I hate Boras, but Weaver is dang good, and he’ll still be affordable
Napoli (estimated $5 million): We do have a lot of catching in the system, but I’d rather deal Conger or Mathis if we can – Napoli’s bat, despite his lack of clutch hitting, is valuable
Aybar (estimated $4 million) – Still a good contract, keep him
Kendrick (estimated $4 million) – Also a decent contract, I would keep him
Mathis (estimated $2.5 million) – Trade him, he’s barely replacement level
Morales (estimated ???) – Who knows how much Satan Boras will get him in arbitration, but he’s the best hitter on the team; keep him

Trade options: Napoli or Mathis (or Conger)

I would keep Napoli as his bat is valuable, but this is our clear area of depth.

Defending maligned chants since 2009

by Gorbachav5 on Jul 29, 2010 11:35 AM PDT up reply actions  

I really think

we need to keep Conger. he could be Napoli 2.0 except a switch-hitter. he’s younger and his name is Hank. he is the future franchise catcher, mathis/Wilson/Budde are stopgaps until he’s ready.

trade Nap and Fuentes

by 2pintsofbooze on Jul 29, 2010 11:39 AM PDT up reply actions  

He's already had several injury problems

That worries me. People have questioned whether or not he can stay behind the plate. If we’re really looking for a stopgap, you trade Mathis or Wilson and keep Napoli. Napoli’s bat is just too valuable.

Defending maligned chants since 2009

by Gorbachav5 on Jul 29, 2010 11:41 AM PDT up reply actions  

he's young

I don’t think its fair to assume that he’ll always be injured. he could easily have an injury-free next 4 or 5 years. no one can really say one way or the other.

I’ll admit though that I’ve been a Conger homer ever since we signed him since he went to my high school.

Napoli is batting somewhere around .150 with RISP, I think we could do just fine without that bat. don’t get me wrong, I love me some Naps, but his solo shots don’t do much damage when we’re down by 3.

lets compare Izzy and Nap. most would say Nap has the better bat, but who would you rather have at the plate with RISP? Izzy, without a doubt.

by 2pintsofbooze on Jul 29, 2010 11:56 AM PDT up reply actions  

That he's young is MORE of a red flag

If he were 30 and having chronic injury problems, I’d wonder if it was just wear and tear. That he’s having injury problems as a 22 year old is a big warning sign. To me, it’s a huge indicator that he won’t be able to withstand the rigors of catching everyday.

As for Napoli, neither clutchness (hitting well with RISP) or anti-clutchness is a skill. It’s just bad luck. Two years ago he was fine in those situations.

Defending maligned chants since 2009

by Gorbachav5 on Jul 29, 2010 12:51 PM PDT up reply actions  

Hank the Tank

is a keeper. I like the fact that he’s a switch hitter. Of course, we all know what happens when we let minor league numbers do the talking—nodnarb doow—.

Nonetheless, I think he’ll definitely be a great asset to this team.

by maze88 on Jul 29, 2010 11:42 AM PDT up reply actions  

I think the key is...

to go after a big name FA to fill the position and come up just short (Teixiera). Then, the farm system has to perform in a big way (Kendry).

by BigSnyan on Jul 29, 2010 11:45 AM PDT up reply actions  

lol

for the record, I’m not necessarily in favor of trading Napoli. But if the FO wants prospects primarily rather than just $ relief, Napoli is our best chip IMO.

by BigSnyan on Jul 29, 2010 1:50 PM PDT up reply actions  

Yeah, I suppose

I’m just loathe to see us trade one of the two or three best hitters on the team when the offense is struggling to badly. Plus he’ll still be relatively cheap next year.

All of this is based on the assumption that the FO would like to be competitive again next season. If this is a two or three year rebuilding project then yeah, go ahead and trade Napoli.

Defending maligned chants since 2009

by Gorbachav5 on Jul 29, 2010 2:02 PM PDT up reply actions  

This is why I'd keep Napoli too.

We want to contend in 2011. There is no better replacement available, especially at Nap’s price.

Bummer that Mathis has approximately 0 trade value. I wouldn’t be surprised if he went non-tendered.

by BigSnyan on Jul 29, 2010 2:05 PM PDT up reply actions  

He should have been non-tendered last year

I really have no idea what the organization is thinking with regard to Jeff Mathis. Unless they’re just not thinking.

by Suboptimal on Jul 29, 2010 2:09 PM PDT up reply actions  

Conger, anyone?

not that he’s a lock to replace what Nap does, but he is a switch-hitting catcher with + power, and is something like 22 years old.

by 2pintsofbooze on Jul 29, 2010 2:12 PM PDT up reply actions  

Shoulder issues

for the last 2 years don’t bode well

by Epic Dean on Jul 29, 2010 2:13 PM PDT up reply actions  

I thought

he was mostly healthy last year, but was out the year prior? I could be wrong.

either way, I’m not one to dismiss a guy, especially a #1 pick, due to some injury issues. especially after watching him in the futures game.

I’m all in on Conger

by 2pintsofbooze on Jul 29, 2010 2:18 PM PDT up reply actions  

Same

"You gotta have nuts." / "Coming Around 3rd, especially if I'm ticked off, that's going to happen." - Torii Hunter

by Commander_Nate on Jul 29, 2010 2:29 PM PDT up reply actions  

I thought all of it first!

Give me half of your screen name and I’ll consider it.

"You gotta have nuts." / "Coming Around 3rd, especially if I'm ticked off, that's going to happen." - Torii Hunter

by Commander_Nate on Jul 29, 2010 3:28 PM PDT up reply actions  

You get "2" and "of"

Angels baseball. We do what we must, because we can -- HaloDutch

by red floyd on Jul 29, 2010 3:32 PM PDT up reply actions  

2pintsofCommander_Nate?

Eeeew.

Light up that halo! RIP, Nick.

by Clutch on Jul 29, 2010 3:45 PM PDT up reply actions  

or perhaps

2pintsofnate & commander _booze

by 2pintsofbooze on Jul 29, 2010 3:50 PM PDT up reply actions  

Well, this deal didn't work out as expected at all...

"You gotta have nuts." / "Coming Around 3rd, especially if I'm ticked off, that's going to happen." - Torii Hunter

by Commander_Nate on Jul 29, 2010 3:52 PM PDT up reply actions  

I'd salute Commander Booze...

The Devil went down to Georgia, and all I got was this gold fiddle. Go Angels! helpfindscottajob@gmail.com

by Slasher52 on Jul 29, 2010 3:53 PM PDT up reply actions  

Ok not much better.

