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Scioscia upstairs, new coaching staff?

This season is close to being a wash for us. The team is heading in the wrong direction, this season, and possibly going forward. I think most here would agree changes need to be made, but I think despite recent frustrations, Mike Scioscia, needs to be apart of the organization going forward. So should Mike Scioscia take over the General Manager duties, and construct a new coaching staff; bringing in some of the stars of the recent past? Would Bengie Molina be a good succesor as manager. Molina and Scioscia share the same catcher insight about the game. Would Darin Erstad bring back some of the intensity that this team is lacking, as bench coach? Could Scioscia let Hatcher "retire gracefully" and bring in Garret Anderson as batting coach and teach our younger players how to hit properly? Would having Scioscia as GM bring us better luck with personnel descesions, and developing prospects. No more Vernon Wells signings. Share your views, and be gentle.

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Scioscia as GM?

Hell NO. I want a guy who knows how to manage a budget. A guy with experience and a proven track record. The angels have such a big payroll, there is no reason why we should be putting a rookie GM in charge.

You may point to Epstein as someone who does not qualify, but at least the dude is smart enough to surround himself with great baseball minds.

Scioscia surrounds himself with Hatcher. Scioscia loves Mathis. Nuff said.

by LosAngel on Aug 17, 2011 11:30 PM PDT reply actions  

He's already the GM...alegedly.

My response to your letter of February 19, 1976, is - kiss my ass.
Sincerely,
Bill Baxley, Attorney General

by sheisalovelyladyandmyapologiestoher on Aug 18, 2011 1:11 AM PDT up reply actions  

Sciosia as GM? You want Hatcher as Manager?

That’s probably what you’d get… the guy is loyal to a fault.

If at first you don't succeed, try the outfield! -- Ed

by eglooney on Aug 20, 2011 2:46 PM PDT up reply actions  

Scioscia as GM

His first move would be to sign our premium catcher long term. 7 years, 60 million for Mathis. No thanks.

"That boy is our last hope" - Obi Wan Scioscia, as Francisco Rodriguez left for the Mets. "No, there is another" - Yoda Reagins.

by RallyMonkey5 on Aug 18, 2011 7:03 AM PDT up reply actions  

If you think that Scioscia did not have maximum input into the current roster construction...

…you’re smoking something.

Scioscia’s impact on the construction of this team is among its greatest weaknesses.

by Turks Teeth on Aug 17, 2011 11:32 PM PDT reply actions   1 recs

How do you know that?

It’s a big assumption, made almost daily by just about everyone, but the only reference I ever found where Scioscia himself mentioned it—-he denied that he has anything to do with roster decisions.

by firebird81 on Aug 18, 2011 6:23 AM PDT up reply actions  

Well, there WAS a question. Firebird81 was questioning it.

I am sure that I can find in the archives other posters here on HH that failed to get those memos.

Against stupidity the very Gods themselves toil in vain.

by Stirrups on Aug 18, 2011 4:11 PM PDT up reply actions  

Somebody knows how to prove a point.

How long will Mike last with all this control?

by King Weaver on Aug 18, 2011 11:06 AM PDT up reply actions  

I think the most alarming thing here is

that Reagins “never played high school baseball”.
That’s terrible. Not to judge because not everyone is athletically gifted, but how can you let someone put together a baseball team with no baseball experience. He was running our minor league system? Expains a bit.

Might not be as big of a deal as I think it is, but it irks me.

"I have one word for you...Be careful."
-Jose Guillen

by IE Angel on Aug 18, 2011 4:26 PM PDT up reply actions  

Meh, the guy who thinks Jeff Mathis contributes positively to the team played quite a bit of baseball.

Pollyanna is dead. But don't get mad at me, I didn't kill her. Tony Reagins did.

by snowhor on Aug 18, 2011 5:35 PM PDT up reply actions   1 recs

I don't think there is anything to it, in regards to Mathis' PT or other PT issues.

But it bothers me personally.
I’ll admit that it is petty of me, but it is what it is.

