LEGIT Nationals Trade Proposal
by cougwilly on Feb 7, 2012 11:24 AM PST
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PrintOk, so the Nationals stuff has been thrown around a lot. I hate the Lannan for Bourjos straight-up trade as much as everyone. However, I do think there is on possible trade proposal that could benefit both parties. It would take a little more work of JeDi's part, but I wouldn't mind it happening.
The Nationals have been shopping Ian Desmond, but I hope the Angels don't want to touch the guy. I would like to see them offer Bourjos for Danny Espinosa and Tyler Clippard. Espinosa could move over to SS (his natural position) and could fill that hole for years to come (he isn't arb eligible until 2014 and won't be a FA until 2017). He doesn't hit for great average (slash line .236/.323/.414 last year), but he does have pop (21 HRs) and he can steal bases (17 out of 23). He plays good D too. Clippard would slide in as a very solid 7th/8th inning option. Aybar's OPS was only 6 points above Espinosa's last year and Espinosa will only get better. He won't ever be a high average guy (.270 average in minors), but he could sit in the .250 range and he gets on base at a solid clip.
The Nationals want Rendon to move to 2B with Espinosa sliding to short, but if they want a top tier CF, they aren't going to be able to only dangle Rendon.
The Angels could turn around and move Aybar for some very good prospects. Lots of teams are in need of SS help (perhaps the Red Sox - Aybar for Will Middlebrooks?), and he could help restock the farm system.
What do you guys think? Would you move Bourjos for Espinosa and Clippard?
This Fan-Post is authored by an independent fan. Tell us what you think and how you feel.
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"I have something 95 percent of all those All-Stars only wish they had: a World Series ring. If I had to choose between that and being an All-Star, it would be no contest. I’d grab the gold ring and never look back." -Tim Salmon
Fellow Bruin
I figured you were a Cougar…
"I have something 95 percent of all those All-Stars only wish they had: a World Series ring. If I had to choose between that and being an All-Star, it would be no contest. I’d grab the gold ring and never look back." -Tim Salmon
Leach was a great hire
As a college football fan I am glad he back coaching
Willits? Check. Reagins? Check. Mathis? Check
I am excited about Leach...mostly as a pac 12 fan tho
I went to BYU, so different Cougars. Too many same names nowadays.
As a fellow Coug, I love the Pac-12
Nothing better than watching USC et.al. beat up on Utah.
Is it Trout time yet?
You had the room thinking you went to Stiffler's Mom State University
or the University of Foxfire.
"Sometimes when I reflect on all the beer I drink, I feel ashamed. Then I look into the glass and think about the workers in the brewery and all of their hopes and dreams. If I didn’t drink this beer, they might be out of work and their dreams would be shattered. I think, ‘It is better to drink this beer and let their dreams come true than be selfish and worry about my liver.’" ~Babe Ruth
What is it with the "trade Bourjos" posts?
Yeah, let’s trade one of the most exciting players on the team. That’s a winner. Leave Bourjos alone.
I might support a trade involving Aybar, Abreu, or Callaspo – depending on what’s being offered. But everyone else (other than a couple of pitchers) is off-limits as far as I’m concerned.
A wise man does not need advice and a fool won't take it.
by angelslogic on Feb 7, 2012 11:34 AM PST reply actions 3 recs
Bourjos is overrated by Angels fans
He is exciting to watch. I like the kid. But, like all players, he is an investment for the team. When an investment is overvalued, you sell. I think Bourjos is a sell-high option for the right price.
Bourjos is a baseball player, not an ETF.
A wise man does not need advice and a fool won't take it.
by angelslogic on Feb 7, 2012 12:16 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Everyone is an ETF. At least, that's how I look at every player and position
It’s all about value.
by cougwilly on Feb 7, 2012 12:18 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
You're right...sorry Petey. Good player, great year, and
I’ll always root for him. Just not as crazy for him as some.
Wrong
It’s all about value and how it fits onto your roster. Borjous and his glove fit perfectly on this team and it’s flyball-heavy pitching staff. Torii is also a free agent after this year and Vernon Wells will very likely continue to suck. Having Trout and Petey in the same outfield for the next decade seems to be more “valuable” than getting some reliever and middle infielder (whom we already have in spades).
by dmhead on Feb 8, 2012 9:38 AM PST up reply actions 3 recs
Trumbo's the only sell-high option right now.
He probably won’t ever repeat his 2011 performance. Bourjos has a much better chance of putting up 2011 numbers again.
Winning doesn't matter. –Lyle
by 5thStarter on Feb 7, 2012 12:17 PM PST up reply actions 3 recs
Concern for me with Bourjos is his high BABIP
But a lot of that is likely due to his speed. And because of his elite defense, he still brings tremendous value even if he slightly regresses.
by stevefinleyallstars on Feb 7, 2012 12:18 PM PST up reply actions
During his time in the minors..
…he put up BABIPs ranging from .326 – .364. I wouldn’t expect too much regression.
I see red people
by The Limey on Feb 7, 2012 12:50 PM PST up reply actions 2 recs
And more to the point...
…why would you expect regression? Players of 24 are usually on an upward swing, are they not?