:-D

Light up that halo! RIP, Nick.

by Clutch on Jul 29, 2010 5:00 PM PDT up reply actions  

Wow, so many stupid, uneducated comments and replies....

The Angels lack depth in the form of minor league pitching. If they deal, they will most certainly deal for AA or AAA arms. Now let’s examine, what they are likely to deal.

CATCHING: Conger could be seriously injured and may require another year in AAA. But we won’t be carrying both Mathis and Wilson, so pick one.

INFIELD: The only guys that are for sure staying are Aybar, Callaspo, Kendrick and Napoli (C/1B/DH). Scioscia loves him some Izzy so that’s a long shot. That leaves Frandsen and Wood.

RELIEF PITCHING: Do we have it? Not really, but everyone else wants it. We have the luxury of dealing one arm and only one, that’s Brian Fuentes and I can assure you, many contending teams will take on his money. Yankees, Red Sox, Phillies, Reds, Giants and Dodgers.

The one and only thing the Angels will deal for is minor league pitching. Go ahead and ignore every other comment in this thread if it involves any one else from our team or any one not pitching in another organization.

We betrayed Vlad, the greatest Angel. Epic fail.

by Halowood on Jul 29, 2010 11:28 AM PDT reply actions  

Even if we only get a few middling prospects back...

doesn’t another team taking on the salary of a Abreu, Rodney, or Rivera free us up for free agency? Even if the prospects received are not enticIf we can offer a few more dollars to Crawford after a decent salary dump, that is worth it in my estimation.

by BigSnyan on Jul 29, 2010 11:30 AM PDT up reply actions  

totally agree

lose the dead weight and go crazy with FA. spend the money. come back in 2011 and Dick the yankees like our bullpen and kazmir have dicked us all year long.

by angelsfaninsc on Jul 29, 2010 11:31 AM PDT up reply actions  

Examine what you want from another team's perspective....

Does anyone out there want a 36 year old DH that can’t play OF, doesn’t hit for power and isn’t particularly fast but is being paid 9 million? Can you say GMJ? Does any team want a former closer that can’t close but is being paid like he’s the bet in the game? Rivera’s a definite maybe, though you’d be hardpressed to find a team outside of SF or SD that wants him.

So to sum it up, no, none of that will happen.

We betrayed Vlad, the greatest Angel. Epic fail.

by Halowood on Jul 29, 2010 11:33 AM PDT up reply actions  

Rivera and Matsuit have some value...

  Matsui is a good power bat for the playoffs. Rivera can help some of these clubs. The Tigers and Padres are both in dire need of OF right now.

by Nashdiesel on Jul 29, 2010 11:35 AM PDT up reply actions  

Maybe
we can trade Matsui to the Philles for Oswalt ( heard they were getting him)

by phoenix15 on Jul 29, 2010 11:37 AM PDT up reply actions  

But
I’ll lmao if Matsui went to the Phillies and they got to the WS again and faced the Yanks and Matsui became the WS MVP for the Phillies

by phoenix15 on Jul 29, 2010 11:40 AM PDT up reply actions  

my take...

teams with $ will take on salary that offers any help, even if its only depth. Many teams with $ would either give up prospects OR take on salary, not both. If you could find a match for middling prospects, but dump the salary, its a win for us. Rodney is only $5.5 million, and bullpen arms are few and far between on the current market.

Not saying its likely, but those are the moves I’d target first. Fuentes & Matsui don’t help financially for next year, so I agree that the FO should target some AA or AAA arms with them.

by BigSnyan on Jul 29, 2010 11:37 AM PDT up reply actions  

+1

Fuentes = The New 'F' Word

by Sinatrasratpack on Jul 29, 2010 12:03 PM PDT up reply actions  

and I can assure you, many contending teams will take on his money. Yankees, Red Sox, Phillies, Reds, Giants and Dodgers.

 >will take on his money. Yankees, Red Sox, Phillies, Reds, Giants and Dodgers.
> Dodgers
> take on money

?

I brought sexy back, but they only gave me store credit....

by PhiSlamma on Jul 29, 2010 12:30 PM PDT up reply actions  

Let me clear that one up

No one is sure if th Dodgers can take any money or not, but if it gets them a reliable arm to push toward the playoffs with, I think they would. Depending on the prospect it might only be half of his remaining (3 million I believe) contract. His option doesn’t appear as though it will vest.

We betrayed Vlad, the greatest Angel. Epic fail.

by Halowood on Jul 29, 2010 12:35 PM PDT up reply actions  

You forgot Kendry on the list of infield certanties.

Angels baseball. We do what we must, because we can -- HaloDutch

by red floyd on Jul 29, 2010 1:16 PM PDT up reply actions  

Agree with you??? Somewhat.

Yes, I agree with you Halowood.

Moreover, as much as we would like to get rid of the overpaid dead weight on our team, the only way that is going to happen is . . .

1) If we are willing to still pay their salaries (ie. GMJ), which totally sucks.

2) We are willing to take back another teams overpaid players. Think Carlos Lee, who makes 18.5 million in 2011 and 2012, as an example of someone we would have to take. Each team has their share of bad contracts. Prime example of such a trade was the Carlos Silva for Milton Bradley deal. Two teams basically taking out the garbage. This was one of the few things that actually went well for the Cubs, since Silva actually has turned around his game, although he’s still overpaid. Coincidentally, the Cubs have a disproportionate number of really bad contracts (ie. Fukodome, Soriano, Ramirez, Zambrano). So, if you really want to get rid of Kazmir, you can start by thinking how you would like to see someone like Fukodome in an Angels uniform.

I think its doubtful that the Dodgers will take on Fuentes’ contract. Since all that money they would pay Fuentes could easily pay for two or three more divorce attorneys for the McCourts. The Giants and Reds are also doubtful (remember these are small market teams) as are the Red Sox. Yes, the Red Sox theoretically have the money, but they are going to pay luxury tax and the team has proceeded cautiously on this front. The Yankees or the Phillies are probably more reasonable bets.

by righteous halo on Jul 29, 2010 1:26 PM PDT up reply actions  

No I am not saying that the Red Sox are a small market team

That was a poorly worded sentence, with too many clauses and parenthesis.

by righteous halo on Jul 29, 2010 1:28 PM PDT up reply actions  

Agree, this thread is in definite need of the HH Quality Control Department.

It’s tough to read through the childish bickering and name-calling above to find the actual worthwhile discussion going on in this thread.