"I have one word for you...Be careful."
-Jose Guillen

by IE Angel on Aug 18, 2011 5:49 PM PDT up reply actions  

Yeah

I feel you a bit. Epstein aint played no ball and the twerp AA up in Toronto aint either. Besides that the whole games new braintrust is being run by fat four eyed dudes who can’t see their feet much less have ever played ball. Playing high school baseball has little do to with baseball and more to do with culture. The best players in the world actually learn to play the game instead of high school lol…and that tells you everything.

"Keep pushing for us." Ervin Santana after NO-HITTER (July 27, 2011)

by thebigtizzle on Aug 19, 2011 1:54 AM PDT up reply actions  

me tiendes?

"Keep pushing for us." Ervin Santana after NO-HITTER (July 27, 2011)

by thebigtizzle on Aug 19, 2011 1:55 AM PDT up reply actions  

Whoa!!!

I don’t remember any of that hard proof about Scioscia as pseudo-GM. Thanks Turks for compiling all of that in one place. That really makes my life easier; it allows for me to vomit in one, controlled environment without puking all over my house as I read various news reports.

Holy fuck this team is screwed. The only answer is the firing of Reagins and the ascension of a strong GM – hopefully one with SABR tendencies. But, I’m not holding my breath.

Ugh. I’m really happy to be ubër-busy these days so as to avoid these shenanigans.

How does this team win with this offense? Hey, anyone....DRAW A WALK!!!

Jim Scully
Jim Scully Home

by jimmuscomp on Aug 18, 2011 6:35 PM PDT up reply actions  

No.Soth isn't qualified to be a GM.

Whatever you’re smokin’, pass some this way.

YOU DON'T KNOW THE POWER OF THE DARKSIDE.....

by halofolife on Aug 18, 2011 12:02 AM PDT reply actions  

I was ALWAYS a STONEMAN defender

The only decision of his I cannot defend is when he retired.

Oh and Steve Finely and Shea Hillebrand but look at how easily both of those were absorbed.

by Rev Halofan on Aug 18, 2011 12:10 AM PDT reply actions  

GMJ wasn't a bad signing. The CONTRACT sucked, but on the field, and in the clubhouse, he was worthwhile.

On the field, Mathis and Wells are completely useless.

If the Halos don't care about the way they play, then why should I?

by red floyd on Aug 18, 2011 10:36 AM PDT up reply actions  

Huh? Isn't the thing that they sign a CONTRACT?

Pollyanna is dead. But don't get mad at me, I didn't kill her. Tony Reagins did.

by snowhor on Aug 18, 2011 10:57 AM PDT up reply actions  

Dude

they paid him to go away. He was a negative value player over his three years here. He couldn’t hit, his baserunning was awful and he really wasn’t as good a fielder as his reputation suggested. There was nothing about that signing that made any sense whatsoever.

by dmhead on Aug 18, 2011 11:33 AM PDT up reply actions  

Congrats to Vernon Wells

You know you have done something extraordinary when you have fans saying that the GMJ signing “wasn’t a bad signing” even while we are still paying GMJ $12 million not to be on our team this season.

by Brody on Aug 18, 2011 2:29 PM PDT up reply actions   1 recs

I agree with Red Floyd.

Stoneman and Scioscia were duped by GMJr’s saying that he had “finally put it all together”.

No one realized, at the time, that GMJr’s superlatives were all due to HGH, and that the league was about to get deadly serious about steroids.

I’ve mentioned many times here that the Dodgers, Giants, and Rangers were all reported to have offered $30MM/3years and expected to offer four years in negotiations; the Angels got “their man” by offering the fifth year.

The big mistake that was made (in hindsight) was Moreno’s not voiding the contract (which he could have done) after learning of GMJr’s involvement with HGH.