I see red people
That's a good point
I suppose they worry me more because they lack a big league track record
by stevefinleyallstars on Feb 7, 2012 3:06 PM PST up reply actions
That's a product of his speed
He’ll always have a high BABIP
What we've got here is a failure to communicate.
Follow the Chicken on Twitter
by SportsChicken on Feb 8, 2012 2:32 PM PST up reply actions
Rec'd.
Though, I’d add Vernon Wells as a sell-high option right now as well. If only there were buyers.
The only thing VW did differently last year than the year before, besides inflate his stats by playing half his games in Toronto, is buy into the Scioscia/Hatcher philosophy that a walk is as good as an out. 2011: .218/.248/.412. 2010(road stats): .224/.299/.400.
Why couldn't Trumbo hit that way?
He improved over the course of the whole season and adjusted to pitchers adjusting to him. And now he has an anchor in the lineup to take off the pressure of being the team’s leading producer and a new hitting coach in the same person. I think he sticks at least for a while.
by Halowitz on Feb 7, 2012 5:44 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
Yeah, who knows what this new lineup will provide for Trumbo?
The low OBP/fairly bad plate discipline, blah, blah, blah, is my main concern.
Winning doesn't matter. –Lyle
coug says Bourjos is overrated
but I say Trumbo is underrated. At every level of his professional career, he has performed above expectations. He did it again in the MLB in his rookie season, and people like you are STILL saying he’s not that great. I hope he proves you wrong for 20 years and ends up in the Hall. And I really hope he does it as an Angel.
Where were you on December 8th, 2011 - Pujols Day?
by Rally Manatee on Feb 10, 2012 10:23 AM PST up reply actions
Easy, Manatee.
Obviously, I want him to do well and continue to prove his critics wrong.
All I said is he “probably” won’t repeat his 2011 performance. I never said he’s “not that great”.
Winning doesn't matter. –Lyle
Bourjos has a league average bat that is only going to improve and is the is the best defender at a key defensive position
THE BEST DEFENDER in baseball. Think about that for a minute. The absolute best at playing his position, by a large margin, in fact.
Our team is built around pitching. Sure we have pujols now, but the thing that will win this team games is the starting pitching. Bourjos in CF makes our pitchers better. Unless we get an overwhelming proposal, you dont move that guy. Even if Bourjos never develops into a leadoff hitter and he is just a superfast 7 or 8 hitter, he is a ridiculously valuable asset.
by Balls and Strikes on Feb 7, 2012 12:50 PM PST up reply actions 8 recs
If the Nats need an OF
Then they can trade for Vernon Wells and 50% of his remaining salary. The Angels send Wells and $31.5 million to the Nats, leaving them with a 3-year contract for $31.5 million. The Nats do not have to send us anything back. That is a legit win-win trade.
whats up with wanting to trade Bourjos? i dont get it
by KB_24 on Feb 7, 2012 11:37 AM PST reply actions 5 recs
Rec'd.
And I wonder what tomorrow Bourjos trade proposal fanpost will be.
The only thing VW did differently last year than the year before, besides inflate his stats by playing half his games in Toronto, is buy into the Scioscia/Hatcher philosophy that a walk is as good as an out. 2011: .218/.248/.412. 2010(road stats): .224/.299/.400.
well people want him a lot
I think that should tell us a lot that we already know. Keep Pete.
Don't call me Bugs. Although Bugs Bunny could do it all on the baseball field.
So basically....
the idea is that the trade would go through and we would have Trout in CF with VW and Torii flanking him and our infield would be even more logjammed than it already is and we still wouldnt have a place on our lineup for Kendrys and Trumbo. Yeah I’m gonna pass on it.
When I flip a coin I dont say heads or tails, I say Halos or Spurs
I would never make that trade
Espinosa is terrible sorry I don’t see the love in him besides the fact that he hit 21 home runs. Clippard would be a terrific addition but Bourjos who plays everyday is hell of a lot more valuable than Clippard who pitches every other day for one inning. A guy who can a) hit double digit homeruns, doubles, triples, and double digit steals easily and b) play the best defense in the outfield at least in the AL. I don’t see any logic in trading Bourjos unless it’s for Starsburg, Harper, Zimmerman, or Rendon
Kendrys wins 2012 AL Comeback Player of the year
by Morales8 on Feb 7, 2012 11:40 AM PST reply actions 1 recs
I suggested Rendon before
But most people believe no way the Nats would do it. The other 3 are untouchable.
I don't actually mean trading Bourjos
for any of those guys I just justifying my point. It’s called sarcasm
Kendrys wins 2012 AL Comeback Player of the year
legit???
ummm no
me and the wonder dog got high!
by YOUknowulovetheIE on Feb 7, 2012 11:54 AM PST via mobile reply actions
he didnt say legit.... he said LEGIT
so it must be, did you see the caps?
When I flip a coin I dont say heads or tails, I say Halos or Spurs
by ItCouldHappen on Feb 7, 2012 11:59 AM PST up reply actions
What does LEGIT stand for?
I’m thinking Latest Example of Grotesquely Idiotic Trade?
by WhatShouldIThrowToday? on Feb 7, 2012 2:30 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
If I'm DiPoto and the Nats call regarding Bourjos,
I say “Zimmerman or GTFO.”