Warning: The message above may or may not contain sarcasm. Read and interpret at your own risk.

by snowhor on Jul 29, 2010 2:14 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions  

my take...

1) trade howie only if you get a good return. he’s a lifetime .294 hitter in the midst of his worst season. might not be a good time to trade him because his value is low. play callaspo at 2b because he’s proven he sure as hell can’t play 3b.
2) trade naps- he’s a party boy who has a lot of value and the halos aren’t going to make a long term commitment to him if he doesn’t chill out w/the party lifestyle.
3) trade matsui/fuentes/rivera and get try to get some prospects back that are comparable to the guys we lost in the callaspo and haren deal, if possible.
4) play trumbo, bourjos and wood to see what we have with them. trumbo leads the pcl in rbi’s and is 3rd in hr’s, bourjos is on a tear and w/wood maybe another team will see him as their 3b of the future and we can finally move on from him.

by thejd on Jul 29, 2010 11:50 AM PDT reply actions  

Our farm is depleted

Trade these guys like Fuentes, or Matsui who don’t really have a role in the future of this club for a few useful prospects.

Fuentes is probably the only one who can be traded. Matsui would give value, but were not gonna move him due to the Japanese media.

by Gokyle45 on Jul 29, 2010 11:50 AM PDT reply actions  

wow, can't believe some of these stupid comments.

1) we need a power bat. Put a package together of wood, izturis, and hot minor league prospect (mosebach?) for pujols
2) Bullpen needs adjustment. callaspo and $$$ for soria
3) corner OF defense- ship juan rivera to the mexican beer league for NACHOS, bring up bourjos, move abrew to DH, sign crawford if granderson isn’t available
4) Trade mathisi for a 3rd baseman (beltre?)
5) WIN

What do you need a fancy suit for, Charlie, you ain't got no job to wear it to.

by clover_black on Jul 29, 2010 11:54 AM PDT reply actions   1 recs

wow....

i dont know whether to laugh or scrath my head, but either way, this got me smilin….

by angelsfaninsc on Jul 29, 2010 11:55 AM PDT up reply actions  

I'm intrigued by this NACHOS fellow

What do his stats look like? Is he a power guy? Or more of a speed guy?

Defending maligned chants since 2009

by Gorbachav5 on Jul 29, 2010 12:53 PM PDT up reply actions  

He's a little messy when it comes to the fundamentals

And his locker room antics come off as a little cheesy.

Torii Hunter has some Brain Movage

by ryanfea on Jul 29, 2010 12:58 PM PDT up reply actions  

He's NACHO player...

he’s someone else’s.

I love this team.

by Downing Rules on Jul 29, 2010 1:03 PM PDT up reply actions  

Well, when he's free, he kind of looks like Jack Black

Angels baseball. We do what we must, because we can -- HaloDutch

by red floyd on Jul 29, 2010 1:18 PM PDT up reply actions  

This is a great plan

if we plan to have a 150 million dollar payroll next year.

by lightupthehalo29 on Jul 29, 2010 1:58 PM PDT up reply actions  

Wait. Granderson is available?

"Wastin away again in Minor-Leaguer-Ville..."

by Stirrups on Jul 29, 2010 2:28 PM PDT up reply actions  

The Angels payroll heading into 2011 is...

already just under $94M, and that’s without any arbitration raises added in. If the payroll is the same as this season ($121M), there’s not much left for any mega-FA signings.

COT’S Salary info

The only players whose salary has much of an impact (and might have trade value) are Rodney ($5.5M) and Abreu ($9M). If those two could be dealt, their savings might be enough to sign Crawford (or someone else).

by WiHaloFan on Jul 29, 2010 12:23 PM PDT reply actions  

It's my opinion that Callaspo and Haren weren't for this season, they were future moves

Reagins is smart to gear up for 2011 before the offseason. His to-do list has shrunk because of it.

- Now we aren’t stuck getting into a bidding contest for Adrian Beltre.
- Now we won’t be dealing for any SP and no one will say we don’t have a playoff rotation.

This shortens Reagins offseason honeydo list to:
- Shore up the bullpen with one reliever. We’re losing Fuentes, but have gained Kohn, Thompson, Rodriguez and will get Bulger back. See if we can’t sign Soriano. If not, make a trade.

- Improve the outfield. I expect Rivera/Mathis will be traded for a reliever and we’ll either see Bourjos or Crawford in the outfield.

We betrayed Vlad, the greatest Angel. Epic fail.

by Halowood on Jul 29, 2010 12:45 PM PDT up reply actions   1 recs

Have you seen Kohn's outings?

Angels baseball. We do what we must, because we can -- HaloDutch

by red floyd on Jul 29, 2010 1:19 PM PDT up reply actions  

He was stilling throwing pitches a foot off the plate

I wouldn’t say he’s solid until he can go at least an inning without walking someone.

by Suboptimal on Jul 29, 2010 1:45 PM PDT up reply actions  

pretty sure most pitchers would be shaky in their

1st ever MLB appearance, against the Red Sox. just sayin.

by 2pintsofbooze on Jul 29, 2010 2:07 PM PDT up reply actions  

He's just not ready

I mean, he was in low A ball one year ago. His command still needs to develop.

by Suboptimal on Jul 29, 2010 2:11 PM PDT up reply actions  

ok

but might as well let him develop his command against MLB hitters for the rest of the season. he will prob get shelled every now and again, but its not like Rodney wouldn’t allow the same the following inning.

by 2pintsofbooze on Jul 29, 2010 2:14 PM PDT up reply actions  

Developing against MLB hitters can often set development back. This isn’t like Wood who had nothing left to prove in the minors. Kohn had only been at AAA this season. He probably could use a bit more seasoning before he’s ready for the big leagues.

Defending maligned chants since 2009

by Gorbachav5 on Jul 29, 2010 2:29 PM PDT up reply actions  

it can set development back

but it can also help him figure it out in his next couple outings leading him to dominate for the rest of his career.

by 2pintsofbooze on Jul 29, 2010 3:03 PM PDT up reply actions  

Look at his numbers in AAA...

Clearly he’s ready, those guys aren’t challenging him. His command will improve with more innings in the bigs, like Jepsen’s has improved,, like Bulger’s has improved. All he needs are the innings.

We betrayed Vlad, the greatest Angel. Epic fail.

by Halowood on Jul 29, 2010 2:31 PM PDT up reply actions  

Except for, oh, the 17 walks in 27 innings

And a K/BB rate that was much worse than anything he’d put up previously in the minors. The kid’s not ready. I would guess he’ll be ready next year some time.