I recall MANY disparaging the signing from the beginning, however I didn’t see it the same way.

by wumbug on Aug 19, 2011 11:16 AM PDT up reply actions  

Stoneman is still around

He didn’t go anywhere. When the team needed to decide Kazmir’s fate, they sent Reagins and Stoneman. And he had plenty of missteps. Finley and GMJ were the most glaring, but there were others as well, if we want to list them all.

by Brody on Aug 18, 2011 11:04 AM PDT up reply actions  

Was?

Stoneman is entrenched in this squad to his knees. They’re all signed on to this squad. How is he retired when he’s there everyday?

"Keep pushing for us." Ervin Santana after NO-HITTER (July 27, 2011)

by thebigtizzle on Aug 19, 2011 2:03 AM PDT up reply actions  

Scioscia is Already the Defacto GM

It was his decision to trade Napoli. That alone disqualifies him from GM consideration. Are you nuts?

by YouthofToday on Aug 18, 2011 12:27 AM PDT reply actions  

No Wucking Fay!

That gentle enough for you?

My response to your letter of February 19, 1976, is - kiss my ass.
Sincerely,
Bill Baxley, Attorney General

by sheisalovelyladyandmyapologiestoher on Aug 18, 2011 1:12 AM PDT reply actions  

PAT GILLICK

PLEASE SAVE US

"F it, let's pitch." - Ervin Santana

by Chzburger Jones on Aug 18, 2011 3:31 AM PDT reply actions  

Let Rev do this shit!

Actually, I would trade HH as our GM in a second if I could. We could make decesions based on polls. Somehow this still sounds more professional than our current option of Arte, Mike and Reagins. The 3 stooges are very good at making us look smart.

by King Weaver on Aug 18, 2011 11:11 AM PDT up reply actions  

I think, if you think about it....

We can all realize how much better the organization is run today than say in the late ’90’s when everything was seat of the pants. I don’t see a team like the one currently on the field being able to hang in there this long in those days because, if nothing else, it seems like there are some real contingency plans out there. Remember losing Jim Edmonds in the beginning of the ’99 season?

by ACE79 on Aug 22, 2011 2:16 PM PDT up reply actions  

Enter Rodger Dorn

… We need a GM plus a third baseman, I don’t see any reason not to jump at this…

by J WEAV Express on Aug 18, 2011 6:43 AM PDT reply actions   1 recs

Given the timeline of the collapse, it looks like Roenicke was the main piece.

We won 100 and 97 in 2008/9 without Black and Joe. But once Ron left, the wheels came off.

If the Halos don't care about the way they play, then why should I?

by red floyd on Aug 18, 2011 10:37 AM PDT up reply actions  

Maybe a different metaphor is applicable.

Maybe Roenicke was the straw that broke the camel’s back.

Against stupidity the very Gods themselves toil in vain.

by Stirrups on Aug 18, 2011 4:12 PM PDT up reply actions  

Personally I think the loss of Maddon was huge...

and the loss of Black hurt as well, but relatively speaking not as much as Maddon since it seems to me that Butcher has developed a good rapport with the staff and his interventions seem to be quite effective.

Roenicke inherited a great roster in Milwaukee. The same can’t be said for Black or Maddon with their teams.

by Jack Frostt on Aug 18, 2011 9:51 PM PDT up reply actions  

I attribute it to the decline and subsequent retirement of Scot Shields

Dude was nails in our bullpen … a serious roadblock to anyone who wanted to score runs against us late in ballgames.

I love this team.

by Downing Rules on Aug 19, 2011 10:59 AM PDT up reply actions  

I attribute it to the decline and subsequent release of Vladimir Guerrero.

One could argue that the best six year stretch in Angels’ history coincides with Guerrero’s time in Anaheim.

by wumbug on Aug 19, 2011 11:23 AM PDT up reply actions  

I agree with both of you

Scot Shields made us great because he was an automatic bridge from the 7th or 8th inning to the 9th inning. Vlad was the only contributor to an offense that, without him, would have looked a lot like this one in every year except 2009 (when Figgins somehow had his miracle season and everyone hit .300).

by Brody on Aug 19, 2011 12:10 PM PDT up reply actions  

Rec'd.