And even then I’m not in love with that move
by stevefinleyallstars on Feb 7, 2012 12:04 PM PST reply actions
5.0 WAR for a player in his first full year
Yeah, totally overrated.
by stevefinleyallstars on Feb 7, 2012 12:07 PM PST up reply actions 5 recs
numbers almost identicle to what Ellsbury put up in his age 24 season.....
and better defense than Ellsbury…. but yeah dude, totally overrated
When I flip a coin I dont say heads or tails, I say Halos or Spurs
by ItCouldHappen on Feb 7, 2012 12:08 PM PST up reply actions 2 recs
You'd be trading a guy w/ a 5.0 WAR
for Espinosa (3.5 WAR) and Clippard (1.2 WAR). Trout slides in for Bourjos w/ a higher estimated WAR and Espinosa takes over for Aybar in the long term. Then we can drop some of the young arms that aren’t going anywhere in our BP. Overall, I don’t see a drop in WAR.
Here's the deal though,
Espinosa has 3.5 WAR as a shortstop, we have a shortstop right now with 4 WAR, so all we are doing is creating a logjam while trading a great defensive CF who I think has Ellsbury potential
When I flip a coin I dont say heads or tails, I say Halos or Spurs
by ItCouldHappen on Feb 7, 2012 12:21 PM PST up reply actions
ellsbury potential
Minus the HR numbers
me and the wonder dog got high!
by YOUknowulovetheIE on Feb 7, 2012 12:25 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
Compare the stats,
in 2008 Ellsbury was 25, his line was .280/.336/.394
in 2011 Bourjos was 24, his line was .271/.327/.438
Ellsbury hit 9 Homers, Bourjos hit 12 last season……
Obviously every situation is different and trajectories change and some players reach their peaks later than others, but regardless, I would say that Bourjos has Ellsbury potential, especially if he works on his patience
When I flip a coin I dont say heads or tails, I say Halos or Spurs
by ItCouldHappen on Feb 7, 2012 12:32 PM PST up reply actions
Ellsbury is on roids
Minor League Ball's 2010 Rookie of the Year Poster
If you didn't know by now, my screen name is sarcastic
by mathisrocks5 on Feb 7, 2012 12:33 PM PST up reply actions 2 recs
he might be
wouldnt surprise me. regardless though I hold out hope that bourjos can be a 300 hitter with 15-20 hrs
When I flip a coin I dont say heads or tails, I say Halos or Spurs
by ItCouldHappen on Feb 7, 2012 12:35 PM PST up reply actions
Ellsbury plays in a park perfectly suited for him
Bourjos doesn’t. His HR numbers will never come close to Ellsbury’s last year. If Bourjos puts up the same numbers every year, I’ll be ecstatic. I’m just not sure he will.
Ellsbury hit more HRs on the road than in Boston last year
17 to 15. He could homer no matter what park he was in. Bourjos actually hit more HRs in Anaheim than he did on the road suggesting that the big A might not be that detrimental to his style.
I agree in all likelihood Bourjos wont hit 30 HRs (I doubt Ellsbury ever comes close to that again) however, I doubt seeing him hit 20 is out of the question and furthermore, I doubt him getting his average up to 300 is out of the question,
When I flip a coin I dont say heads or tails, I say Halos or Spurs
by ItCouldHappen on Feb 7, 2012 12:42 PM PST up reply actions
i can see ellsbury
Hitting 30 again.. the home/road HR were shocking to me. His quick upper cut swing is what makes me think he could do it again.
me and the wonder dog got high!
by YOUknowulovetheIE on Feb 7, 2012 12:56 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
so what you're saying is Bourjos will hit more triples instead of HRs
I’m cool with that
"You realize that Ive been posting on AN since 07 on this name and I am one of the most rec'ed posters there right?" - Some tool named Designatedforassignment from Athletics Nation
by 2pintsofbooze on Feb 7, 2012 1:02 PM PST up reply actions
same here
me and the wonder dog got high!
by YOUknowulovetheIE on Feb 7, 2012 1:10 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
Or you could wait a year and have Trout and Bourjos
Reagins effed this up; Trout should be a shoe-in to start. The correct move is to start Trout in LF and bench Wells. Since that won’t happen we’re likely stuck with Trout in Salt Lake until 2013.
by stevefinleyallstars on Feb 7, 2012 12:21 PM PST up reply actions
Agreed.
We should have signed Beltre and stayed away from Wells imo.
yeah I think most people think we should have stayed away from Wells
When I flip a coin I dont say heads or tails, I say Halos or Spurs
by ItCouldHappen on Feb 7, 2012 12:42 PM PST up reply actions
I wish one of those people was Tony Reagins
by stevefinleyallstars on Feb 7, 2012 12:47 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
sigh.....
When I flip a coin I dont say heads or tails, I say Halos or Spurs
by ItCouldHappen on Feb 7, 2012 12:48 PM PST up reply actions
No.
Forget Beltre.
We should have kept Rivera and Napoli…No VWells deal. End of story. Do nothing else.
Things would have worked themselves out wonderfully.