Defending maligned chants since 2009

by Gorbachav5 on Jul 29, 2010 2:40 PM PDT up reply actions  

I'm with Halowood and booze on this one

Let the kid pitch. Hard to gauge the kid on two MLB appearances. Even with a higher walk rate in AAA, he’s been excellent, there. Nothing left to prove.

Might as well see what he’s got, I mean- he can’t be any worse than some of the arms in the pen already?!?!?

Bell is the one that needs more time in AAA, IMO. Let Kohn stay and see what he can do with a few more IPs.

NA, #34 SP, LAA
Light up the Halo for Nick!

More Howie please...

by hk47 on Jul 29, 2010 5:02 PM PDT up reply actions  

Although you're right that Jepsen had similar numbers

Then again Jepsen’s success at the big league level hasn’t been all that great either, so I’m not sure that’s a positive comp.

Defending maligned chants since 2009

by Gorbachav5 on Jul 29, 2010 2:42 PM PDT up reply actions  

Jepsen has suffered from a lot of bad luck and defense

.357 career BABIP. His K/9, FIP and xFIP are solid.

Torii Hunter has some Brain Movage

by ryanfea on Jul 29, 2010 2:45 PM PDT up reply actions  

If you think his BABiP is a fluke

It’s been bad a few years in a row now. It will probably come down some, but there are pitchers who give up BABiPs higher than .300. Jepsen may be one of those guys. And his walk rate still isn’t all that great.

Defending maligned chants since 2009

by Gorbachav5 on Jul 29, 2010 3:10 PM PDT up reply actions  

Agreed about his walk rate

He needs to control that. I still contend that his BABIP won’t be sustained like that, especially if we are able to field an improved defense behind him next year.

Torii Hunter has some Brain Movage

by ryanfea on Jul 29, 2010 3:19 PM PDT up reply actions  

Jepsen has suffered from the fact

He just can’t get anyone out. Despite the “great stuff,” his performance and numbers just aren’t getting any better.

NA, #34 SP, LAA
Light up the Halo for Nick!

More Howie please...

by hk47 on Jul 29, 2010 4:53 PM PDT up reply actions  

He hasn't even pitched 100 innings yet

People don’t realize how unreliable ERA is over such a small sample. I mean, Livan Hernandez had an ERA of about 1.00 after 100 innings this year. Does anyone think Livan Hernandez is anywhere close to that good of a pitcher? It can work against pitchers the same way. Kevin Jepsen has pitched much better than his 4.73 ERA indicates.

by Suboptimal on Jul 29, 2010 5:10 PM PDT up reply actions  

I disagree

I think Kohn will have a lifetime era of 27.00, which he had after his first outing.

by 2pintsofbooze on Jul 29, 2010 5:14 PM PDT up reply actions  

I understand he's been unlucky

I just don’t know if he’s been quite as unlucky as people think. Some guys just give up higher BABiPs, and it’s especially tricky for relievers who will almost always deal with sample size issues. I think the ERA will get better, but I don’t buy that he’s a 2.5 ERA pitcher in a 4.75 ERA pitcher’s body.

As for Kohn, the walks are an issue, and I would keep him in AAA for the rest of the season, but the Angels know him better. If they think his development won’t be hindered, then okay.

Defending maligned chants since 2009

by Gorbachav5 on Jul 29, 2010 5:27 PM PDT up reply actions  

Line drive rate

That’s the best predictor you can get for BABIP. Over large samples, batters usually hit about .730 on liners as compared to the low .200’s on any other type of batted ball. The usual rule of thumb is that BABIP and LD% shouldn’t be more or less than about 120 points in difference.

Jepsen has a career 17.1% line drive rate but a .357 BABIP. That’s just ridiculous bad luck. Especially when you consider that his groundball/flyball ratio is 2.41, which is crazy good for a strikeout pitcher. He’s been even more unlucky than Dan Haren.

by Suboptimal on Jul 29, 2010 7:04 PM PDT up reply actions  

I will say this: Jepsen throws a lot of straight fastballs. Straight fastballs, even at 97 m.p.h., often turn into line drives.

Jepsen throws hard, but has poor command. I don’t really think he has been unlucky.

by jjackflash on Jul 29, 2010 7:28 PM PDT up reply actions  

I agree he’s unlucky, I just don’t think he’s THAT unlucky. He’ll settle in as 3.50 – 4.00 pitcher, which is about average for a reliever. The walks will continue to hurt him.

His peripherals are good, but they may not ever drop to normalized levels.

Defending maligned chants since 2009

by Gorbachav5 on Jul 30, 2010 9:03 AM PDT up reply actions  

Kohn took 5 Filet-O-Fish

and fed the masses…

The Devil went down to Georgia, and all I got was this gold fiddle. Go Angels! helpfindscottajob@gmail.com

by Slasher52 on Jul 29, 2010 1:32 PM PDT up reply actions  

Did he turn the Dr. Pepper into wine?

YOU DON'T KNOW THE POWER OF THE DARKSIDE.....

by halofolife on Jul 29, 2010 5:15 PM PDT up reply actions  

No but

he did resurrect Spock

This isn't 'Nam. This is bowling. There are rules.

by SalmonStream on Jul 29, 2010 5:19 PM PDT up reply actions  

We will probably trade Abreu before the August 31 deadline.

   HIs contract is large enought, and he is just not quite good enough to get blocked. We can get two B-ish prospects in return.

by Wally's World on Jul 29, 2010 12:43 PM PDT reply actions  

Tony's right

We may be cellar’d when all’s said and done.

"That ball went where he threw it!" - Rex Hudler

by Zoe Necrosis on Jul 29, 2010 12:46 PM PDT reply actions  

oops, sarcasm detector broken!

duh. Cellar’d ~ sellers. funny, very funny.

I love this team.

by Downing Rules on Jul 29, 2010 1:05 PM PDT up reply actions  

Protected draft picks, FTW!!!

"You gotta have nuts." / "Coming Around 3rd, especially if I'm ticked off, that's going to happen." - Torii Hunter

by Commander_Nate on Jul 29, 2010 3:52 PM PDT up reply actions  

Im just saying, if we have given up on this season... which is what a lineup that has reggie willits starting says to me...

Then tank it hard. Bring up the bees and travelers and lets see if we cant get a top 10 pick. Right now we are at .500 and have just gone 7 and 16 over the last 23 games. keep that pace up and we will finish with around a .444 winning percentage. We could easily get the 11th pick, but lets aim high! er… low!

by Balls and Strikes on Jul 29, 2010 6:06 PM PDT up reply actions  

"Aim for the drain"

Or so they say…

Stop snickering.