And now we’re missing our chance to fully leverage the contributions of Weaver and Haren.

Pollyanna is dead. But don't get mad at me, I didn't kill her. Tony Reagins did.

by snowhor on Aug 19, 2011 1:38 PM PDT up reply actions  

I think Stoneman was a VERY good GM....

even if he gets criticism for being conservative. He made many very good moves in his tenure and built the team…..how come nobody remembers that he fired his scouting director over a personality conflict?

by ACE79 on Aug 22, 2011 2:18 PM PDT up reply actions  

Absolutely not

This team needs less of Scioscia’s roster influence, not more. The team needs someone in the GM’s office who will tell Mike “no” and “you’re wrong” when he insists on things that aren’t backed up by stats or other facts.

If we had someone with balls like that, Wells would never even have been considered as an acquisition, Mathis would have been sent packing at least two years ago, Napoli would be still be here or have been traded for a player that made sense, and Conger would be part of our catching corps.

Scioscia is pretty good at managing things on the field, but recent moves indicate that he should be kept at arm’s length from the FO.

Scioscialist Party of America - Redistributing your defense since 2000.

by Commander_Nate on Aug 18, 2011 8:56 AM PDT reply actions  

Is that "seen" 4000 games, or "played" 4000 games

Clearly, one answer is far more desirable than the other…..

by mustard_man on Aug 18, 2011 10:16 AM PDT up reply actions  

If those are the qualifications

Then please, someone, get him interested in the quarterback position. Quick.

by eyespy on Aug 18, 2011 3:09 PM PDT up reply actions  

I like Soth

but he’s too stubborn to be a GM and he needs to focus more on coaching. We need a real GM with brass balls like Cashman in NYY and AP something in TOR.

Vernon Wells / #10 / LAA / LF 2011-2014
2011 - $23M
2012 - $21M
2013 - $21M
2014 - $21M

by dan73962 on Aug 18, 2011 9:35 AM PDT reply actions  

Anthopolous

Because of that one man, the Toronto Blue Jays are going to be an unstoppable force very soon. In the last two seasons, the dude has acquired Colby Rasmus, a young Canadian star for Canada’s only team in Brett Lawrie, and signed Bautista to an extension, while dumping the awful contracts of Wells and Rios for virtually nothing. In all of his moves, the Blue Jays have only really lost one impact player from their own roster in Shaun Marcum. Even that was to get Lawrie, who looks to be a force and a fan favorite for years.

Couple their GM’s shrewd and ruthless methods with the a deep-pocketed ownership that isn’t paying for Wells and Rios anymore and the Blue Jays have a bright future ahead of them.

Scioscialist Party of America - Redistributing your defense since 2000.

by Commander_Nate on Aug 18, 2011 10:00 AM PDT up reply actions  

That was just his way of having a blowout celebration

After pretty much winning the Lotto.

Scioscialist Party of America - Redistributing your defense since 2000.

by Commander_Nate on Aug 18, 2011 10:26 AM PDT up reply actions  

Hey, we get a B-type supplemental pick from Francisco

and by giving Molina the backup time at C Napoli would have taken up he’s also made it up to B status. Napoli for a year of passable setup work and two picks has worked out well enough.

by TtD on Aug 18, 2011 10:51 AM PDT up reply actions  

Worded like that, you have a point.

I’d probably still prefer Naps over a passable setup and two possible picks, knowing how well [or poorly] picks can be. Might also be due to me expecting some kind of Napoli for Pujols trade. Wouldn’t be surprised.

by TheKingfish on Aug 18, 2011 11:12 AM PDT up reply actions  

Aye, Napoli would have been a lot of value, not arguing that

We didn’t come out best in the trade, but if that’s the worst thing to happen we’re laughing. Thinking on it Encarnacion is also a type B now at DH/1B picking up Napoli’s other playing time, so in theory it’s allowed for three supplementals. Just can’t see AA not picking up E5s $3.5million option now he’s hitting better than .900OPS+ since early June, scarily he’s now a valuable piece.

by TtD on Aug 18, 2011 11:16 AM PDT up reply actions  

Want to trade AA over here? We can give you your gold glove CF back, plus a premium catcher.