Callaspo at 3B. Trumbo/Napoli at 1B. Trout (eventually) in LF. We’d still be left with the same dilemma of what to do with all our 1Bmen, JRivera would have played out his contract, and we wouldn’t be stuck with VWells’ contract. We would have had financial flexibility then and now, we would probably have finished higher than we did last season with Napoli on our team (not the Rangers’), we would have Trout opening in LF in 2012 with Trumbo and JMoore as back-ups, Napoli would be in his final season (before ultimately being jettisoned to free agency) splitting duties at catcher, 1B, DH, and bench, Trumbo would be 1B, RF, DH, and bench, Morales would still be starting in AAA while waiting for Abreu or someone else to hit the DL, and Izturis would be playing out his final year of contract with the Angels as Segura and Amarista finish polishing their skills.
In hind sight, they should have jettisoned BWood before the season started (to make my scenario work), or Conger could have started in AAA.
Sometimes, no action is the right action. Leave Bourjos alone.
I’m not a VWells hater, but things would have worked out so much better if that trade had not been made.
by wumbug on Feb 7, 2012 1:55 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
where is pujols in this scenerio?
When I flip a coin I dont say heads or tails, I say Halos or Spurs
by ItCouldHappen on Feb 7, 2012 2:01 PM PST up reply actions
1B for the Angels in 2012.
…with the Angels wondering what to do with Trumbo and Morales…..just like right now.
I’m going with the scenario that everything is the same except the Wells/Rivera/Napoli trade.
2012 is Napoli’s last year of arbitration eligibility. He’ll be expensive in 2012, moreso afterward. The Angels would have to decide what to do with him now (just like they had to make a decision last year)…..without the weight of the Wells contract on their backs.
O ok,
Yeah its a nice thought but to be devil’s advocate, does Tony Reagins get fired if not for the VW trade? and if he doesnt get fired does he pull the strings to get pujols and CJ? if the trade doesnt go through does ownership feel the need to pursue pujols and CJ or do they just try to sure up the bullpen rather than making runs at game changers.
I mean all things the same it would be nice, its just highly unlikely that the positive happens without the negative first happening
When I flip a coin I dont say heads or tails, I say Halos or Spurs
by ItCouldHappen on Feb 7, 2012 3:57 PM PST up reply actions
I think that if the Wells trade had not occurred, we would have finished higher than what we finished, without the weight of The Contract.
Therefore, I think Reagins would probably have kept his job. Even with the trade, if we had won the division, I think Reagins would probably have kept his job. This last scenario suggests that VWells played and produced as expected.
Neither Reagins nor Dipoto would have made the Pujols deal. I believe that was all Moreno. Which GM in his right mind is going to offer anyone $250MM/10 years? Sure, either one of them would show interest and make the “company” offer, but Moreno used every bit of salesmanship inside him to make the deal happen.
I’d like to think that Moreno would have gone after Pujols energetically enough to get the deal done if the Angels had won the division last season. If the VWells trade had not occurred, leaving additional financial flexibility, plus the advent of the new TV contract, he certainly could have more comfortably offered the same contract. So, with the mindset that he (Moreno) was going to dominate baseball not only in the AL West, but also in the LA area for the forseeable future…..Yes, Moreno (Reagins) signs Pujols.
Moreno made a 5 minute phone call.
It was the 20 year commitment that got the deal done, and it was Arte’s frustration at the past couple of years that signed that $250M promise.
Part of me is fine with the past two years because I think that’s the only way the next ten years happen.
"It is a haunted game in which every player is measured against the ghosts of all who have gone before."
I've had a feeling
that Pujols wanted to be an Angel. Playing for a Hispanic owner, Playing at a really nice ball park, living in SoCal and 250 million reasons to go to Cooperstown with an A on his hat than a STL
RIP Nick Adenhart 4/9/09
I blog about the Angels at First2Third.net
I hoped it would happen, the fact we were one of 3 places he had on his list of places he could be traded was enough for me to get my hopes up this time last year
by Balls and Strikes on Feb 10, 2012 2:37 PM PST up reply actions
Where did you hear that about Pujols?
I can’t find anything on the google.
Winning doesn't matter. –Lyle
Does Reagins get CJ?
Yes.
CJ wanted $80MM/5 years (or more), or something like that. He wanted to play for the Angels. He (his agent) was playing smart-ass hardball to accomplish the desired result.
Reagins (not knowing how to not spend money) would have offered the $60MM/4years, then the $75/5years as per Moreno’s OK, and then would have given CJ 24 hours to accept or decline. CJ would have come back for the extra $5MM with Reagins, just like he did with Dipoto. I cannot believe that even Reagins would have the nerve to squash a potential deal that big by not going back to Moreno one last time for an extra $5MM. Moreno, having the calmer and cooler head, would have told Reagins how to negotiate the midpoint of $5MM with CJ.
CJ probably would have taken the $75MM/5years anyway, having concluded that the Angels were going to sign Pujols. (Dipoto was obviously burned out with no sleep). Who wouldn’t want to get on that train over a measley $5MM when you’re already offered $75MM? On top of that, we split the difference.
Good points with CJ
I still question if Moreno would have opened his wallet wide enough for both pujols and Wilson if the angels had done better last season. I think he would have gone after small acquisitions under the guideline of if it aint broke dont fix it
When I flip a coin I dont say heads or tails, I say Halos or Spurs
by ItCouldHappen on Feb 7, 2012 6:02 PM PST up reply actions
Yes, but............