"You gotta have nuts." / "Coming Around 3rd, especially if I'm ticked off, that's going to happen." - Torii Hunter

by Commander_Nate on Jul 29, 2010 8:19 PM PDT up reply actions  

Wow you folks don't like not being on top

yeah let’s nuke the whole team. Guys we loved last year they are all now garbage. Bobby Abreu we loved but his batting aveage is down so he is now a piece of trash (even though he is still on track for 90 or so rbi’s, runs and walks this years only slightly lower than last year). Howie, Izzy, Tori all trash right? This is like watching children throw a temper tantrum.

Ok, guys let me have it, I just felt it needed to be said.

by kbrown2225 on Jul 29, 2010 1:17 PM PDT reply actions  

You can't trade garbage

The reason why we’re talking about these guys is because they still have some value. Someone may find them more useful during a playoff run than the Angels will just playing out the rest of the season. That someone might be willing to cough up something shiny in exchange. The Angels have a lot of problems they need to fix in order to avoid repeating this in 2011.

Mathis, Rodney, Willits, and Wood are garbage. But Kendrick, Abreu, Izturis etc. just might be worth more to someone else than they would be to the Angels.

by Suboptimal on Jul 29, 2010 1:32 PM PDT up reply actions  

I'll hold my breath!

The Devil went down to Georgia, and all I got was this gold fiddle. Go Angels! helpfindscottajob@gmail.com

by Slasher52 on Jul 29, 2010 1:34 PM PDT up reply actions  

A few things

1. Abreu is getting up there in age, so I think we’re worried that we might be seeing the decline. He hasn’t been even average with the glove in several years, so all of his value is tied into his bat. If his bat has started going (and this isn’t just a 4-month slump), then next year could be even worse. Better to trade him now while he still has value than pay him $9 million to putz around right field next year.

2. Howie’s having a rough season, but we haven’t see him go on his hot streak yet. I really think he’s a victim of his own hype.

3. I don’t think anyone here is ripping Izturis.

4. Torii is one of the better players on the team, but he’s being paid $18.5 million and he’s not anywhere near the defensive player he used to be. That’s what’s frustrating. I don’t think it’s realistic to trade him. If we could trade Rivera or Abreu and move him to left (with Bourjos going to center), that would be ideal.

Defending maligned chants since 2009

by Gorbachav5 on Jul 29, 2010 1:55 PM PDT up reply actions  

Howie's a victim of the fact he has no plate discipline

Also a victim of the Soth jerking him around from position to position and all over up and down the order.

Izzy catches criticism for the fact he can’t stay healthy.

NA, #34 SP, LAA
Light up the Halo for Nick!

More Howie please...

by hk47 on Jul 29, 2010 5:04 PM PDT up reply actions  

Howie's plate discipline

It’s always been an issue. People knew it was an issue when they were crowning him as a future batting champion. Believe it or not, his plate discipline has actually improved this season. He’s just not that batting champion and he’s been relatively unlucky this year. He’s fine as an everyday second baseman, and he’s still cheap.

Defending maligned chants since 2009

by Gorbachav5 on Jul 29, 2010 5:29 PM PDT up reply actions  

On a serious note...

We need to trade/sell/retire the rally monkey. His spirit only invokes painful memories of a once exciting team that would not say die and had the ability to shut the door when we were able to scap and claw our way out of any deficit. It must make Torii Hunter super bummed to buy into the rally monkey spirit only to never see the little guys power rear itself other than to get a chuckle and a cheer for the video production team’s latest movie spoof.

la-and-ana.tumblr.com

by Anaheim of Anaheim on Jul 29, 2010 1:25 PM PDT via mobile reply actions  

No

Rally Monkey is here to stay. Even if it doesn’t work to win games, it should still exist to infuriate other teams and their fans.

Torii Hunter has some Brain Movage

by ryanfea on Jul 29, 2010 1:35 PM PDT up reply actions  

Rally Monkey to the 60 DL

he obviously isn’t right and is hiding an injury. 1-46 when behind in the 8th inning? c’mon RM, you’re better than that!

by 2pintsofbooze on Jul 29, 2010 1:37 PM PDT up reply actions   1 recs

No.

The Rally Monkey is NOT the problem. The is THE ONE GREAT THING STILL STANDING from 2002 that represents We, The People. It is the current Halos who have dealt a blow to The Fear that The Monkey can strike in the hearts of the opposing players. Not the other way around.

Now, Buttercup, on the other hand…

"Wastin away again in Minor-Leaguer-Ville..."

by Stirrups on Jul 29, 2010 2:32 PM PDT up reply actions  

The Front Office ran out of lotion!!!!

The last few weeks of chafing loses has exposed what I believed all along. Front Office Stroke Job. For those who paid for the Angels services this season, it’s too bad you didn’t get to finish and get your monies worth.

When I'm not at the stadium, I'd rather be watching my Halos back in Costa Rica!

by Dono Romantico on Jul 29, 2010 1:26 PM PDT reply actions  

but Rivera has to go!

His value midseason is because of the close divisional races.

by BigSnyan on Jul 29, 2010 1:27 PM PDT reply actions  

If only we had kept Jason Dickson...

He has an ERA of 2.15 in a Canadian Men’s Senior League…

The Devil went down to Georgia, and all I got was this gold fiddle. Go Angels! helpfindscottajob@gmail.com

by Slasher52 on Jul 29, 2010 1:30 PM PDT reply actions  

Ha Ha

Hard to believe that he was selcted to the 1997 All Star Game.

Torii Hunter has some Brain Movage

by ryanfea on Jul 29, 2010 1:36 PM PDT up reply actions  

Jose Rosado was the winning pitcher.

Goes to show…ASG means DIDDLY!

The Devil went down to Georgia, and all I got was this gold fiddle. Go Angels! helpfindscottajob@gmail.com

by Slasher52 on Jul 29, 2010 1:40 PM PDT up reply actions  

Canadian Men’s Senior League

Dickson is in the NL Central?

Defending maligned chants since 2009

by Gorbachav5 on Jul 29, 2010 1:57 PM PDT up reply actions  

Rimshot

The Devil went down to Georgia, and all I got was this gold fiddle. Go Angels! helpfindscottajob@gmail.com

by Slasher52 on Jul 29, 2010 1:59 PM PDT up reply actions  

Canadian Men’s Senior League

Dickson is in the NL Central?