Worth a shot, anyway. I’m kind of excited seeing how the AL East will play out in the next few years, the Jays are poised for success. Hoping they can upset the Yanks/Sox a few times.

by TheKingfish on Aug 18, 2011 11:33 AM PDT up reply actions  

I'm afraid we're deep at catcher

Having the best defensive catcher (with no offense) in the minors in Jeroloman just means we have no spot for Mathis :D

by TtD on Aug 18, 2011 11:36 AM PDT up reply actions  

Trading Naps after the Golden Fleece trade were in his plans all along

He had to cleanse his hands of the dirty deed to keep the heat off his back.

Don’t see much hard feelings towards Alex from the HH crowd. We are hating on Tony, the stRangers, Mathis, and Soth.

by eyespy on Aug 18, 2011 3:33 PM PDT up reply actions  

Yep, he's the new boy genius on the block

The Wells trade was a heist, obviously, but what impressed me about AA was him letting Kenny Williams scoop up Rios for nothing. You think Reagins & co. would have the balls to let someone take Torii off their hands if he got claimed on waivers? No way.

by dmhead on Aug 18, 2011 10:26 AM PDT up reply actions  

Mike's ego drives the ship into the ground.

He then points to his players as the reason for his failure. Sure they are the ones that win and lose the games, but I cant imagine it

by King Weaver on Aug 18, 2011 11:17 AM PDT reply actions  

getting much worse than a front office who cant admitt mistakes.

by King Weaver on Aug 18, 2011 11:17 AM PDT reply actions  

Just when I think I couldn't read anything dumber, you write this...

And totally redeem yourself!!!!!

High five!

Pollyanna is dead. But don't get mad at me, I didn't kill her. Tony Reagins did.

by snowhor on Aug 18, 2011 1:21 PM PDT reply actions  

How about a GM who has a history of being a GM and had success?

Why not hire someone smart who gets the most out of their payroll instead of someone who uses $140 million to play .500 ball?

Is there any precedent for a GM spending money as inefficiently as the Angels have been?

I have no expectations of this team until Arte wises up to what it takes to run a baseball team correctly. Overpay Andrew Friedman and see what he can do with Arte’s resources.

RIP Nick Adenhart

by ihearhowie2.0 on Aug 18, 2011 2:57 PM PDT reply actions  

Omar Minaya comes to mind as a pretty crappy GM.

He constantly overpaid, and valued veteran FA’s. But yeah, given our payroll, we are friggin’ pathetic.

YOU DON'T KNOW THE POWER OF THE DARKSIDE.....

by halofolife on Aug 18, 2011 4:18 PM PDT up reply actions  

How about a new GM system entirely?

A bunch of the major European soccer leagues have teams where the season ticket holders vote every 4 years for a new GM. If he is making bad decisions then they can vote in a new guy. I think the Seattle Sounders in the MLS have taken on this system as well.
I am not a season ticket holder currently ( I was for 3 years when Vlad was on the team but have since stopped renewing) but I would jump at the opportunity to have an impact on the team that I love and invest time and money into as well.

by Halosurf on Aug 18, 2011 3:40 PM PDT reply actions  

I believe the owner does

He could have a self appointed adviser or two and they could choose a list of a handful of candidates. Those candidates would then have to appeal to the fanbase with their solutions to whatever problems are with the franchise. While the current GM would only have his body of work for the last 4 years to speak for his claim to the job.

by Halosurf on Aug 18, 2011 5:21 PM PDT up reply actions  

So Arte creates a list of

1. Tony Reagins
2. Frank McCourt

go.