There has been all this talk about kicking the Dodgers while they’re down….
before they get back up and whip our ass(es).
It makes sense to me that Moreno knows that whoever the new ownership of the Dodgers are, they will be looking to come back to reclaim their LA territory with a vengence. Due to the new TV contract, there will never be a better time in what’s left of Moreno’s lifetime to put his foot on the accelerator to achieve all of what he has ever dreamed regarding LAAngels dominance in the LA marketplace. Remember, if not for The Contract, Moreno would likely have even more flexibility.
OK, but...
…what if the Man from UNCLE could go back in time and help General Patton at the Battle of the Bulge with laser weapons?
"Outside of a dog, a book is man's best friend. Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read" ~Groucho Marx
by George Kaplan on Feb 7, 2012 8:23 PM PST up reply actions
If a bullfrog had hip pockets,
he’d carry a six-shooter!
You underestimate the value of a good GM
Read Sam Miller’s article on how these deals went down and how much effort it took to recruit Wilson. Without naming names, Wilson’s agent said there was no way Wilson would have signed with the Angels if the GM had been anyone other than JeDi.
When Reagins signed Hunter, there was no recruiting at all. He gave Hunter’s agent 3 hours to accept or reject the offer. I doubt that would have landed us Pujols or Wilson.
by Brody on Feb 8, 2012 6:42 AM PST via mobile up reply actions
Brody, I'm not arguing any of your points. I'm just explaining what I believe.
I very much appreciate the value of a good GM, and I see Dipoto as a better GM than Reagins. However, I don’t necessarily buy the story from CJ’s agent saying that he would not have signed with the Angels had Dipoto not been the GM…That’s lawyer/salesman BS (Takes one to know one). I believe that as much as CJ wanted to play for the Angels (at his price), his belief that Pujols was signing with the Angels, coupled with Arte’s money, is what sealed the deal….not Dipoto’s magic.
I remember the Reagins/Torii deal. We had about $18MM in the budget to spend…Reagins decided to spend it all in one place. I thought there was enough money there for at least two players.
Pujols was definitely a special case, but I don’t think Dipoto made any difference at all. I believe that the deal doesn’t get done without Moreno…only Moreno.
Agreed
The Angels offered Wilson
° A pitcher-friendly park (especially night games with the marine layer)
° A chance to play close to his roots
° A chance to go back to the Series, after seeing Pujols sign, and understanding that Moreno is in it to win it this year and beyond.
I could have been the GM with those preconditions and Wilson would have signed, as long as the money was in the right neighborhood.
"Outside of a dog, a book is man's best friend. Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read" ~Groucho Marx
by George Kaplan on Feb 8, 2012 5:23 PM PST up reply actions
That's what I believe:
I could have been the GM with those preconditions and Wilson would have signed, as long as the money was in the right neighborhood.
My opinion:
It’s not the VWells trade (including his contract) that cost Reagins his job.
It’s the fact that VWells did not perform up to expectations.
Wells
Considering Napoli’s fantastic year and that Wells makes $20+ million a year… Wells would have needed to have a 10+WAR year in 2011 and continue this pace for the trade to be declared a draw.
The logic, negotiation and reason behind the Wells trade cost Reagins his job. It was an historic epic FAIL on all accounts.
by YouthofToday on Feb 10, 2012 11:07 PM PST up reply actions
These Fanposts ^^^
are the reason I wanna kill myself
Kendrys wins 2012 AL Comeback Player of the year
And this is why you shouldn't
"I have something 95 percent of all those All-Stars only wish they had: a World Series ring. If I had to choose between that and being an All-Star, it would be no contest. I’d grab the gold ring and never look back." -Tim Salmon
by BruinHalo on Feb 7, 2012 12:15 PM PST up reply actions 6 recs
Wow, Albert looks pissed off about this trade proposal, too.
The only thing VW did differently last year than the year before, besides inflate his stats by playing half his games in Toronto, is buy into the Scioscia/Hatcher philosophy that a walk is as good as an out. 2011: .218/.248/.412. 2010(road stats): .224/.299/.400.
He should be
“You want to trade the dreamy speed demon who is going to be 1/4 of my annual RBI count? WTF, mang?!”
Scioscialist Party of America - Redistributing your defense since 2000.
by Commander_Nate on Feb 7, 2012 1:39 PM PST up reply actions 3 recs
Just read this article cougwilly
http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/bourjos-for-lannan-surely-you-jest/
Kendrys wins 2012 AL Comeback Player of the year
Loved the closing-
This Lannan for Bourjos thing, though? Even if they put Drew Storen and a couple of prospects in the deal, it should still be an automatic no. Bourjos is good, young, and cheap – Lannan is none of those things, and it’s not even clear that he’s obviously better than current fifth starter Jerome Williams. There might be industry speculation about that kind of swap, but it’s not speculation that should be taken overly seriously.
by Balls and Strikes on Feb 7, 2012 12:59 PM PST up reply actions
Wow
Even if the Nationals gave the Angels a solid closer(43 Sv in 48 Opp., 2.75 ERA, 74 SO in 75.1 inn) and prospects for Bourjos the answer is an automatic no.
Not the point
The article just covers why Bourjos totally kicks ass!