Defending maligned chants since 2009

by Gorbachav5 on Jul 29, 2010 1:58 PM PDT up reply actions  

Damn double post

Defending maligned chants since 2009

by Gorbachav5 on Jul 29, 2010 2:29 PM PDT up reply actions  

maybe i'm out of the loop, but i forgot what happened to jepsen??

i saw his birthday was the same as mine the other day :D and i think people have been leaving him out of the bullpen picture. he was good this year, iirc, and then started to do bad and went on the DL

this is our year for real..i really mean it

by AnaheimHalos61 on Jul 29, 2010 1:31 PM PDT reply actions  

Jepsen has made some appearances

he’s usually good for 1 inning in a close game giving up at least a run

by Epic Dean on Jul 29, 2010 1:40 PM PDT up reply actions  

Buster Olney heard we aren't sellers

http://twitter.com/Buster_ESPN/status/19852036215

Then again, Buster is a complete moron.

Torii Hunter has some Brain Movage

by ryanfea on Jul 29, 2010 1:39 PM PDT reply actions  

I read that too

he also says if we do start to sell that Maicer wont be dealt

by Epic Dean on Jul 29, 2010 1:41 PM PDT up reply actions  

Completely agreed

The Devil went down to Georgia, and all I got was this gold fiddle. Go Angels! helpfindscottajob@gmail.com

by Slasher52 on Jul 29, 2010 1:41 PM PDT up reply actions  

I guess that means we're in Garage Sale mode.

Angels baseball. We do what we must, because we can -- HaloDutch

by red floyd on Jul 29, 2010 3:30 PM PDT up reply actions  

I'll make you a great deal on a spoiled mattress...

it’s a pillowtop!

The Devil went down to Georgia, and all I got was this gold fiddle. Go Angels! helpfindscottajob@gmail.com

by Slasher52 on Jul 29, 2010 3:31 PM PDT up reply actions  

Or...

I can offer you a soiled mattress. Whichever you prefer!

The Devil went down to Georgia, and all I got was this gold fiddle. Go Angels! helpfindscottajob@gmail.com

by Slasher52 on Jul 29, 2010 3:33 PM PDT up reply actions  

haha

NA, #34 SP, LAA
Light up the Halo for Nick!

More Howie please...

by hk47 on Jul 29, 2010 5:05 PM PDT up reply actions  

*anyone

2011 WS Champs calling it now. 7/29/10

by AnaheimHalos61 on Jul 29, 2010 1:41 PM PDT up reply actions  

Meh.

I like Oswalt, but I am surprised to see him accept a trade to Philly. Goes from on bandbox to another. At least the Phils are contenders…unlike those miserable Astros.

The Devil went down to Georgia, and all I got was this gold fiddle. Go Angels! helpfindscottajob@gmail.com

by Slasher52 on Jul 29, 2010 1:43 PM PDT up reply actions  

*one bandbox...

The Devil went down to Georgia, and all I got was this gold fiddle. Go Angels! helpfindscottajob@gmail.com

by Slasher52 on Jul 29, 2010 1:43 PM PDT up reply actions  

This looks to be a pretty poor return for Roy Oswalt

Worse even than what the Diamondbacks got for Dan Haren last week. I would say it was a straight-up salary dump, but the Astros are sending along a fair amount of money too. What a disaster of a front office they have there in Houston.

And Philadelphia, what the hell? Why didn’t you just keep Cliff Lee instead of going through all this drama? Hell, the front of their rotation right now could be Halladay, Lee, Oswalt, and Hamels. No one would want to mess with that in the playoffs.

by Suboptimal on Jul 29, 2010 1:49 PM PDT up reply actions  

Me too

Only thing I can think of is that scouts never like the fat kid.

by Suboptimal on Jul 29, 2010 1:59 PM PDT up reply actions  

I hope Wallace only rented and not bought....

I can’t think of a prospect dealt as much as he has been.

The Devil went down to Georgia, and all I got was this gold fiddle. Go Angels! helpfindscottajob@gmail.com

by Slasher52 on Jul 29, 2010 1:56 PM PDT up reply actions  

Cardinals – A’s – Blue Jays – Astros all in less than a year. Yeah, that would be depressing.

Defending maligned chants since 2009

by Gorbachav5 on Jul 29, 2010 1:59 PM PDT up reply actions  

Cantu's a Ranger...

Linky

The Devil went down to Georgia, and all I got was this gold fiddle. Go Angels! helpfindscottajob@gmail.com

by Slasher52 on Jul 29, 2010 2:00 PM PDT reply actions  

They need to get him off the field and on the first flight from SFO to DFW

Go all Joel Youngblood on the A’s…

The Devil went down to Georgia, and all I got was this gold fiddle. Go Angels! helpfindscottajob@gmail.com

by Slasher52 on Jul 29, 2010 2:05 PM PDT up reply actions  

That sucks

But Its only a rental, plus my other team gets some of Texas’s prospects.

by Gokyle45 on Jul 29, 2010 3:16 PM PDT up reply actions  

Kind of an interesting rumor mentioned on MLB Radio.

Torii Hunter to the Rays, B.J. Upton and Jeremy Hellickson to the Angels with the Angels eating most of Torii’s contract.

Doesn’t sound like something the Rays would do at all to me.

by ~MMP~ on Jul 29, 2010 2:16 PM PDT reply actions  

No Chance

Angels aren’t gonna eat all of that money for a guy who is actually productive.

Torii Hunter has some Brain Movage

by ryanfea on Jul 29, 2010 2:32 PM PDT up reply actions  

Eww

Hellickson is definitely a nice get, but I am not at all interested in Upton who has not only been bad the last two years, but is exactly the type of player who would frustrate the hell out of me (tons of talent, very little motivation).

I am also not at all interested in paying Torii Hunter to play for someone else. As much as his defense has declined, he’s still a very good player.

Defending maligned chants since 2009

by Gorbachav5 on Jul 29, 2010 2:33 PM PDT up reply actions  

but I don’t see
Tampa winning a WS.

by phoenix15 on Jul 29, 2010 8:12 PM PDT up reply actions  

Right

I’m going to base my entire opinion on a guy because of 15 games he played one month. Torii’s had stretches that good as well.

Torii’s WAR this year: 1.9
Upton’s WAR this year: 0.7

Torii’s WAR last year: 5.2
Upton’s WAR last year: 1.3

Yes, Upton was better than Torii in 2008 and in 2007. But Upton’s had almost as many at bats being mediocre as he has being good. And those mediocre at bats have come the last two years. I’m not sold that Upton is the player he was in 2007 – 2008.