Against stupidity the very Gods themselves toil in vain.

by Stirrups on Aug 18, 2011 6:42 PM PDT up reply actions  

Touché

Yeah well, its not perfect but its better than who we have. It’s a lot like the United States electoral college system and we still elected W for 8 years… I can’t see Reagins getting re-elected at least.

by Halosurf on Aug 18, 2011 8:37 PM PDT up reply actions  

McCourt

As long as he had no control over his own salary (or his wifes)

by LosAngel on Aug 18, 2011 10:19 PM PDT up reply actions  

I believe that Scioscia could very well be named GM of the Angels after his managing career.

If not GM, then certainly VP of something. I agree that he is already the defacto GM, with counsel from Stoneman.

I don’t share the hate for Scioscia expressed by many. I’m proud that he’s “our guy”.

Remember, Moreno said at the very beginning that he believes in building an Angels “family” and an Angels “tradition”. Recall also that the fabled Dodger organization is his model. Even Lasorda was named VP after his managing days.

Possible candidates to eventually replace Scioscia as manager include DiSarcina, Erstad, even Mathis (yes, I believe). I suspect that since Stoneman had gained a reputation of “overvaluing” his prospects in trade discussions, it was convenient that their Director of Player Development be promoted to GM at a time when having serious discussions with the likes of Ken Williams and Omar Minaya might be trendy, if not pivotal.

If the Angels find a way to rally to miraculously win the AL West, I think Reagins will get a pass. Otherwise, I have to suspect that someone will have to officially take the heat for the Kazmir and Wells (looked good at the time) deals. I don’t believe that person will be Scioscia.

by wumbug on Aug 19, 2011 12:15 PM PDT reply actions  

Re: "the Kazmir and Wells (looked good at the time) deals"

Looked good at the time? I don’t remember this being the case. Were we all drunk at the time of these trades? That’s just about the only way either trade looks good.

Pollyanna is dead. But don't get mad at me, I didn't kill her. Tony Reagins did.

by snowhor on Aug 19, 2011 1:42 PM PDT up reply actions  

I don't have a problem understanding the mindset when both of these deals were made.

I’m not sure about everyone else, but I may, or may not, have been drunk. I still understand the mindset when both of the deals were made.

by wumbug on Aug 19, 2011 2:53 PM PDT up reply actions  

I think we all understand the mindset used to make the deals.

And that’s reason 1 to fire Tony Reagins.

Pollyanna is dead. But don't get mad at me, I didn't kill her. Tony Reagins did.

by snowhor on Aug 19, 2011 3:29 PM PDT up reply actions  

the Kaz deal didn't look too bad

but the VW deal was atrocious from the second it was first reported.

also, I don’t think Scioscia will ever be GM. some high ranking VP in the FO, maybe, but never GM. He’ll stay in the dugout as long as is humanly possible.

"You realize that Ive been posting on AN since 07 on this name and I am one of the most rec'ed posters there right?" - Some douche named DFA from AN

by 2pintsofbooze on Aug 23, 2011 9:32 AM PDT up reply actions  

Ebel or Pic

Sciosc won’t manage forever, and after Maddon, Ebel I think is a likely candidate and a guy I’d love to see managing our team. Seeing him around Tempe in the spring, he’s a guy I’d hate to lose.

Another successor candidate who is doing a great job quietly in his first full season is Kirk Gibson, and he’d do a better job in standing up to Scioscia the GM than any of his former coaches.

And that which has already been stated, Scioscia and Stoneman are already and to this day, more than equal co-GMs with Reagins. Stoneman is there on the field each morning in the spring, he hasn’t gone anywhere.

I’m glad Scioscia can manage this team basically as long as he wants, and hope he at least stays long enough to fulfill his contract. While I don’t remember their first seasons, I am old enough to remember the Rigney era and every manager since then, so any one who wishes we had some one else on the field is nuts. Mike has his faults but remains the best in the game.

by Rex Fregosi on Aug 25, 2011 9:45 PM PDT reply actions  

ebel is an idot

windmill style 3rd base coaching wont get it done

Somewhere, right now, Mickey Hatcher is ruining a swing.

by Quinlan's Goofy Swing on Aug 26, 2011 11:25 PM PDT reply actions  

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