Kendrys wins 2012 AL Comeback Player of the year
This is why i hate freedom of the press
Forget Tebow
Andy Lee is the second coming of Jesus
-ME
by DAD OF VLAD on Feb 7, 2012 12:26 PM PST reply actions 1 recs
So you are really "Dad of Vlad Putin" ?
"When my mother was pregnant with me, they did an ultrasound and found she was having twins. When they did another ultrasound a few weeks later, they discovered that I had adsorbed the other fetus. Do I regret this? No, I believe his tissue has made me stronger. I now have the strength of a grown man and a little baby."
I just think that some people overlook Bourjos
because he’s only been on the team for one full year and I understand that but let’s give him some more time to show us what he’s got before shipping him off to Washington or even worse the Mets. It’s not often you see player who can do the things that Bourjos does on the field
Kendrys wins 2012 AL Comeback Player of the year
How about NO, you Crazy Dutch Bastard?
If the Halos don't care about the way they play, then why should I?
by red floyd on Feb 7, 2012 12:41 PM PST reply actions 4 recs
My thoughts exactly
Bourjos is a game changer. Replace Nelson Cruz with Bourjos and there is no Gulf, the turd stompers are W.S. Champions. Bourjos makes plays on a daily basis that others in his position can’t.
CONGER, CONGER, CONGER !!!
cheese n rice, leave Bourjos alone
"You realize that Ive been posting on AN since 07 on this name and I am one of the most rec'ed posters there right?" - Some tool named Designatedforassignment from Athletics Nation
I see nothing LEGIT about this trade proposal.
The Angels are in no way desperate for pitching to trade away a valuable and cheap player like Bourjos.
"One time, when we got back to the locker room, all of our clothes were gone," Trout recalled. "They left me a Lady Gaga costume and I had to wear it."
Tomorrow, I predict someone will suggest trading Bourjos for a soft taco supreme from Taco Bell
It’s the next logical step in this process.
Scioscialist Party of America - Redistributing your defense since 2000.
Reagins is gone
this team no longer trades in mexican fast food
"You realize that Ive been posting on AN since 07 on this name and I am one of the most rec'ed posters there right?" - Some tool named Designatedforassignment from Athletics Nation
by 2pintsofbooze on Feb 7, 2012 2:28 PM PST up reply actions
btw CommNate
set up my brew station, so I’m ready to start brewin. I have no clue what I’m doing though, so should be interesting. just waiting for some free time on the weekend to do it up. any tips you can give a newcomer would be appreciated.
"You realize that Ive been posting on AN since 07 on this name and I am one of the most rec'ed posters there right?" - Some tool named Designatedforassignment from Athletics Nation
by 2pintsofbooze on Feb 7, 2012 2:30 PM PST up reply actions
Sanitize the hell out of everything, always
That place should have given you instructions which are pretty thorough, just make sure to follow them.
Other tips: Keep the fermenter and bottles out of sunlight while they are fermenting/carbonating. Watch for boilover during your boil as this can happen very quickly and is a massive pain to clean off of the stove. You can skim some of what looks like foam off the top of your boil and dump it into a bowl or whatever (it’s not really foam, but protein crud, and getting rid of it will help reduce sediment in your final product, I’ve found). Lastly, if you get a crazy fermentation that starts bubbling through your airlock, attach some plastic tubing to it and leave the end of it submerged in a bowl or bucket with some water/sanitizer mixed together. This is called a blowoff tube and will hopefully save you from having to clean up a stinky mess. Once it calms back down, go back to using the airlock.
Scioscialist Party of America - Redistributing your defense since 2000.
by Commander_Nate on Feb 7, 2012 3:27 PM PST up reply actions
Also, buy some hop socks
Any brew shop will probably have them and they shouldn’t be more than $1 at most. They will also cut down on sediment.
Scioscialist Party of America - Redistributing your defense since 2000.
by Commander_Nate on Feb 7, 2012 3:38 PM PST up reply actions
good tips, thanks man
those all seem like things that are good to anticipate as opposed to it just happening and me not knowing what the hell to do.
I’m assuming a hop sock something you keep the hops in during the boiling process?
"You realize that Ive been posting on AN since 07 on this name and I am one of the most rec'ed posters there right?" - Some tool named Designatedforassignment from Athletics Nation
by 2pintsofbooze on Feb 7, 2012 3:42 PM PST up reply actions
Yep - it's just a mesh bag that you tie to the side
You can just throw the hop pellets in, but for a clearer, snack-free beer it’s better to contain them somehow.
All of those things happened to me at least once (boilover very first time, for example), so I figured I’d pass along the experience.
Scioscialist Party of America - Redistributing your defense since 2000.
by Commander_Nate on Feb 7, 2012 4:36 PM PST up reply actions
those were exactly the kind of tips I was looking for
thanks again brudda
"You realize that Ive been posting on AN since 07 on this name and I am one of the most rec'ed posters there right?" - Some tool named Designatedforassignment from Athletics Nation
by 2pintsofbooze on Feb 7, 2012 4:37 PM PST up reply actions
Fo sho
Scioscialist Party of America - Redistributing your defense since 2000.
by Commander_Nate on Feb 7, 2012 4:40 PM PST up reply actions
Oooh, thanks for the tip on the protein crud and hop socks.