Defending maligned chants since 2009

by Gorbachav5 on Jul 30, 2010 9:09 AM PDT up reply actions  

I am just saying , Upton is 26, Torii is 35.

Upton makes 3, Torii 18. Upton still has potential upside. Torii is realistically only going to decline.
   The fact that when it counted the most in Ray’s History, he stepped up. Unfortunately for him, it is a team game. Someone could hit 1000 with 15 homeruns, but if the rest of the team doesn’t do enough it wont win a WS.

by Wally's World on Jul 30, 2010 10:59 AM PDT up reply actions  

This is the stupidest fucking thing I've read in at least 3 hours

Who originated it? Come forth so ye can be recognized.

"You gotta have nuts." / "Coming Around 3rd, especially if I'm ticked off, that's going to happen." - Torii Hunter

by Commander_Nate on Jul 29, 2010 3:26 PM PDT up reply actions  

BJ Upton?

You mean we want to trade the one guy with fire in the belly for a malcontent?

Angels baseball. We do what we must, because we can -- HaloDutch

by red floyd on Jul 29, 2010 3:31 PM PDT up reply actions  

He's the throw-in

Hellickson would be the centerpiece. It’s a crazy trade idea, but it would make some baseball sense if not for Desmond Jennings and the terrible PR.

by rghan on Jul 29, 2010 3:37 PM PDT up reply actions  

Torii helped us when we needed him most

during the all-star break. now that the FO has made their money off his smile and persona, he’s useless to them.

if this trade happened I would only be ok with it if Torii went to TB and helped them win the WS. any other outcome and I will complain about it til the day I die…or until Upton decides to hustle.

by 2pintsofbooze on Jul 29, 2010 3:48 PM PDT up reply actions  

It's too crazy to happen

But I agree, it makes sense. The Rays would get a replacement for Carl Crawford, and the Angels would get just about the closest thing there is to a can’t-miss pitching prospect.

The salary is a big issue. The Angels already have sunk $12 million for 2011 on GMJ, and there may be another $12 million going down soon by the name of Scott Kazmir. I don’t care what Reagins says about not having any cost constraints, $24 million is going to hurt. If he sends the Rays salary relief for Hunter, he acknowledges that he overpaid. But at least it would get some money off the books.

Still, I don’t think there’s any getting around the potential PR fiasco of trading your best position player. The Angels have been very fortunate that Torii has played to the level of his contract. But seeing a 34 year-old hit suddenly hitting better than he ever has in his life makes me nervous. He could be totally useless in two seasons.

by Suboptimal on Jul 29, 2010 4:47 PM PDT up reply actions   1 recs

Actually

The more I think about it, the more rational it becomes from the TB perspective. Hunter slides over to left next year, and becomes that right handed bat they’ve been looking for since Pat Burrell.

Hellickson gives the Angels arguably the deepest rotation in the MLB next year, while allowing us to send Kaz to the bullpen. Upton might work out with a change of scenery, or he might not. Regardless, he gives Bourjos some time to get his feet wet in the big leagues. Trout gets here when he gets here.

What was Torii’s money becomes a big chunk of what we pay Crawford this offseason. He, Upton/Bourjos, and Abreu form a super-athletic outfield next year. Maybe we pick up a right-handed hitting DH to recoup some of Torii’s pop, maybe not. Regardless, we have more youth and upside on the club next year.

I am a HUGE fan of Torii, and think that contract was Reagin’s high point as both talent/character evaluator and GM. However, the team built around Torii just came up empty, and we don’t have the resources to put significant new pieces around him next year. Plus, he’s due to decline in the not so distant future.

There would be a tremendous PR hit for the Halos, but this would be a very smart baseball move. Plus, I don’t feel like we’re sticking the knife into a guy we’ve come owe a ton: Torii would go to the playoffs this year, and then wind down this contract as a very important role player on a competitive club, and doesn’t run a big risk of being resented for an albatross contract. I think that’s a win/win.

by rghan on Jul 29, 2010 5:33 PM PDT up reply actions  

Easy to spin this

We signed Torii because he wanted a chance to win. We found a way to make our team better and give Torii a better chance to win the ring he deserves.

This isn't 'Nam. This is bowling. There are rules.

by SalmonStream on Jul 29, 2010 5:41 PM PDT up reply actions  

This is my problem with the proposal

As much as I like Torii and dislike Upton, as a straight up deal it would be fine. But paying most of Torii’s remaining contract does not free up cash to sign Crawford. I could live with paying $10 – $15 million over the next two years, but anywhere above that is too much to pay a quality player to play for someone else.

Defending maligned chants since 2009

by Gorbachav5 on Jul 30, 2010 9:13 AM PDT up reply actions  

It's a solid baseball move

But it seems more likely as an offseason trade than a deadline deal. Teams have time and perspective to think strategy instead of tactics over the winter, and it lessens the blow to the fanbase. I could get behind this decision, but man, it’ would suck to watch the rest of the season without Torii Hunter in the middle of the order.

by Suboptimal on Jul 29, 2010 7:11 PM PDT up reply actions  

No way the Angels do that.

They won’t trade the face of the franchise, especially one who’s in the middle of a slump.

Sounds like wishful thinking from some Rays fans.

Also, I will bring torches and pitchforks to the Angels’ FO if they do something that epically stupid. Bring your green hat.

Light up that halo! RIP, Nick.

by Clutch on Jul 29, 2010 3:49 PM PDT up reply actions  

I agree it probably won't happen

but besides that fact that we’d lose the most entertaining member of the team it is actually a pretty good move. Torii is going to go down the Abreu decline (much Torii’s defense has) any day now and we owe him a lot money. We could possibly turn Torii into a top young pitcher, a headache but better defensive CF and have the money to sign Crawford.
Torii would get a chance to get a ring and that would be pretty special.
I also know this isn’t a really likely situation. The Angels are way too image conscious to do it and the Rays would choke on paying the rest of his contract. Too bad we can’t lend him to them like soccer team.

This isn't 'Nam. This is bowling. There are rules.

by SalmonStream on Jul 29, 2010 5:10 PM PDT up reply actions  

The only real problem I have with the deal is the cash

No way the Angels should pay more than a nominal amount of Torii’s salary. I don’t like Upton, but I’d get over it. And Hellickson is a stud pitcher waiting to happen. But giving up Hunter AND $30 million? No way.