My second batch ever is fermenting right now, and the jug looks like a cross-section of the earth’s crust…
"And that’s why to hell with the traffic, Diane, we’re staying until the end of the game, and that’s final." ~brokenyard, 8/18/11
you're brewing too???
a woman after my own heart
"You realize that Ive been posting on AN since 07 on this name and I am one of the most rec'ed posters there right?" - Some tool named Designatedforassignment from Athletics Nation
by 2pintsofbooze on Feb 9, 2012 3:45 PM PST up reply actions
Heh
It’s a natural byproduct, so there’s always going to be some, even in certain microbreweries depending on how “organic” they want to be. Once you get more familiar with the process, especially bottling, it’s easier to manage.
Scioscialist Party of America - Redistributing your defense since 2000.
by Commander_Nate on Feb 10, 2012 2:15 PM PST up reply actions
are you bottling it?
if so make sure to hell you sanitize the bottles. And as Nate said keep the brew in a dark place, but also make sure its not too hot or cold
When I flip a coin I dont say heads or tails, I say Halos or Spurs
by ItCouldHappen on Feb 7, 2012 3:42 PM PST up reply actions
was planning on bottling, depends on if it tastes like shit or not though
it’ll ferment in my garage, so can’t really help the temp too much. but I’ll do what I can.
thanks
"You realize that Ive been posting on AN since 07 on this name and I am one of the most rec'ed posters there right?" - Some tool named Designatedforassignment from Athletics Nation
by 2pintsofbooze on Feb 7, 2012 3:45 PM PST up reply actions
Bottling can taste fine
Thats how me and my buddies do it. its not that hard just make sure that you put the bottles in boiling water to completely sanitize them.
When I flip a coin I dont say heads or tails, I say Halos or Spurs
by ItCouldHappen on Feb 7, 2012 3:53 PM PST up reply actions
thanks for the tip
’preciate it
"You realize that Ive been posting on AN since 07 on this name and I am one of the most rec'ed posters there right?" - Some tool named Designatedforassignment from Athletics Nation
by 2pintsofbooze on Feb 7, 2012 3:57 PM PST up reply actions
my pleasure
Good luck. I cant wait till I settle down enough to brew again, last time I did it was college when I had time, energy and an unquenchable thirst for beer, now I only have one of those
When I flip a coin I dont say heads or tails, I say Halos or Spurs
by ItCouldHappen on Feb 7, 2012 4:06 PM PST up reply actions
So-Cal is moderate enough not be too big of an issue for ales
Lagers ferment cold, which is part of the reason I haven’t tried one.
Scioscialist Party of America - Redistributing your defense since 2000.
by Commander_Nate on Feb 7, 2012 4:40 PM PST up reply actions
yeah we had a shitty heating system in the house we rented in mass
different rooms were used for different brews. I was the lager room
When I flip a coin I dont say heads or tails, I say Halos or Spurs
by ItCouldHappen on Feb 7, 2012 4:51 PM PST up reply actions
hmmm, winter is coming...
"You realize that Ive been posting on AN since 07 on this name and I am one of the most rec'ed posters there right?" - Some tool named Designatedforassignment from Athletics Nation
by 2pintsofbooze on Feb 7, 2012 4:52 PM PST up reply actions
On a side note
don’t make any of your kids go through the IB Program
Kendrys wins 2012 AL Comeback Player of the year
Speaking from experience
as i went through the IB program in high school myself, yea it sucked! Definitely not worth it.
I graduated with a Full IB diploma
Did nothing for me.
"I have something 95 percent of all those All-Stars only wish they had: a World Series ring. If I had to choose between that and being an All-Star, it would be no contest. I’d grab the gold ring and never look back." -Tim Salmon
I got out summer before my senior year......
got a full ride to a private school in mass…. no complaints….. suck it Sonora
When I flip a coin I dont say heads or tails, I say Halos or Spurs
by ItCouldHappen on Feb 10, 2012 3:17 PM PST up reply actions
I like our damn team the way it is right now,
although I’d love to hear a solid positive update on Morales.
Official prediction: The Angels will win the AL west this season.
Leave Bourjos alone!
"Outside of a dog, a book is man's best friend. Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read" ~Groucho Marx
by George Kaplan on Feb 7, 2012 8:01 PM PST reply actions 3 recs
You sob!
I just spent 10 minutes making this, then I noticed you beat me to it! Ha ha! Yours is better though, with the three images in one.
Where were you on December 8th, 2011 - Pujols Day?
by Rally Manatee on Feb 10, 2012 10:34 AM PST up reply actions
Angels can get more
I don’t mind selling high on Bourjos, but the team has different needs than Espinosa and Clippard. Clippard has had a nice run, but is not a great bet to keep it up. A lot of relievers have stretches like he does in their careers only to lose it entirely shortly after. He’s risky. As for Espinosa, I just don’t see him being that much better than Aybar to justify trading Bourjos.
If we are going to trade Bourjos, it needs to be for top flight prospects that fill our gaps in organizational depth (starting pitching/bullpen), a superstar third baseman, or a great third baseman and a top-flight prospect.
Bourjos is one of four position players
Who should not be traded. The others are #5, #27, and #47. What we do with the rest can be debated. Those four guys should stay Halos because they are the core of our lineup going forward.
by Brody on Feb 8, 2012 6:47 AM PST via mobile reply actions
I'm not good at matching players to numbers.