Defending maligned chants since 2009

by Gorbachav5 on Jul 29, 2010 5:31 PM PDT up reply actions  

It’s either
prospects and we pay cash, or they pay cash and no prosepcts.

by phoenix15 on Jul 29, 2010 5:40 PM PDT up reply actions  

More like ~17 mil

10 mil a year for Torii is a bargain, even in his decline phase, and they’ll have Crawford coming off the books.

by rghan on Jul 29, 2010 5:56 PM PDT up reply actions  

Sure

That’s still a bit much for me, but at least you can discuss it at that point.

Defending maligned chants since 2009

by Gorbachav5 on Jul 30, 2010 9:15 AM PDT up reply actions  

Apparently whoever told me this misinterpreted it.

It wasn’t really a trade rumor, more of a discussion of the Rays wanting a bat and what kind of bat the Rays would want to give up Hellickson. At which point, Torii was mentioned.

by ~MMP~ on Jul 29, 2010 8:48 PM PDT up reply actions  

very interesting.

I’d give it some serious thought.

They want power. We want respect...

by SenorChuckles on Jul 29, 2010 9:28 PM PDT up reply actions  

Rosenthal on twitter

Asked #Angels GM Tony Reagins if he was buying or selling. "We’re looking to improve. That’s about as plain as I can put it … (MORE) #MLB

“We’re still looking at opportunities. I got a lot of phone calls today.” With that, Reagins jumped off to take another call. #Angels #MLB

44fan claims that it is a fact Vlad will get hurt. Here is to your "borrowed time" Vlad. You were, are, and will be the man Vlad.

by hauldog on Jul 29, 2010 6:19 PM PDT reply actions  

can someone kill rivera! he sucks!

Faith.... a fan's biggest downfall

by desecrator09 on Jul 29, 2010 7:58 PM PDT reply actions  

Interesting Tweet from SI's Jon Heyman

http://twitter.com/SI_JonHeyman/status/19875972095

Apparently Rodney has more value than Fuentes which strikes me as odd. Maybe the price tag?

Torii Hunter has some Brain Movage

by ryanfea on Jul 29, 2010 8:43 PM PDT reply actions  

The velocity

"jut keep winning babt" - Moondoggy

by Rally Manatee on Jul 30, 2010 4:38 PM PDT up reply actions  

I was waiting for this after the Boston series

As much as it hurts to say this were pretty much done this season. Not only is Texas a great team this year but injuries really killed us. We can only hope they aren’t able to resign Lee and get ready for next year.

One time...

by mikvitu on Jul 29, 2010 8:56 PM PDT reply actions  

I don't have time to read all of these comments.

The shear number of this, a non-game thread, is absolutely incredible!

by wumbug on Jul 29, 2010 9:08 PM PDT reply actions  

NO FRIGGIN WAY!

The Angels don’t appear to have made Bobby Abreu available, according to ESPN.com’s Buster Olney (via Twitter). according to MLBtraderumors.com

WHY o WHY we would not be considering him as a trade option

by IWishWeStillHadTimSalmon on Jul 29, 2010 9:43 PM PDT reply actions  

Let's hope they sweep the Rangers.

but the Angels are going to need a serious winning streak to get back into this thing; they still have 10 games left with Texas.

They want power. We want respect...

by SenorChuckles on Jul 29, 2010 9:46 PM PDT up reply actions  

Here's Olneys tweet
Heard this: No sense yet from rival teams that Bobby Abreu has been made available by the Angels

It doesn’t say he’s not available just that Olney hasn’t heard anything about it. If there is anything we know about Olney it’s that his sources fill him full of shit

by Epic Dean on Jul 29, 2010 10:12 PM PDT up reply actions  

Bout damn time!

Hey HH community, this is my first day! ive been following this blog for quite a while though.

All in all, i feel this year as succesful and a much needed breather. with the acquisition of Haren i think this team will compete all the way in 2011. Is this Hunter talk legit? I dont know where i stand on the trade. would you take the prospectbor salary dump? do we really have the funds for Crawford this OS with all our Arb. cases?

Do you think the padres would be interested in Rivera? I know they need cheap offense and although he is declining, he could fetch something right?

What about fuentes to the red sox or giants? They are both looking for lefty relievers and FR preforms better in a closer roll ( this year so far)anyway so it could work.

" With Haren bolstering the lineup, the Angels are set up beautifully for 2011"- Another East coast biased reporter

by Halos2011champs on Jul 29, 2010 10:24 PM PDT via mobile reply actions  

Welcome!

Hunter talk is not legit. The rest I have my fingers crossed that it would happen.

Torii Hunter has some Brain Movage

by ryanfea on Jul 29, 2010 10:58 PM PDT up reply actions  

Welcome!

Light up that halo! RIP, Nick.

by Clutch on Jul 30, 2010 11:53 AM PDT up reply actions  

Hiya!

"jut keep winning babt" - Moondoggy

by Rally Manatee on Jul 30, 2010 4:42 PM PDT up reply actions  

I don't have much to add to the topic

Except to say I rec’d the thread, since I was shocked to see anything which had generated over 500 replies hadn’t received a rec.

Well done, Brody.

"I can't tell people what to think or not to think. Their perceptions are their perceptions. We just feel we've taken a step forward. At the end of the day, we have to play 162 games. Once that happens then we'll be able to evaluate the offseason moves."~Tony Reagins, on the Angels' offseason

by George Kaplan on Jul 30, 2010 3:05 PM PDT reply actions  

If the Angels can`t get rid of anyone via trade for prospects just figure out a way to dump some of them and spend money on Carl Crawford and Josh Hamilton after thje season ends and they are free agents.Mr. Moreno can spend some of the money he saved by not getting Texeira.I also say that Hatcher must go he has helped no one.

by FredP on Jul 30, 2010 5:38 PM PDT reply actions  

We'll call dibs

"I can't tell people what to think or not to think. Their perceptions are their perceptions. We just feel we've taken a step forward. At the end of the day, we have to play 162 games. Once that happens then we'll be able to evaluate the offseason moves."~Tony Reagins, on the Angels' offseason

by George Kaplan on Jul 30, 2010 11:56 PM PDT up reply actions  

The idea might also be that the Rangers can't afford to pay his arbitration

And so might have to let him go, in which case he’d be a free (no draft picks given up?) free agents.

Also, the Yankees would get him.

Light up that halo! RIP, Nick.

by Clutch on Aug 1, 2010 12:41 PM PDT up reply actions  

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