Is Vernon Wells #5, #27 or #47? If so, strike that one from your list.
The only thing VW did differently last year than the year before, besides inflate his stats by playing half his games in Toronto, is buy into the Scioscia/Hatcher philosophy that a walk is as good as an out. 2011: .218/.248/.412. 2010(road stats): .224/.299/.400.
When does the title of this fanpost get changed to
Bama Bama Bama Bama Bama Bama
Never Trade Bourjos
I’ve been watching baseball closely for over 30 years and the Angels have never had a player like Bourjos. His range alone makes him a defensive superstar. He’s decent with the bat and a menace on the bases. He seems to be a total team player and in time he will be financially rewarded for his abilities. Lastly, I do not want to see him traded while we’ve still got him at a discount for four more years.
All great teams are primarily farm system developed. Even the Yankees can point to Jeter, Cano, Posada, Rivera, and Soriano for their rings. I expect(hope) Bourjos and Trout play for the Angels as Pujols’ Partners in Crime for all 10 years of his contract.
is that 4000 games?
When I flip a coin I dont say heads or tails, I say Halos or Spurs
by ItCouldHappen on Feb 8, 2012 11:34 PM PST up reply actions
8,000
When you count both eyeballs.
"And that’s why to hell with the traffic, Diane, we’re staying until the end of the game, and that’s final." ~brokenyard, 8/18/11
Sandy Duncan has one glass eye
By your math she’d only be half an Angel fan compared to others?
Never had a player like Bourjos?
- Comp on Baseball Reference:
Say hello to Devon White
PJ@age24: 147G, .271/.327/.438, 22SB, 3.6/1.4/5.0 (oWAR/dWAR/total)
DW@age24: 159G, .263/.306/.443, 32SB, 2.2/2.8/5.0 (oWAR/dWAR/total)
"I have something 95 percent of all those All-Stars only wish they had: a World Series ring. If I had to choose between that and being an All-Star, it would be no contest. I’d grab the gold ring and never look back." -Tim Salmon
alcor805 never said his 30 years of closely watching baseball included 1985 through 1990.
The only thing VW did differently last year than the year before, besides inflate his stats by playing half his games in Toronto, is buy into the Scioscia/Hatcher philosophy that a walk is as good as an out. 2011: .218/.248/.412. 2010(road stats): .224/.299/.400.
Ha!
Devon White was a cancer in the Angels clubhouse. I’m not going to get into detail but he was really trying hard to be like Darryl Strawberry – and I don’t mean by hitting HRs.
Devo may have won rings in Toronto but he was only blowing them while he was on the Angels.
Again, I’m not going to get into detail. But Devo might have looked fine on the field but he was literally flying around the bases as he was running them.
Throw in Granderson and we got ourselves a deal!!!
well, actually still no…
12/8/11!!! What a day!
by stuck in Romania on Feb 9, 2012 5:42 PM PST reply actions
The Angels are a top tier team right now
Top tier teams don’t usually trade off their young, talented, cheap players. I suspect you have an ulterior. Could it be that you have a boner for Mike Trout?
Where were you on December 8th, 2011 - Pujols Day?
I heard boners were funny?
"When my mother was pregnant with me, they did an ultrasound and found she was having twins. When they did another ultrasound a few weeks later, they discovered that I had adsorbed the other fetus. Do I regret this? No, I believe his tissue has made me stronger. I now have the strength of a grown man and a little baby."
by mustard_man on Feb 10, 2012 11:11 AM PST up reply actions
Hilarious, not funny.
LOL BAH.
The only thing VW did differently last year than the year before, besides inflate his stats by playing half his games in Toronto, is buy into the Scioscia/Hatcher philosophy that a walk is as good as an out. 2011: .218/.248/.412. 2010(road stats): .224/.299/.400.
Thanks for clarifying!!!
"When my mother was pregnant with me, they did an ultrasound and found she was having twins. When they did another ultrasound a few weeks later, they discovered that I had adsorbed the other fetus. Do I regret this? No, I believe his tissue has made me stronger. I now have the strength of a grown man and a little baby."
I think if Lannan hadn't of married Yoko,
the history of Rock and would be entirely different. He’d still be writing hits with Sir Paul and we wouldn’t be suffering through Ringo’s All-Stars.
Bitch
Oh, and I think it would be insanity to trade Peter the Great.
Well, come see a fat old man some time!
I think if Lannan hadn't of married Yoko,
the history of Rock and would be entirely different. He’d still be writing hits with Sir Paul and we wouldn’t be suffering through Ringo’s All-Stars.
Bitch
Oh, and I think it would be insanity to trade Peter the Great.
Well, come see a fat old man some time!
Come on... this one's LEGIT!!! It says so in the title!!!
If the Halos don't care about the way they play, then why should I?
PERFECT EXCELLENT AWESOME Nationals Trade Proposal
Tony Reagins, special assistant to chairman Kuhl for 3 members of the Nats grounds crew and a janitor to be named later
"id take 5th Dimention Wormhole Rivera over Wells any day of the week"
-clover_black
by the king of CERA on Feb 12, 2012 7:13 PM PST reply actions
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